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Having created a MDP that ascended, in all 3 endings (I had a blast until Ascension Peak), I have noticed some flaws. The Bard and Gadgeteer were great, up until Ascension Peak, where they really started to show their mediocrity. They were stamina-casting sometimes at level 3 and 4, not doing anything but wasting stamina (granted, they succeeded sometimes, but it wasn't consistent). Also, keeping the Psionic and Mage alive was a constant challenge (worst hit points and armor in the game).

Therefore, I have created a more balanced approach (actually using Bishops properly, unlike the last time):

All-Human party, to max out on total attribute points. Also, 3 males (Fighter, Rogue, Ranger), and 3 females (Valkyrie, and both Bishops).

1. Fighter up front. Dual Weapons, Sword, Mace and Flail (going for a *Light Sword*/Diamond Eyes). I want to maximize his Berserking potential by dual wielding, instead of using a polearm (he doesn't need a shield either, with the highest hit points in the game, and the best armor selection).

2. Rogue up front. Dual Weapons, Sword, Dagger. Using cursed Bloodlust/Thieves' Dagger in Arnika for a while, until he can get an uncursed *Light Sword* and Stiletto later on. He will work on Locks and Traps (he gets a bonus to this), and Stealth (passing most of the front damage onto the Fighter, who can take it).

3. Valkyrie on one flank. Polearms (she gets a bonus to this, why use any other weapon class?). She can hit from extended range, and doesn't need a shield, as she can cheat death. She will work on Mythology, as she has less weapon skills to focus on.

4. Ranger on the other flank. His melee capability is mediocre, compared to the others; However, I feel that it's better overall to have him focus on Polearms, as he, just like the Valkyrie, can hit enemies in front of the party, and on his own flank. He will work on Scouting (removing the need to constantly cast Detect Secrets, unlike my last party).

These 4 characters will have Bows and Crossbows for range (thankfully, the same weapon skill). Also, they will follow my non-caster template of: Strength and Dexterity first, followed by Speed and Senses.

5. Bishop in the middle. Quarterstaff, to train for the Staff of Doom (Cat O' Nine Tails and Vampire Chain sucked last game). She will focus on Artifacts (she gets a 25% bonus), Divinity, and Wizardry. She picked Heal Wounds and Energy Blast at creation.

6. Other Bishop in the middle. Same thing, Quarterstaff, to train for another Staff of Doom (I will have to farm a Rapax Corpse). She will focus on Communication, Alchemy, and Psionics. She picked Heal Wounds and Mind Stab at creation.

These two Bishops will be using slings for range, as it's their only ranged combat skill. Also, they will max Intelligence and Speed first, then Strength and Senses.
Post edited September 17, 2023 by RChu1982
On the other hand, I'm going with an MDP right now. 2 Bishops (one front line), Priest, Psionic, Alchemist, and Valkyrie. Everyone going for Power Cast, with the Psionic being 1 level away from it and Eagle Eye.

So, in Trynton. Reached Fuzzfas now, got Missile Shield for the elf Bishop (who is using no spell picks; I've modded the game to make Mind Stab and Holy Water buyable), and will soon be ready to progress to more areas. I'm not going to explore more of Trynton yet, but will instead try to explore other areas, like:
* Swamp. Go to Crock, maybe buy some shields and/or slings. (Spell selection still limited at my level of 8; no 4th level spells yet.)
* Marten's Bluff. Join T'Rang, get access to Sadok for Stun Rod and more spellbooks.
* Get Mindblast Rod (for Psionic), for Nuclear Blast capability.
* Warp to Umpani Base Camp, get flag.
* Do remainder of T'Rang Quests, get tons of XP. Maybe level up? (Could maybe revisit Crock for level 4 spellbooks.)
* Now join Umpani, get access to remaining low level spellbooks.

Or at least that's the plan.

I've been selling arrows, but will keep stones for my Alchemist and Psionic to use.

Psionic will get Power Cast and Eagle Eye in one level.
The other thread is dead, almost two years old, and 20 pages long. Way to go, dtgreene and myself!
With that thread retired, it's time to focus on a new thread. A new party. Very powerful. I will work on it tomorrow, having already created it.

