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Rastansaga: Thank you for telling me all these! They are very useful informations.

According to what I know, the Coin of Power [Before] has an 100% chance to be broken when invoked. After that, it will become Coin of Power [After], which is also definately broken when invoke. After being invoked for the second time, the item will disappear.

So I can only do this trick once per Coin of Power, am I right?

And in Wizardry Gaiden 3, I think the items you mentioned can be vaguely translated as butterfly knife and Pope's Robe. I think, both of them are to be broken when invoked.

So my guess is that this trick can be done once per item?
The Wizardry 2 trick can indeed be done once per coin. Note that the Coin of Power [After], as you call it, is actually used in the trick, as it's the one that changes them to a fast leveling class and kills them at the same time. (Interesting fact: The Coin of Power [After] is capable of restoring a Lost character; doing so will change the character's condition to "Dead", which can then be cured by other means.)

The Wizardry Gaiden 3 trick can be done once per pair of items. (By the way, the Butterfly Knife appears, under that name and with the same properties, in Wizardry 3, so that item *does* have an English name.)

With that said, since the growth is exponential (the higher your XP, the more levels/XP you gain in one iteration), eventually hunting down the items will be faster than earning the XP normally. (If you imported a character who benefited from Wizardry 1's Identify glitch, it will already be much faster, but then again, you don't really *need* the character's level to be any higher at this point; 200+ should be enough for everybody.)
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Rastansaga: Thank you for telling me all these! They are very useful informations.

According to what I know, the Coin of Power [Before] has an 100% chance to be broken when invoked. After that, it will become Coin of Power [After], which is also definately broken when invoke. After being invoked for the second time, the item will disappear.

So I can only do this trick once per Coin of Power, am I right?

And in Wizardry Gaiden 3, I think the items you mentioned can be vaguely translated as butterfly knife and Pope's Robe. I think, both of them are to be broken when invoked.

So my guess is that this trick can be done once per item?
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dtgreene: The Wizardry 2 trick can indeed be done once per coin. Note that the Coin of Power [After], as you call it, is actually used in the trick, as it's the one that changes them to a fast leveling class and kills them at the same time. (Interesting fact: The Coin of Power [After] is capable of restoring a Lost character; doing so will change the character's condition to "Dead", which can then be cured by other means.)

The Wizardry Gaiden 3 trick can be done once per pair of items. (By the way, the Butterfly Knife appears, under that name and with the same properties, in Wizardry 3, so that item *does* have an English name.)

With that said, since the growth is exponential (the higher your XP, the more levels/XP you gain in one iteration), eventually hunting down the items will be faster than earning the XP normally. (If you imported a character who benefited from Wizardry 1's Identify glitch, it will already be much faster, but then again, you don't really *need* the character's level to be any higher at this point; 200+ should be enough for everybody.)
Now I see! You are great, man!
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dtgreene: The Wizardry 2 trick can indeed be done once per coin. Note that the Coin of Power [After], as you call it, is actually used in the trick, as it's the one that changes them to a fast leveling class and kills them at the same time. (Interesting fact: The Coin of Power [After] is capable of restoring a Lost character; doing so will change the character's condition to "Dead", which can then be cured by other means.)

The Wizardry Gaiden 3 trick can be done once per pair of items. (By the way, the Butterfly Knife appears, under that name and with the same properties, in Wizardry 3, so that item *does* have an English name.)

With that said, since the growth is exponential (the higher your XP, the more levels/XP you gain in one iteration), eventually hunting down the items will be faster than earning the XP normally. (If you imported a character who benefited from Wizardry 1's Identify glitch, it will already be much faster, but then again, you don't really *need* the character's level to be any higher at this point; 200+ should be enough for everybody.)
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Rastansaga: Now I see! You are great, man!
Thanks, but please don't call me "man".

By the way, because of leveling speed Valkyrie > Lord in pretty much every Wizardry game, except for some of the Wizardry Empire games where you get a bonus for having everyone be the same alignment. (Valkyries can only be Neutral, so they can't party (at least not easily; I haven't played these WE games) with Priests, Bishops, or Almighties.)
Ok, got it.

