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amok: And you do not get charged for it, you get charged for the full final product, and get to play the alpha/beta versions until it is completed.
If that were true then I should be able to cancel my "pre-order" any time before the final product I'm paying for is actually delivered, but I think we already exposed the lie in that claim.
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amok: And you do not get charged for it, you get charged for the full final product, and get to play the alpha/beta versions until it is completed.
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DarrkPhoenix: If that were true then I should be able to cancel my "pre-order" any time before the final product I'm paying for is actually delivered, but I think we already exposed the lie in that claim.
no, because it is a different model, and you do get parts of the product beforehand. But you do pay for the final product, it is the goal, you just get to test it before it happens also. Maybe "pre-order" is a wrong way of looking at it, and more like patronage?

you do take a punt on a product each time you buy into an alpha/beta and if you personally do not like it, then do not do so. Wait for the product to be completed before you hand over your cash. However, just because you do not like to do so, I see no reason why others who do should somehow not be allowed to.
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amok: And it is up to the players who buy in if they want to report bugs or not, and you are right - people report bugs in all games, Early Access is no exception (except there will probably be more bugs...)

And you do not get charged for it, you get charged for the full final product, and get to play the alpha/beta versions until it is completed.
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Johnathanamz: Anyways VALVe needs to fix the problems with Steam Early Access if a video game developer does not provide a fixed video game before a year is over or something like that their video game needs to get removed from sale from Steam and everyone needs to get a full refund and that video game developer needs to get banned from selling video games on Steam again until they fix their video games.
I do not like to police what people should be allowed to buy or not...
Post edited April 21, 2014 by amok
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DarrkPhoenix: If that were true then I should be able to cancel my "pre-order" any time before the final product I'm paying for is actually delivered, but I think we already exposed the lie in that claim.
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amok: no, because it is a different model, and you do get parts of the product beforehand. But you do pay for the final product, it is the goal, you just get to test it before it happens also. Maybe "pre-order" is a wrong way of looking at it, and more like patronage?

you do take a punt on a product each time you buy into an alpha/beta and if you personally do not like it, then do not do so. Wait for the product to be completed before you hand over your cash. However, just because you do not like to do so, I see no reason why others who do should somehow not be allowed to.
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Johnathanamz: Anyways VALVe needs to fix the problems with Steam Early Access if a video game developer does not provide a fixed video game before a year is over or something like that their video game needs to get removed from sale from Steam and everyone needs to get a full refund and that video game developer needs to get banned from selling video games on Steam again until they fix their video games.
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amok: I do not like to police what people should be allowed to buy or not...
I hope gog.com never adds Gog Early Access or whatever.

It's what makes gog.com better than Steam to me gog.com does not sell DLC's, early access video games, and microtransactions. I hope gog.com never does this.
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Johnathanamz:
GOG sells DLC, and I don't think that's a bad thing to do.
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Johnathanamz:
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cmdr_flashheart: GOG sells DLC, and I don't think that's a bad thing to do.
The only DLC's I saw so far is for Omerta - City of Gangsters. What other video games are they selling DLC's for?

Broken Age has a season pass which gives you all the episodes.
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amok: no, because it is a different model, and you do get parts of the product beforehand. But you do pay for the final product, it is the goal, you just get to test it before it happens also. Maybe "pre-order" is a wrong way of looking at it, and more like patronage?

you do take a punt on a product each time you buy into an alpha/beta and if you personally do not like it, then do not do so. Wait for the product to be completed before you hand over your cash. However, just because you do not like to do so, I see no reason why others who do should somehow not be allowed to.

I do not like to police what people should be allowed to buy or not...
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Johnathanamz: I hope gog.com never adds Gog Early Access or whatever.

It's what makes gog.com better than Steam to me gog.com does not sell DLC's, early access video games, and microtransactions. I hope gog.com never does this.
Er...GOG actually does sell some DLC ie Omerta, SOTS etc....
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DarrkPhoenix: If that were true then I should be able to cancel my "pre-order" any time before the final product I'm paying for is actually delivered, but I think we already exposed the lie in that claim.
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amok: no, because it is a different model, and you do get parts of the product beforehand. But you do pay for the final product, it is the goal, you just get to test it before it happens also. Maybe "pre-order" is a wrong way of looking at it, and more like patronage?

you do take a punt on a product each time you buy into an alpha/beta and if you personally do not like it, then do not do so. Wait for the product to be completed before you hand over your cash. However, just because you do not like to do so, I see no reason why others who do should somehow not be allowed to.
..
The only problem is that for some games there's no end in sight, like Intersteller Marines or Kerbal Space Program. Sure, the players have paid for the final product, but there needs to be some quality control in the form of time limits, or at least your money partially refunded for not meeting time goals.
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Johnathanamz: I hope gog.com never adds Gog Early Access or whatever.