To your point:

Like I said, like I did, just hit the Trynton Well to get the +5 to Intelligence, visit Fuzzfas, then retreat to the Swamp (visiting Crock), and later Sadok. You will have plenty of spellbooks available, and if you want to combat-run past the T'Rang guarding the T'Rangporter, be my guest. You will be in the UBC, able to get your Bishops more spellbooks from Kunar.
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RChu1982: The other thread is dead, almost two years old, and 20 pages long. Way to go, dtgreene and myself!
With that thread retired, it's time to focus on a new thread. A new party. Very powerful. I will work on it tomorrow, having already created it.

To your point:

Like I said, like I did, just hit the Trynton Well to get the +5 to Intelligence, visit Fuzzfas, then retreat to the Swamp (visiting Crock), and later Sadok. You will have plenty of spellbooks available, and if you want to combat-run past the T'Rang guarding the T'Rangporter, be my guest. You will be in the UBC, able to get your Bishops more spellbooks from Kunar.
And I also have a way to go from UBC to Marten's Bluff. (In the UBC bar, go out of bounds, then carefully go through the wall until you can just walk to the teleporter. Note that this is a normal area transition, so you can't force conscious RPCs through here.)

Have you fought Gregor yet?

Meanwhile, I'm also planning my Wizardry 1 party. Probably start with two Fighters (maybe replace 1 with a Samurai), two Priests (class change them once they get 6th level spells) a Thief (only good for traps in 1; useless in combat), and a Mage (offensive magic is *really* powerful in Wizardry 1 once you get group-hitting spells, at least until you have to deal with magic resistance). Probably go for evil alignment because of better equipment.

Have you played any of the other Wizardry games?
This forum should have really been split between W8 and the other Wizardries.
No, I started with W8. Everything else is foreign to me.

"Have I fought Gregor yet?". NO. I just created my party.
Level 2:
Book of Stamina found, gave it to one Bishop. Frost and Acid Splash picked at level up.
I explored the Lower Monastery, up until the King Crab battle. Those two cells near the horseshoe allow your party to rest safely, though I only did it a few times to restore my extremely limited mana. I wanted to take advantage of being level 1, as most enemies will spawn at the same level as you (there are a few rare level 2 enemies, but the 1 level difference really doesn't matter).
I skipped the higher level, set encounters: The Pagoda near the beginning, and the 2 level 3 Noxious Slimes guarding a Book of Light, and a treasure chest. They will be dealt with later.
Currently level 8, with some characters very close to level 9 (my Psionic will get 2 expert skills at that level).

Went past Crock (bought 3 double shot slinks; Valkyrie has a sling now) and a few accessories from Crock. From Sadok, bought a Stun Rod.

Valkyrie still doesn't have her second attack, even if I give her both Ankhs of Speed.

The Amulet of Healing should help my front line bishop survive.

Had to give worse armor to my Vakkyrie so she could carry 100 stones without being oveloaded.

Elf bishop has 37 Divine Magic; she's gotten really good at Magic Missile. Also, 60 Alchemy from mixing potions.
Also, I will be holding off on level-ups, until the Bishops catch up (I don't need them being under-leveled, compared to the enemy).

To your point:

You should rest with Crock; He has a lot of items, especially Amulets of Healing, many spellbooks, and a few good bows, slings, and ammo. Why didn't you get Wrist Rockets? Maybe, you figured that the Doubleshot Sling's extra shot made up for it?
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RChu1982: Also, I will be holding off on level-ups, until the Bishops catch up (I don't need them being under-leveled, compared to the enemy).

To your point:

You should rest with Crock; He has a lot of items, especially Amulets of Healing, many spellbooks, and a few good bows, slings, and ammo. Why didn't you get Wrist Rockets? Maybe, you figured that the Doubleshot Sling's extra shot made up for it?
There's very few spellbooks available at my current level. It's not until level 11 that he starts selling level 4 spells.

