You said "See, even the disks has DLC now" when Rusty_Gunn posted 2 pictures the first picture of Shivering Isles says expansion pack for Oblivion 2006 Game of the Year. Which I also own as a physical boxed version of the PC version of Shivering Isles.

The second picture of Knights of the Nine says Oblivion DownLoadable Content which is for Knights of the Nine only which is a DLC and also comes with 8 other DLC's and does not include Shivering Isles.

Personal opinion.

Broken games. Bad, should be dealt with like War-Z at one point I think. Actually broken games only though, not buggy games like.. almost every game ever.

Crappy games. Not bad. One man's crappy game is a good few hours of fun for someone else. Someone like TB being all 'Wtf' about hidden object games being sold on Steam is therefor ridiculous imo. If someone wants to buy it, then why shouldn't it be sold? I don't need a digital store, nor a youtuber to tell me what kind of games I can buy, I can decide that for myself. Imo, the more choice the better. (granted, the store needs to keep up proper ways of sifting through it)

That's sort of the way Steam's been going. According to their Dev Days they've nearly doubled the amount of games they *could* add to the store in the last year or two (since greenlight, which they already admitted was a failure). That's the reason so many games are added now, because they can. I'm not particularly surprised bad apples are getting through in that situation, especially with the current influx still being relatively new to Steam.

There are a few types of bankruptcy. A common one for businesses (in the States) is called Chapter 11. The court will protect the company from creditors (to an extent) while it reorganizes itself. General Motors has been bankrupt in the recent past. Rolls Royce has also been bankrupt, and chances are fair that if you've flown on a large commercial jet recently, it was using Rolls Royce engines. So bankruptcy often means "give us a break while we get our shit together", and typically results in many changes in policy.

edit:
I meant to say also: So it doesn't necessarily mean that a company is finished.

I know what bankruptcy is. No need to explain it to me. As you said Chapter 11. That's what I want to happen to VALVe. I mean I want gog.com to get bigger than Steam so VALVe can reorganize themselves and VALVe will probably only do that if they start not earning any more money.

That's how I interpreted what you said earlier. We're in the same boat, here.

I was responding to Elmofongo.

and maybe not rip things out of context? I can also repeat myself, though:

"And that is because it was on CD, not DownLoadable (the DL part of DLC...)

Here is the digital version from Bethesda, called DLC's - http://www.elderscrolls.com/oblivion/dlc/

Edit - by the way, the second picture you provide as evidence says "Oblivion Downloadable Content Collection" and what is the abbreviation for Downloadable Content? :)"

and the thing you ripped out was a joke reply to his reply to that post. He posted those two pictures as evidence that they where not called DLC's, but then one of them did call it a DLC. See? And the joke was that it was from a disk even...

I only partially agree with the "stupid people" part. Sure, it baffles me time and again how stupid people can be. I am emphasising the "The whole -Boykott MW2- steamgroup is playing MW2" kind of stupidity here, which is the reason why we have exzessive DRM etc nowadys.

But it surely helps when a big publisher and distribution plattform like Valve/Steam are advertising crappy games. Or when gaming magazines or huge gaming hubs are lying right into your face. Today I honestly find it hard to make a decision whether to buy a game or not only by official reviews etc only, I think at least watching some Let´s Plays and inofficial reviews by gamers is advised. And someone a bit more trustful might fall for a bad product when it is advertised on Steam, maybe even by creating the impression it is especially featured.

Whoa, hold on there for a second. I never said that Kickstarter and Early Access are the same thing or even similar models. Please, read my post carefully. What i said is that both Kickstarter and Early Access offer more freedom to developers than a publisher ever would. And that is true.

By the way: https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/strawman
It's not "my definition", it's the definition set by the modern gaming industry. That's objective, not subjective. The problem is that your "own" definition is not accepted by anyone but yourself. That's the problem. I could call my dog a "horse", but it wouldn't change the fact that it's still a dog, not a horse. The gaming industry has fully embraced the expression "DLC" to refer to whatever content gets added to the base game later on, be it an useless skin or a new campaign that adds hours upon hours of gameplay. The expression "expansion pack" is not used anymore, everything that could have benn called an "expansion pack" in the past is called DLC now.

