I don't think that's necessary, if you have a save from before. Thing is, you got some information, but that doesn't actually mean anything for your party or anything else whose state is saved in the save game file. So there isn't any reason why you can't just get the information and then just turn off the game without saving.

Also, did you get any information about General Yamo?

I asked a few Umpani about General Yamo, but sadly, nobody seems to know anything about him, despite there being a huge picture of him at the bar (roadhouse). I will do a round of asking again, as I haven't picked some of the NPC's brains in a long time (Panrack, Kunar). The former so that I could actually get into the Umpani Base Camp, and the latter so that I could get an Umpani Flag for Z'Ant to prove Umpani presence on Dominus.

I did at least gather that he had died on planet Guardia.

I have a feeling that, if you really want to know a lot about him, you'd need to play Wizardry 7. (Probably want to side with the Umpani in this case, at least for most of the game.)

Edit: I answered your question. I will go through the Umpani Base Camp again, asking about Yamo and Yamir, to the 6 remaining NPCs: Panrack at the entrance (provided no enemies are nearby), Saxx and Bildublu at the bar, Kunar at the comissary, and Balbrak and Sparkle at the Recruitment Station. I will also take a good long look at General Yamo's painting at the bar. I bet he died honorably in battle, although I have never played W7.
You ignored my question though:
Anybody who is interested in the lore of this game would note that Marten mentioned that, both the party and the Savant have good and evil in them, that they may wind up on the same side (even though he mentioned that we were destined to fight each other, interesting).
I agree with you about the music for the final battle. And yes, I do feel sympathy for the Dark Savant, having been cast out by the other Cosmic Lords. So the final battle divides me (as mentioned earlier about what Marten hinted at). Perhaps have "epic good" battle music if you side with Bela and VI Domina (if present), and "epic evil" battle music if you side with the Savant? That would be epic, as the fate of the universe rests in your hands.
What do you think?

I did my training in Mount Gigas. I killed 3 dummies with magic for 0 experience points. I did the 5 Flags quest. Rubble has now teleported to the UTU area. In the process, I managed to ask all 7 of them about Yamo and Yamir. Here is what I heard about Yamo: Panrack, Saxx, Bildublu, Sparkle, Balbrak, and Rubble all have no answer. The disgruntled prick Kunar says something about how he is the best general ever, and bad-mouths Yamir as "hanging out with his buddies". I sense that Kunar is disgruntled. I did admire Yamo's picture in the bar, as I assume he died honorably in combat.

Foreshadowing here.

(If you've reached the end of the T'Rang quest line, you'll know what I'm talking about.)
Yes, but did he die to the T'Rang? Or did he die because some genocidal party of 6 aliens decided to just attack him?

Thing is, unless you're using an imported party, Wizardry 8 has no way of knowing what actually happened in Wizardry 7, and even if you *are* using an imported party, it may have been too much work (or the Wizardry 7 save file might not have kept track).

Wondering if there's any mention of any Wizardry 7 T'Rang NPCs in Wizardry 8.

(Also, Rodan and Drazic apparently exist in Wizardry 7, but apparently hate the other race, as would normally be expected.)

One can, you can't. Tactical advantage is, of course, a better reason than laziness.

Spells also can hit things ranged cannot and are always fully accurate. Part of why magic is too strong. The other part is too much mana. Although RChu1982 shows us that it's not enough when the party is at extreme levels. Furthermore even one in one million million is more than zero in anything.

Vestigial systems make design look lazy and under-achieving. The bigger issue is that rest spamming seems optimal. But it is the fool who optimizes the fun out and than complains about it.

There is a difference between rationing and hoarding, but I know with whom I speak, so that's my oversight. Best systems imply that items should be used, sold, or ignored completely. Also, I feel like consumables should tie in to inventory limitations and exploration to create an air of preparedness. They need not be strong, they need to be fun. And not everyone's fun is power. See also gamer motivation profile. It doesn't help that the common consumables are typically exactly that, such as healing and curing hooverables. An interesting case study would be FPSes with inventories, and why they tend not to work.

The best real-time combat is like dancing, so... today I learned that dancing lacks rhythm. But positioning is a boon of tactical turn-based combat, and the formation wheel is one of the best features of Wiz8. Sadly it doesn't respect the phases as-is, but it rather a between phases reaction-based feature. Which is one of the ways speed hacks can actually increase the difficulty. But turn-based blob combat helps to let something else shine, which this system fails at. And Fallout, yes really, allows more shenanigans. I fully understand why there are people who prefer the combat of Wizards & Warriors, even if it's more like one of those car-boats. Because, at least, it gets out of your way. So you can, like, enjoy the level design. Although, I get how that's not an issue with Wiz8. And I say that as someone who actually likes the unexplored caves, but I like Daggerfall's dungeons, so my tastes are objectively bad. I also like Proving Grounds, Dungeon Master, and PoolRad for a lot of the same reasons.