My reason for not using Wrist Rockets is that my reason for using slings is not for the extra damage or status effect, but rather for skill increases that will make bombs less likely to backfire should I use them. In particular, I can see Ice Bombs being useful to speed up Rapax fights later. I note that Psionic and Valkyrie are lacking radius attacks. (So is the Priest, but she's using a whip as her alternate weapon, anyway.)

Then again, I might want some Ego Whip scrolls for my Alchemist, to deal with Rapax that cast Element Shield. I could see it also being useful for my Priest and Valkyrie.
Bishop with anything less than 4 schools isnt really what i would call "epic"
Level 3:
Fought a couple of set battles against 2 level 3 Noxious Slimes (they are tough at level 2, when everybody sucks at everything). Opened the treasure chest in the slime room (got a Light Crossbow, something you can't buy from Burz, which I gave to my Fighter). Accessed the dead-end room with the Book of Light, which I gave to the other Bishop who didn't get the book of Stamina.
After that, I took a nap to restore mana, and I had non-stop battles from there, in that big room with the barred gate to King Crab's room. I easily got to level 3 (the Bishops picked Bless and Itching Skin).
I'm really noticing a difference between Bishops and specialist casters. The Bishops really suck at magic at the beginning (I had several fizzles and backfires), but they will be better in the long run. They can't learn any level 2 spells at this level, so they will be behind the curve, having to be carried by the tougher team members for a while.
Also, yes, they will be EPIC once they master their first two spellbooks each, and can work on the other two ignored spellbooks. No need for Piety with them, with a huge mana pool.
Level 4:
I fought the set, level 2 Softshell Crabs battle, near where my ship crashed, to access the pagoda. From there, I grabbed the items, then rested. I made the journey to one of the cells, near the horseshoe, near the King Crab, where it was safe to rest.
Both Bishops picked Sleep, because neither was ready for level 2 spells. I will have to baby the two Bishops, until they become EPIC.
King Crab battle tomorrow!
Post edited September 19, 2023 by RChu1982
Not quite leveled up yet, thanks to the Bishops and their slow leveling (everybody levels up together). Thankfully, this also gives the Bishops a chance to practice their skills. There will be no Quarterstaff or Sling training with them, as they *really* need to focus on their magic skills.
Fought the King Crab, he went down easily (level 2, with a lot of hit points). Two characters now have Light Crossbows, two have Short Bows, and two have Slings, allowing me to more evenly distribute ammo among them. I also un-barred the gate to the King Crab room.
I grabbed the chest in the isolated room near the bridge above the river, then swam the river, defeating the Tanika Fish easily. Not everyone knows this, but there are two hidden items on the shelf above the waterfall, however, my Ranger's Scouting skill wasn't good enough to detect these items (I am putting 3 points each level up into Scouting). I dropped down the waterfall, making sure to hold back to avoid fall damage, and grabbed the Resurrection Potions midway down the waterfall.
Coming back into the Monastery the second time, I re-entered the King Crab room easily (thanks to the un-barred gate), and this time took the elevator up to the top level, where there is a dead end (Wheel Key needed here).
I traded with the first NPC in the game, Burz (no need to talk to everybody about everything, I have tribal knowledge between games). The Bishop working on Communication got a skill increase, I made sure of that. I made sure to sell off my identified junk (keeping unidentified items until later, when I can ID them, and sell them for more money). I made sure to buy all of Burz's best weapons and armor (which is a ridiculous amount of resting 24 hours, this is probably my biggest gripe with this game). Thankfully, at least the Bishops can wear decent armor (unlike the Psionic and Mage from last game).
Unfortunately, the Bishop doing Alchemy and Psionics hasn't gotten 15 skill in either, so I will fight a few more battles until she does (she isn't ready for a level up now, but even if she is, I can grind these skills until she is). Any extra experience will add to the next level up.
Had one fight where I reloaded after a death. It involved a lot of higardi and 2 cultists. I killed all the higardi (the Mindblast Rod helped), only to have my elven bishop die to fireballs. Crock hasn't sold an Amulet of Life yet, so I reloaded.

Still level 8, but I did the T'Rang questline, up to (but not including) the final one. Hence, everyone but the bishops qualifies for level 11, and the human bishop is very close.