By the way, I am a Chinese Wizardry fan. About one and a half year ago, one of my friends in Baidu Tieba got me into the Wizardry series. But he soon got out of touch with me and anyone I know, perhaps, because of busily making a living. It has been extremely hard for me to find another person in China to talk about Wizardry.

Last year, I found the Steam Forum. And I found it to be helpful. But sad for me, this year, Steam decided to block Chinese Users from viewing the content in the Forum, obviously for fear that His Majesty, who had never liked his subjects to be in touch with the outer world, would be provoked to shut down the Steam service in China completely.

Lucky for me, I found here. (And I found I already had a registered account! I had completely forgotten why I got this.) And this place is even better than steam. I wish, it will be hidden from him for ever!

Although I can reply your post, it would seem that, I cannot start a new post because of some reason unknown. Strange things do happen these days. I would not be surprise if someday greater evil befalls us.

Attached are some of the Wizardry games that I have gotten in this one and a half year. You can see, I am a big fan of the Japanese remakes which feature Jun suemi's artworks.

It's great to find here and chat with you.
Attachments:
Post edited May 27, 2018 by Rastansaga
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Rastansaga: Attached are some of the Wizardry games that I have gotten in this one and a half year. You can see, I am a big fan of the Japanese remakes which feature Jun suemi's artworks.
Personally, the graphics aren't much of a factor in how much I like a game (as long as they don't get in the way), but the music is. There's some nice music in the ASCII and Soliton Soft remakes; in particular, Wizardry 1 NES's battle theme, Wizardry 5 SNES's title screen, and Wizardry: Llylgamyn Saga's title screen are wonderful pieces of music.

(I don't like the music from GBC Wizardry Empire or GBA Wizardry Summoner as much.)

By the way, how do the various console versions of Wizardry 6 and 7 compare to each other and the PC versions?

Maybe I'll try making a topic about Wizardry Gaiden 3 later.
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Rastansaga: Attached are some of the Wizardry games that I have gotten in this one and a half year. You can see, I am a big fan of the Japanese remakes which feature Jun suemi's artworks.
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dtgreene: Personally, the graphics aren't much of a factor in how much I like a game (as long as they don't get in the way), but the music is. There's some nice music in the ASCII and Soliton Soft remakes; in particular, Wizardry 1 NES's battle theme, Wizardry 5 SNES's title screen, and Wizardry: Llylgamyn Saga's title screen are wonderful pieces of music.

(I don't like the music from GBC Wizardry Empire or GBA Wizardry Summoner as much.)

By the way, how do the various console versions of Wizardry 6 and 7 compare to each other and the PC versions?

Maybe I'll try making a topic about Wizardry Gaiden 3 later.
The SFC Version of Wizardry VI features nice graphics and very great music. I think, the Steam Wizardry Gold 6+7 offers the Wizardry sound tracks MP3 files as a bonus content. And those MP3 files are from a Music CD which is an arranged version of SFC version's OST. They are very great scores.
The SFC version generally stays true to the original, including the hideous beginning difficulty. But for a few parts, they make some of the bosses a little bit weaker. (hydra plant, bela the dragon)
The infamous carrying capacity bug is fixed.
There is a very handy auto map feature.
The keyword system is like that of SNES version Wizardry 5
In the original game, the quest items, if not disappear after use, stay with the party forever and cannot be discarded. In the SFC version, you can give some of the quest items to some of the NPCs, so that you will be released from the unneeded items. The game is designed in such a way that when you find an NPC who can take a certain item from you, the item must have already been unuseful by then, so that you won't screw the main mission by giving things away. There are some other minor differences too, which I don't need to spoil too much here.
In addition, the game also features a very handy in-game avatar customazition system, by which you can make you own portrait.

The SS version of Wizardry 6 is bundled with wiz7. It is an remake of wizardry 6 using the engine of Wizardry 7.
The begining difficulty has been scaled down.
The graphics are OK and the musics are OK.
The original game's enemy sprites are very repetitive. The SFC version solves this by adding variety to the looks of the enemies. The SS version's enemeis are repetitive too, except that they look better than the original.