I'd argue that RTwP is a lot like a spork. One could judge someone's character by that, I'd suppose. It does better represent the way some people played AD&D than tactical turn-based combat even. Then again, so does phase-based blob combat. Also, how prominent was it outside of BioWare and Black Isle/Obsidian? I can name a few, but my impression was that far more games were real-time with optional turn-based—like the terrible in two systems Arcanum—Diablo-esque action RPGs—now called Hack and Slash—or just real-time systems—TES, Gothic, etc. And Icewind Dale is one of the best games ever made... that I'll probably never complete. I can't play full-party control RTwP for many of the same reasons I can't play RTSes. Thankfully I can enjoy single-character control RTwP games. Hell, Neverwinter Nights has lots of rhythm, even if it has a lot of issues. Like slow, slow low-level combat. But most of its issues can be blamed on the multiplayer focus. And, of course, the game most people use as an example of how RTwP could be good if devs tried is Freedom Force. Also, Darklands predates the popular era, and is still put on a pedestal. Which reminds me that I need to play that game.

I decided to run a RDP, and wow, these character hit so much more often than the melee DPs (CDPs?), and for only a little less damage. That, of course is only for the extreme short-term, and, of course, an MDP is a lot stronger, even at this point. The thing is, of the three damage types, the only required one is melee, since missile shield is a thing, as well as a few bosses having too much magical resistances. But a magic only party can get that via elementals, but, ye Gods. And, have you ever bum rushed a queen ant, or some dreadmares? Nevertheless, RDPs are extremely fun because resource management is the most fun part of, well, practically all games where it is a feature. Adventure games tend to be more about the voice of the auteur, and occasionally, the puzzles, for example. I need to try it longer, but that's the hardest Gregor I've had in a long time. Had to use the guaranteed cherry and stink bombs. An alchemist or ninja would have helped. Or the classics of either grinding to level four, or just ignoring the giant roach.

Yeah, Rapax do casts magic screen, but, Rapax Samurai aren't supposed to. If high level ones do, then the end-user resources are wrong.

Fun aside: the save tokens in Dragon Quarter don't serve the same purpose as ink ribbons in Resident Evil. You can always guarantee more at any point, for a small price: having to engage with the inventory systems. Quell horreur! Also, I'm not sure I'd agree with either the claim that Resident Evil is easy, or that it is hard. But I digress.

No, it is not always possible to avoid the situation. It often is, but not always.

And the "lazyness" argument, I'd argue, is valid when the enemies are weak and/or if the entire party can survive well in melee. By not taking the time to find a good spot to fight, you can save time and get to where you need to be faster.

Also, I find your use of the term "lazyness" to be somewhat offensive.

You are the first person who has *ever*, for Wizardry 8, a game where offensive magic is infamously weak (for a balanced party) (especially compared to melee). to complain that it's too strong.
I'd argue that Wizardry 8's offensive magic might not be quite powerful enough to warrant the need for a limited resource.

On the other hand, melee is strong enough that it *should* require a limited resource to use in this game, and yet it doesn't (unless you count stamina, and even that only matters in longer battles unless you're using a particularly heavy weapon or are losing it in some other way).

The problem is that most consumables are neither strong enough (compared to alternatives that don't use consumables) nor plentiful enough to be fun.


You can't cast Summon Elemental unless there's enough room for the elemental to spawn at the time you target the spell. (This restriction does not apply to Canned Elementals.)

I've never found queen ants to be an issue.

Dreadmares are actually best rushed if you're going to fight them. Charge into melee combat, and I think they tend not to rear or run away.

It can be fun, but too often there are ways to get around the mechanic entirely.

For example, in SaGa Fronter 2, weapons have limited durability, but you can get around it by just using martial arts or spells, which avoid that issue. (And, the way the game is set up, you can use spells all the time and not run out of SP (assuming suitable mage equipment, while WP doesn't recover as easily, inverting the common situation.) Furthermore, there are plenty of infinite durability weapons in the game, and that's even if you don't count steel weapons (which have the drawback of weakening your magic).

The save token issue was actually a dealbreaker for me, and one reason I decided not to get the game when it came out. With that said, it wasn't the only problem (from my perspective)I had with what I had read about the game.
* The D-Counter, which essentially serves as a sort of time limit. Even if it's rather large (assuming you don't actually use the dragon powers), it is still technically a time limit.
* The copy-protected save file, which I consider to be a form of DRM.

Also, worth noting that Ultima 7 forces you to engage with the inventory system just to feed your characters, or else they will starve to death. Furthermore, the inventory system in that game is horrendous. The combination of those two factors is one of the problems I have with that game. (It's also an issue that previous entries in that series did not have; food was annoying in Ultima 3, but not to that extent.)

By the way, I've started another go at The Elder Scrolls; Arena. It helps that the game's control scheme is somewhat similar to the default control scheme of Wizardry 8. (Although Wizardry 8 is still the better game.)