Fair enuf. Apologies.

Actually its not strictly true. I could be wrong bu the Xcom expansion (and i think Civ 5 Gods and Kings and BNW as well) and i forgot which other one were both mentioned as *expansion packs* in various media
There are various Kickstarter projects which will have *expansion packs* including Pillars of Eternity etc which are referred to as actual expansions and not DLC.

True. But if you go to Steam or any other digital store these "expansions" are called DLCs and are under the "DLC" category. If you download and install these "expansions" you won't get a new tab, instead it will be shown on the "DLC" tab.

For example:
http://store.steampowered.com/app/235580/
http://store.steampowered.com/dlc/8930/

Thats a Steam thing though. Its pretty rare for an actual genuine proper expansion to be released these days so maybe they couldn't be bothered adding an extra category?. i guess regardless many these days would just call it DLC (and grow up not knowing any better)--- but many of us old timer gamers known what is and what is an actual genuine expansion ...just wish the game companies would do more of :)

Well, there's still the habit of creating these semi-sequels and to call those "stand-alone" expansions (like the expansion packs for Dawn of War 2). They are fully independent entries in the stores and you will find "expansion" or "addon" in their descriptions.

And as Niggles stated, I think it's largely about the stores (Steam at least) not wanting to define and maintain separate categories especially since it's hard to define such a thing. Plus a distributor has a slightly different perspective than say a publisher. I mean, Steam distributes stuff digitally, whatever can't be referred to as a game is downloadable content. However, what about the bigger addons that are also available as separate packages in retail? You won't really refer to those as DLC unless it's a bundle of content that was first released exclusively digitally or something, would you? And you say that it's a "fact" that "the industry" refers to all addons as DLC these days but as far as I can tell there's many parties who still refer to their addons/expansions as such. Blizzard, for instance - I don't think Blizzard nor (many) journalists and players are referring to Reaper of Souls or the upcoming Dungeons of Dredmor as DLC. I think also many parties within the industry, including big ones, have a similar approach to the term DLC as many players and would consider its use for some of their products derogatory.

It's not a Steam thing. It's an industry thing. If the word "expansion" was still relevant today they would make a category for it. The fact is that NO digital store label add-on content as expansions (not only Steam), they call them DLCs.

And what exactly is an actual genuine expansion? For me the Borderlands, Fallout and Skyrim DLCs are "proper" expansions, yet they are called DLCs.

The problem is that the word "DLC" got a bad reputation because of the bad examples (like the infamous horse armor for Oblivion). But if you do take a closer look, you will find out that many of these DLCs have just as much content as the expansion packs back in the old days.

To me personally? they have a lot of content -- extends playtime around 8-10 hours (they used to be at least 50% or more additional to base game imho). DLC's to me are things like costumes, cheats, money, missions lasting 1-2 hours - they don't add anything meaningful ....

Blizzard is an exception. It's the only company that still sells add-ons on retail stores. Since DLC stands for Downloadable Content, it would be hard to call Reaper of Souls and Heart of the Swarm DLCs. But which company other than Blizzard still sells add-ons on physical discs?

Look at the Borderlands, Fallout and Skyrim DLCs on Steam. They never mention the word "expansion". And there's no way to deny that these DLCs would have been considered expansion packs back in the day.

Then why are the Borderlands, Fallout and Skyrim DLCs not called expansion packs?

DLC stands for Downloadable Content. It could either be a skin or a completely new campaign.

By the way, if skins, costumes and whatever are DLCs, then is this thing here (http://www.mobygames.com/game/duel-test-drive-ii-car-disk-the-muscle-cars/cover-art/gameCoverId,234269/) a DLC?

Or this: http://www.mobygames.com/game/test-drive-ii-car-disk-the-supercars/cover-art/gameCoverId,68264/