The SS version of WIzardry 7 is very like the original, except for some rebalancing to make it easier.

The playstation version of wizardry 7 is.....well.....an extremely poor translation.....
The polygon graphics are extremely ugly-looking. The sounds are unbearable. The Lording time is outrageous......
Personally, I recommand you to skip this version...
Post edited May 27, 2018 by Rastansaga
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Rastansaga: I think, the Steam Wizardry Gold 6+7 offers the Wizardry sound tracks MP3 files as a bonus content. And those MP3 files are from a Music CD which is an arranged version of SFC version's OST. They are very great scores.
I just checked the GOG version (which I own), and it also includes this bonus soundtrack.
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Rastansaga: I think, the Steam Wizardry Gold 6+7 offers the Wizardry sound tracks MP3 files as a bonus content. And those MP3 files are from a Music CD which is an arranged version of SFC version's OST. They are very great scores.
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dtgreene: I just checked the GOG version (which I own), and it also includes this bonus soundtrack.
Great! That is the arranged version of the SFC version's original sound track. The Sir-tech's PC version does not have any music.
Hi, Can you give me a Full list of Wizardry 8's Hotkeys?
I cannot start a new post because of the net problem in China.
If you can help me by giving me this list, I will be very thankful.
Thank you!

Recently, I have been finding a proper way to win the ironman expert mode of the game, and I think the hotkey list will be will handy.
Post edited June 20, 2018 by Rastansaga
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Rastansaga: Hi, Can you give me a Full list of Wizardry 8's Hotkeys?
I cannot start a new post because of the net problem in China.
If you can help me by giving me this list, I will be very thankful.
Thank you!

Recently, I have been finding a proper way to win the ironman expert mode of the game, and I think the hotkey list will be will handy.
I don't have one, but I believe the in-game options allow you to view (and change) these hotkeys.

Ironman is something I will likely never attempt; in fact, when playing classic Wizardry games that effectively have forced Ironman, I will use save states to avoid this problem.

(As a side note, I might replay Final Fantasy 5 (GBA version) to try and play around with some item duplication glitches that have been found in that version.)

Getting back on topic, how does my favorite party, which has 0 characters, look?

(Complete list of characters for my favorite party: .)
To change hotkeys. go to Options -> Keyboad and click on the actual key combination, it should turn green.
Now hit the new desired key to assign it, the new key you selected should appear, written in white.

Regarding Ironman, there is a huge difference in winning a game on IM or using reloads.
Its not satisfying for me to win if i know that i technically cheated in a game which theoretically allwos IM,
i.e. is nicely balanced and does not have entirely rng based party killing stuff
or OP enemies luring behind every corner/tree that can only be beaten with lord Rng on your side.

The major point is that reloads tend to lower the players learning potential,
why should somebody try another strategy/tactic/approach or however you call it
if rng allows to pass the hurdle after some reloads.
IM certainly brings you faster to perfect gaming, although reloads during the early learning phase
are quite helpful to understand and adapt to the games mechnics.

I play wiz8 on self imposed iron man since ages, its not really that difficult even with smaller party.
The real challenge in Wiz8 is e.g. adding "no resurrection" on max difficulty,
for which i have <50% win rate(never managed to get all 8 through it alive)
For fallout tactics that would be "no healing from chemics" & limited doctoring,
while in JA2 1.13 the difficulty range from ingame and .ini options is so huge,
that i only restrict myself from use of irl imo inacceptable stuff like mustard gas or selling war equipment to civilians.
Post edited June 20, 2018 by townltu
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townltu: The major point is that reloads tend to lower the players learning potential,
why should somebody try another strategy/tactic/approach or however you call it
if rng allows to pass the hurdle after some reloads.
IM certainly brings you faster to perfect gaming, although reloads during the early learning phase
are quite helpful to understand and adapt to the games mechnics.
I disagree with reloads lowering the player's learning potential. One of the best way to learn is to experiment, where you might try something to see if it works, and reload if it doesn't (or if it does but consumes a resource you don't want to actually use up at the moment).