Current state of each character:
* elf bishop: Has good alchemy (over 60), but not other skills. Been putting level up points into the non-alchemy spellbooks. Decent Mental and Divine skills. (Used Magic Missiles with her a lot.) She's the one mixing Renewal Pitions. Will get Power Cast at level 11 (so soon, but don't qualify yet).
* human bishop: Has good wizardry (53) (because I raised it early to get X-Ray), but still want more practice before level 11 so she can qualify for the portal spells. Been using Fireball a lot and Whipping Rocks some. Using a Disrupter Mace as a weapon. Not good damage, but good for status aliments. Power Cast at level 12.
* priest: Also using a Disrupter Mace. Not that great, except that she'll learn Heal All soon, and that's a useful spell. (Bishops will wait until I can get the scrolls most likely.) Power Cast at level 12. Won't become really good until I get Diamond Eyes. (That may be fairly soon, after I gain the levels, buy a bunch of spells, and get the Staff of Doom.
* psionic: Using a Doubleshot Sling and the Mindblast Rod. Will get Power Cast and Eagle Eye at level 9. Been using mainly Psionic Fire, but will switch to Ego Whip after leveling up, since it has more potential (and will also help Psionic Blast). Will go Str/Dex after getting the esxpert skills. Is my Communications character; with the Blarneystone Amulet, I can get ideal prices from He'Li.
* alchemist: Using a lot of Fire Bomb and Whipping Rocks. More Alchemy than the elf bishop. Planning on the Staff of Doom, but still using a Doubleshot Sling to boost throwing. Power Cast at level 11.
* valkyrie: Doesn't have good offensive spells yet (not counting Holy Water). Can attack twice, but only if I give her that Ankh of Dexterity I got from the Rapax Assassin and one of my Ankhs of Speed. After reaching level 11, shouldn't need either of them. With her getting the second attack, I probably don't need to spend any points in non-magic skills. Power Strike at level 13.
Level 5:
Valkyrie: Heal Wounds
Ranger: Heal Wounds
Divinity/Wizardry Bishop: Guardian Angel
Alchemy/Psionics Bishop: Cure Lesser Conditions

Finally, some level 2 spells for the Bishops, and the Valkyrie and Ranger can learn some spells. This party is more defensive than offensive; As such, each caster has Heal Wounds, and all 6 characters have Potions of Light Heal. I'm going for no deaths (I managed to do it last time, so why not this time)? Dead characters lag behind in experience, as well as kidnapped ones from Crock.
It was tough to get enemies to spawn near the Wheel Key room, as the elevator button is broken at the top, preventing me from going back down until fighting Gregor (which I didn't want to do just yet, so close to a level up). I rested a bunch of times, hoping enemies would spawn, re-casting Light with the Alchemy/Psionics Bishop, until I finally got 15 Alchemy.
At that point, the magic began. Not only did I qualify for level 2 Alchemy spells, but I could start mixing potions with Burz (Light Heal + Mod Heal = Heavy Heal). I did it about 100 times, individually combining and identifying the Heavy Heal potions (slow, but gives maximum chance of Alchemy and Artifacts skill increases). My Alchemy got to 20, and the Bishop working on Artifacts got a few skill increases as well (allowing me to ID a few items in party inventory).
After a couple of battles North of Gregor, I took the level up. Gregor tomorrow night!

You do that too, huh? I hate characters dying, especially early, where I don't tolerate the 3 Ds: Death, Disease, Draining. I will reload if that happens; Also, I don't have X-Ray yet (so I allow myself the cheat where I save before corners, and if swarming melee enemies are there, I reload, so I can fight safely, from a good position).
Even if you don't care about morality, clearly, doing the last T'Rang and Umpani quest doesn't make sense: You anger a whole faction, and miss out on the chance for the Alliance Quest, which gives far more experience, and just feels much more satisfying.
Are you going for 4-school Bishops eventually? I plan to, once I learn the good spells for the first 2 spellbooks for each Bishop (the useless ones can usually be found or bought, or ignored, in the case of level 6 and 7 spells).
Post edited September 21, 2023 by RChu1982