It's what makes gog.com better than Steam to me gog.com does not sell DLC's, early access video games, and microtransactions. I hope gog.com never does this.
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Niggles: Er...GOG actually does sell some DLC ie Omerta, SOTS etc....
Yeah Sword of the Stars to. I prefer expansion packs to be sold.
I'm not against DLC, early access, DRM, microtransactions, macrotransactions or whatever, however...., I'm against scamming people and that is what this is.
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Niggles: Er...GOG actually does sell some DLC ie Omerta, SOTS etc....
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Johnathanamz: Yeah Sword of the Stars to. I prefer expansion packs to be sold.
Don't forget Shadowrun Returns's DLC avaliable here.
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cmdr_flashheart: GOG sells DLC, and I don't think that's a bad thing to do.
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Johnathanamz: The only DLC's I saw so far is for Omerta - City of Gangsters. What other video games are they selling DLC's for?

Broken Age has a season pass which gives you all the episodes.
There's only handful of games like that, atm. You can go through the list, any game with DLC has a grey arrow next to it.

http://www.gog.com/games
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amok: no, because it is a different model, and you do get parts of the product beforehand. But you do pay for the final product, it is the goal, you just get to test it before it happens also. Maybe "pre-order" is a wrong way of looking at it, and more like patronage?

you do take a punt on a product each time you buy into an alpha/beta and if you personally do not like it, then do not do so. Wait for the product to be completed before you hand over your cash. However, just because you do not like to do so, I see no reason why others who do should somehow not be allowed to.
..
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cmdr_flashheart: The only problem is that for some games there's no end in sight, like Intersteller Marines or Kerbal Space Program. Sure, the players have paid for the final product, but there needs to be some quality control in the form of time limits, or at least your money partially refunded for not meeting time goals.
yeah, but take Kerbal for example, even if it is never being completed - players have sunk hundreds of hours into it so far, and more or less the majority enjoyed the experience so far. If it is never completed, what is the difference in having spent a hundred hours in an alpha and spent hundred hours in a final build? and is it not just right to pay someone who made the product you have enjoyed? Have those player who enjoyed the game.... not done so?
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Johnathanamz: Yeah Sword of the Stars to. I prefer expansion packs to be sold.
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Elmofongo: Don't forget Shadowrun Returns's DLC avaliable here.
I believe Shadowrun's Dragonfall DLC is actually a expansion pack from what I read on the internet.
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cmdr_flashheart: The only problem is that for some games there's no end in sight, like Intersteller Marines or Kerbal Space Program. Sure, the players have paid for the final product, but there needs to be some quality control in the form of time limits, or at least your money partially refunded for not meeting time goals.
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amok: yeah, but take Kerbal for example, even if it is never being completed - players have sunk hundreds of hours into it so far, and more or less the majority enjoyed the experience so far. If it is never completed, what is the difference in having spent a hundred hours in an alpha and spent hundred hours in a final build? and is it not just right to pay someone who made the product you have enjoyed? Have those player who enjoyed the game.... not done so?
The difference is that players paid full price for the final product, and as such they are entitled to the final product, as per the transaction. I don't care about subjective parameters of enjoyment where money is concerned- if you paid for X, then you should get X, not Y or Z.
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amok: no, because it is a different model, and you do get parts of the product beforehand. But you do pay for the final product, it is the goal, you just get to test it before it happens also. Maybe "pre-order" is a wrong way of looking at it, and more like patronage?

you do take a punt on a product each time you buy into an alpha/beta and if you personally do not like it, then do not do so. Wait for the product to be completed before you hand over your cash. However, just because you do not like to do so, I see no reason why others who do should somehow not be allowed to.

I do not like to police what people should be allowed to buy or not...
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Johnathanamz: I hope gog.com never adds Gog Early Access or whatever.
Which is gOg's loss only, and the other stores get that custom. I am store agnostic, so I really do not care.

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Johnathanamz: It's what makes gog.com better than Steam to me gog.com does not sell DLC's, early access video games, and microtransactions. I hope gog.com never does this.
To be honest, I like DLC's. A lot of them are rubbish and pointless, so if I have the option of not getting them, or a choice on what I want to add to the game, then it is a plus for me. I prefer not paying for some extra skins, so if that is all then I get the base game only,
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amok: yeah, but take Kerbal for example, even if it is never being completed - players have sunk hundreds of hours into it so far, and more or less the majority enjoyed the experience so far. If it is never completed, what is the difference in having spent a hundred hours in an alpha and spent hundred hours in a final build? and is it not just right to pay someone who made the product you have enjoyed? Have those player who enjoyed the game.... not done so?
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cmdr_flashheart: The difference is that players paid full price for the final product, and as such they are entitled to the final product, as per the transaction. I don't care about subjective parameters of enjoyment where money is concerned- if you paid for X, then you should get X, not Y or Z.
Most alphas and betas are sold for a lower price than the final product.
Post edited April 21, 2014 by amok