Also, for me the "learning the game's mechanics" phase never really ends; sometimes I discover new things about the game's mechanics even if I have played the game many times before.

I play wiz8 on self imposed iron man since ages, its not really that difficult even with smaller party.
The real challenge in Wiz8 is e.g. adding "no resurrection" on max difficulty,
for which i have <50% win rate(never managed to get all 8 through it alive)
For fallout tactics that would be "no healing from chemics" & limited doctoring,
while in JA2 1.13 the difficulty range from ingame and .ini options is so huge,
that i only restrict myself from use of irl imo inacceptable stuff like mustard gas or selling war equipment to civilians.
Personally, when I use self-imposed rules, healing is something that I almost never restrict; I happen to really like healing abilities, and would not have as much fun if not allowed to use them. (Occasionally I may deliberately use weaker, but more interesting, healing abilities, however. This may include things like using a summon to heal, or relying on something like White Wind (from the Final Fantasy series, heals the party by an amount equal to the caster's current HP) combined with an HP drain attack on the same character.) I generally prefer to restrict the most obvious ways of dealing ridiculous damage, or other things that I feel truly breaks the game, or occasionally things that crowd out other options.

For reference, here are the self imposed restrictions I like to use when playing Final Fantasy 5:
* No throwing money at enemies; that particular ability (available to the Samurai job) is far stronger than it should be. If I do allow it, I will only allow it in the late game, when it has to compete with high level summons.
* No using the Blessed Kiss mix (which causes Berserk even if the target is supposed to be immune) on enemies; I will use it on party members, however. (I may break this rule if I feel like playing around with an enemy, for example to break boss scripts in silly ways.)
* No having a Freelancer or Mime dual wield unless the Dual Wield ability is equipped. (Normally, mastering Ninja gives those two jobs that ability without it using up a slot, and I think it's too powerful to be free in that sense; it also makes 2-handed useless at that point.)
* Sometimes I also add: No changing a character's job to Freelancer or Mime; instead, I keep using other jobs all the way to the end of the game. (Might make an exception for random battles in order to learn the Mimic abilitiy.)

In Wizardry 8, my self-imposed restrictions are:
* For Bishops, no saving spell picks for higher level spells. Saving them for spells whose skill requirements are not met is still allowed.
* No using classes with Stealth. (I don't like the way it works in Wizardry 8, and you can't turn it off.)
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Rastansaga: Hi, Can you give me a Full list of Wizardry 8's Hotkeys?
I cannot start a new post because of the net problem in China.
If you can help me by giving me this list, I will be very thankful.
Thank you!

Recently, I have been finding a proper way to win the ironman expert mode of the game, and I think the hotkey list will be will handy.
avatar
dtgreene: I don't have one, but I believe the in-game options allow you to view (and change) these hotkeys.

Ironman is something I will likely never attempt; in fact, when playing classic Wizardry games that effectively have forced Ironman, I will use save states to avoid this problem.

(As a side note, I might replay Final Fantasy 5 (GBA version) to try and play around with some item duplication glitches that have been found in that version.)

Getting back on topic, how does my favorite party, which has 0 characters, look?

(Complete list of characters for my favorite party: .)
Thank you very much!
avatar
townltu: To change hotkeys. go to Options -> Keyboad and click on the actual key combination, it should turn green.
Now hit the new desired key to assign it, the new key you selected should appear, written in white.

Regarding Ironman, there is a huge difference in winning a game on IM or using reloads.
Its not satisfying for me to win if i know that i technically cheated in a game which theoretically allwos IM,
i.e. is nicely balanced and does not have entirely rng based party killing stuff
or OP enemies luring behind every corner/tree that can only be beaten with lord Rng on your side.

The major point is that reloads tend to lower the players learning potential,
why should somebody try another strategy/tactic/approach or however you call it
if rng allows to pass the hurdle after some reloads.
IM certainly brings you faster to perfect gaming, although reloads during the early learning phase
are quite helpful to understand and adapt to the games mechnics.

