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"Resentful benefactor" sounds like an oxymoron, but Frontier has proved anyone can become one.
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Grargar: I can't wait to see the launch. I'm hoping it will be a glorious trainwreck.
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Tarm: Isn't this their first "MMO" launch? Even experienced MMO companies fail hard with launches so that's a safe bet.
You're saying it might be... Dangerous?

Actually, if that joke isn't played out already it probably will be pretty soon. :-(
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Urnoev: Sure, they'll have the money from the campaign now, but who will ever trust them again, if they happen to start another project? They're ruining their company with this... and after the release of this game they will basically have to close business and create a new one.
Bunch of people are happily playing the game or looking forward to it. The people wanting refunds are a minority. (my ticket is around 4000-ish. If they'd had NO issues ever up until now that's just 4-5k people wanting a refund out of 140k who have pre-ordered in one way or another. Chances are it's a lot less than that.)

Personally I don't understand why my refund request hasn't been fulfilled. It was a simple pre-order, never played Beta or even downloaded the demo but I've been waiting for weeks.

I don't care about on-line/off-line but the shady refund policy really annoyed me. I do get the odd pang wondering if maybe it'd be simpler to just cancel the refund request....
Post edited December 08, 2014 by coldtony
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Fenixp: I'm fairly sure that the responce would be far less hostile if Frontier just said "We have put all the money into development of the game and all we can give you now is half of your pledge. Hold on and we might be able to give you the rest after the game's release"
Yeah. The bloody imbeciles could earn some sympathy and lots of cash if they at least considered the idea of doing a single player-offline mode.
Like: "We're going to start with an always-online game. But given the general interest in an offline mode we shall consider creating one in the future. Please, give us some time."

Alas, in a world of imbeciles, crooks sometimes win.
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Gnostic: ...Our records show that you backed the game before we committed to an offline mode and we're afraid Kickstarter pledges are an investment into a project, with the understanding that elements of the initial pitch may change or be removed as development progresses. ...
To the first sentence I would answer that as a backer you can withdraw your backing until the very last moment, so either you give all that you promised at any point to all backers or nothin to noone. Maybe the online mode was the online thing that kept this particular backer from withdrawing. The second sentence I don't like much either. If the creator has the right to change and remove elements at will then the outcome is completely arbitrary and the backer has no rights at all. That can't be the idea. Sure, the elements can be changed but this means that you have to compensate backers if you leave important things out. Offline mode and DRM free is kind of important, isn't it.

I agree that it is a difficult topic but the way they handle it and jump from one doubtful point (online is no DRM) to another (we offer you 50%) to another ("you were too early before we said it") is just pathethic. Can't they show some spine at all and pay those out who want that? I'm on the verge of actually developing happy feelings should their game fail.
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VanishedOne: Given that you can withdraw Kickstarter pledges at any time while the funding campaign is still running on the site, the idea that you aren't owed everything that was promised to backers at any point before the end of the Kickstarter campaign is... Well, let's hope that out of all the people they've mistreated, at least one turns out to be a tenaciously minded lawyer.
My impression is that with this hilarious interpretation they are also damaging KS. KS surely doesn't want backers in fear that they are not benefitting from anything that other later backers were promised. Surely also KS doesn't like such an interpretation.
Post edited December 08, 2014 by Trilarion
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Fenixp: To be fair, when you fail in the course of development and are honest about it, people are going to be far more understanding than when you try to bullshit them.

I'm fairly sure that the responce would be far less hostile if Frontier just said "We have put all the money into development of the game and all we can give you now is half of your pledge. Hold on and we might be able to give you the rest after the game's release"
Something alone the lines of "we started with the online mode since we thought this is more important - it was very complex and the money is almost used up - we need to get it out now and later, if the game sells well, we work on an online mode (promised)" would raise considerably less of a fuzz.

Sometimes I wonder if PR would have a better image if it wouldn't be used to barely cover up for idiotic management decisions.
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coldtony: ...Personally I don't understand why my refund request hasn't been fulfilled. It was a simple pre-order, never played Beta or even downloaded the demo but I've been waiting for weeks. ...
Probably because they are jerks. Since you are from the UK, write them a letter reminding them of your case and setting them a deadline of 7 days or so. If you have a legal protection insurance and some free time it might be fun to use it.
Post edited December 08, 2014 by Trilarion
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VanishedOne: Given that you can withdraw Kickstarter pledges at any time while the funding campaign is still running on the site, the idea that you aren't owed everything that was promised to backers at any point before the end of the Kickstarter campaign is... Well, let's hope that out of all the people they've mistreated, at least one turns out to be a tenaciously minded lawyer.
One guy is, and they are organizing joint action. I am participating, if anyone else wants, contact "Pibbles" on the frontier forum. or just ask to join per email: pibbles a t elitedangerousrefunds.org
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jamotide: One guy is, and they are organizing joint action. I am participating, if anyone else wants, contact "Pibbles" on the frontier forum. or just ask to join per email: pibbles a t elitedangerousrefunds.org
He's just put out a last call for being involved in the action, so be quick if you want to add your name to the list.
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Gnostic: I don't understand their mentality, how the little money gained through these transection is more worthy then the goodwill of their customers
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Phc7006: Well, fact is we don't know how solvent they are. Preserving customer goodwill and market presence is all very well, but won't weight much if they fear/expect to get out of business before they have the occasion to develop any other game...
Actually we know how solvent they are

http://www.frontier.co.uk/docs/files/Frontier%20Developments%20plc%20Annual%20Report%20and%20Accounts%202014.pdf

They have 9 million pound in revenue and 8.6 million pound in cash. That is 14-15 million USD.

You can even check David salary there.

They have enough cash to pay back the entire kickstarter campaign a few times over
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Gnostic: They have enough cash to pay back the entire kickstarter campaign a few times over
It sure pays to be a crook.
So... I did cancel my refund request. Which probably means I'll now get a refund considering how competent the support staff have been. I'd sooner have the game than a half-assed refund. No, I don't feel good about it but we each have our own path to take.

The company report that was posted was interesting. I had some money in my S&S ISA so I took a punt. If they get a bump after the game officially releases maybe I'll make the money back.

FWIW, the share price probably already has a significant amount of optimism about the game succeeding already baked into the share price. The share price has risen considerably over the last year so it may actually take a hit if the game just has an "okay" launch. Also, it's small cap and most of the shares are held by directors or large private investors and there's also an approx 2% spread to beat. But, I'm a gambler.
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Gnostic: They have 9 million pound in revenue and 8.6 million pound in cash. That is 14-15 million USD.
Well, add that to the contempt they show towards their customer base, and they surely qualify for some politically incorect title...

As we say here "A force de prendre les gens pour des pigeons, il ne faut s'étonner de se ramasser de la merde sur la figure "
i'm interested in this game, but should i buy it? i don't want to hand money to people who have lied to their investors.
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LesterKnight99: i'm interested in this game, but should i buy it? i don't want to hand money to people who have lied to their investors.
I wouldn't buy it. Aside from betrayal of customers, there's a pretty good reason why people wanted an offline version of the game. If a game is online only, notable problems include not being able to play due to poor Internet connections, or a server being down, etc. (while with an offline mode, you obviously have the entire game and will be able to play it with or without internet)
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LesterKnight99: i'm interested in this game, but should i buy it? i don't want to hand money to people who have lied to their investors.
Well... They screwed a few people over, game's got always-online DRM and they ask for your permission for in-game adverts in EULA, to sum it up. So yeah, your choice I suppose :D