I play wiz8 on self imposed iron man since ages, its not really that difficult even with smaller party.
The real challenge in Wiz8 is e.g. adding "no resurrection" on max difficulty,
for which i have <50% win rate(never managed to get all 8 through it alive)
For fallout tactics that would be "no healing from chemics" & limited doctoring,
while in JA2 1.13 the difficulty range from ingame and .ini options is so huge,
that i only restrict myself from use of irl imo inacceptable stuff like mustard gas or selling war equipment to civilians.
Thamk you for your comment. I agree with you.
To me, winning the Ironman mode seems to be quite feasible. My goal is to find a way to win the ironman mode without using "battle resets" (As we know, in the ironman mode, if things turns out bad, as long as the battle doesn't end, we can always close the game and restart the last auto-saved game to fight the battle again) or backing up save files.
Up until now, everything went very smoothly.
I got a fighter, valkyrie, rouge, ranger, bishop,bard team.
I increased the alchemy of my bishop to 15 before facing Gregor. And that allowed me to mix potion to earn money. I got a lot of potions and resurrection powders when facing it. And it was quite easy for me to defeat if without being wiped out.
I carefully controlled my levels. When getting to Arnica road, My team are level 4. The battle was easy.
After getting to Arnika I train the wizardry of the bishop by using knock knock, and train alchemy by standing on fire and healing my self. When my alchemy reached 50. I trained Psionic with charm. When I could learn Identification spell, it was quite easy for my to make money by making renewal potions.
Then I trained psionic by using detecting traps.
And I went to the umpani base for a lot of magic books.
Then I went to swamp to buy amulat of healings which regenerated HP.
With these Amulats, I went back to Arnika to train stealh and shield and fighter's ironskin (got all my characters save fighter to change classes to rogue) using the two Higardi criminals in the prison. (I changed combat to real time, so that I can leave my computer and do some other things)
Up until now, everything is good.
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Rastansaga: Thamk you for your comment. I agree with you.
To me, winning the Ironman mode seems to be quite feasible. My goal is to find a way to win the ironman mode without using "battle resets" (As we know, in the ironman mode, if things turns out bad, as long as the battle doesn't end, we can always close the game and restart the last auto-saved game to fight the battle again) or backing up save files.
Up until now, everything went very smoothly.
I got a fighter, valkyrie, rouge, ranger, bishop,bard team.
I increased the alchemy of my bishop to 15 before facing Gregor. And that allowed me to mix potion to earn money. I got a lot of potions and resurrection powders when facing it. And it was quite easy for me to defeat if without being wiped out.
I carefully controlled my levels. When getting to Arnica road, My team are level 4. The battle was easy.
After getting to Arnika I train the wizardry of the bishop by using knock knock, and train alchemy by standing on fire and healing my self. When my alchemy reached 50. I trained Psionic with charm. When I could learn Identification spell, it was quite easy for my to make money by making renewal potions.
Then I trained psionic by using detecting traps.
And I went to the umpani base for a lot of magic books.
Then I went to swamp to buy amulat of healings which regenerated HP.
With these Amulats, I went back to Arnika to train stealh and shield and fighter's ironskin (got all my characters save fighter to change classes to rogue) using the two Higardi criminals in the prison. (I changed combat to real time, so that I can leave my computer and do some other things)
Up until now, everything is good.
Actually, with high levels I almost never die from damage, unless overconfident. Main challenge is instant death effects: Death Cloud, Death Wish, Quicksand, Asphyxiation. There is no absolute protection vs these effects. Since the formula contains relative level between your char and casting monster, best protection is to be a level higher.

Otherwise there are no real risks for ironman beyond Arnika and L11. Before, you'd simply start all over, it is only 1-2 hrs of replay, if you're unlucky and get unbeatable enemies. Lots of Armor and Stealth make it even safer, but are not necessary. To know when to run and where is most important.

I wish you a good finish for your Expert-Ironman Party.