I have managed to "tie up loose ends" with this playthrough.
I formed an Umpani-Mook alliance. Just to be sure, I checked that the Mook indeed have a fake Astral Dominae in their possession (after being threatened of course, poor Star Trek nerds, let them think that they still have the Chaos Moliri).
I talked to Screg and Urq about various things, for the last time (they are super dorky, but harmless, let them live).
I then portalled to Z'Ant, just to double check things, He is not hostile (thank Phoonzang!). I talked to him about how Drazic is doing, then used the T'Rang Arm for the last time to get into the hallway to talk to Sadok. The latter had a few things to say, about how I had gotten various devices for the T'Rang, etc. I bought and sold with him for the last time, after he had his standard response.
Now, I can get rid of the T'Rang arm, as it has two purposes: As an Umpani quest item (proving to Balbrak that the T'Rang exist on Dominus, and as a tool to access Sadok. Since I did the Umpani quest, and I'm done with Sadok, I put the T'Rang arm in a chest.
Also, as a side bonus, I did have fun with the *Light Swords* against various Savant machines. In the first battle, a group of Savant Slashers (the toughest melee machines), had spawned in the SE Spaceport. I made sure that all of them were in the Blackbox Reader building, and I positioned myself at the entrance so that only 2 Slashers could get to my Bard up front. The Bard made short work of them with her *Light Sword*, all 3 of them, in 2 or 3 hits.
The same thing happened with another spawn of 4 Savant Slashers near the Arnika Tower. This was out in the open though, I positioned my party so that the Bard and Gadgeteer each had 2 Savant Slashers to attack. The Bard and Gadgeteer both managed to kill their 2 Savant Slashers each with 2 or 3 hits (What is this? Star Wars? It's like I'm using Light Sabers!).
Anyways, I got credit for forming an Umpani-Mook alliance, and I'm entirely done in the Umpani Base Camp (Balbrak mentions that I'm over his head now). I was given orders to talk to the EWAXX unit, then General Yamir, the big man, is waiting for me.
I did talk to the EWAXX unit about literally everything, so now I'm current. I did a triple hard save, and now I'm ready to access the elevators, and visit the man himself, Yamir.
Edit: I asked Balbrak about Rodan, and he says he's worried about him, just like how Z'Ant is worried about Drazic. If you ask Z'Ant about the Umpani, you will again get a touching response: "We kill them, they kill us. And still, neither gains ground. Perhaps we may one day put aside our differences, and acknowledge our true enemy: The Dark Savant."

Just imagine how much damage a Fighter with 125 Strength could do going Berserk against an android.

I believe General Yamir has dialog for Guardia and Yamo.

One other neat little touch: Normally, I believe at least one of those generals will call your party "boys". If you have an all female party, on the other hand, he calls your party "girls". Just a neat little touch.

(Although, on release the developers failed to account for an all-female party for the Al-Sedexus quest. Given the women involved in leadership positions at the company, I would have expected this to have been caught pre-release, but it apparently wasn't, and wasn't fixed until later.)

If I had a Fighter, Berserking with a *Light Sword*, they would have gotten an extra "stack" of damage, resulting in 1 or 2 hit kills, instead of 2 or 3 hit kills with the Bard and Gadgeteer.
Check my reply again. I did fix a few things. Anyways, dialogue was added for things like "Guardia" and "Yamo". I got called "girls" the whole time, due to having a mixed party.
Al-Sedexus at the beginning apparently rejected "scissoring", so they had to make her more "open minded", from what I hear.
Edit: I have 4 casters with portals. I set one in Arnika, one at the T'RangPorter (4 in 1), one in front of Z'Ant (handy for the Alliance Quest later), and one in the Umpani Base Camp (will be changed to be in front of Yamir, so that both Glumph and Rodan can be teleported to their leader quickly). How does that sound?

The early SaGa games had light sabers in them. I believe they changed the Japanese spelling slightly in the SaGa 2 remake. (The English name for the weapon is L-SABER in Final Fantasy Legend 1 and [sword icon]Laser in FFL2. Keep in mind, however, that FFL2 is the game whose localization replaced opium with bananas.)

Sounds reasonable, though that's not how I would do it.

My portals:
* One at the T'Rang Teleporter. (Means I don't need portals in UBC or Arnika.)
* One by Ferro. (Before then, I think this would usually be by Crock.)
* One by the Trynton fountain that either restores or curses.
* One "wandering" portal. If I need to leave (for example, if running low on resources), I have this character set a portal, then warp out, then when ready I warp back in.

The Bard and Gadgeteer, more than anybody else, really needed those *Light Swords*. You see, they are "jack of all trade" characters, not really excelling at anything. They are mediocre at melee and ranged combat, can stamina-cast spells with their instruments and gadgets, with no benefit from Powercast, or way of controlling the power level cast at, and can do locks and traps.
The Bard get a Communication skill bonus, improves party camping, and gets a load of special Bard-only items. The Gadgeteer gets the Omnigun, and a Modern Weapons skill bonus, and can merge items together to form gadgets (plus the Tripleshot Crossbow). These are the only things that make them stand out.
In melee, the Fighter can Berserk for double damage, can KO opponents from both melee and range, has stamina regeneration, and has the best hit points and armor selection in the game, along with the Lord and Valkyrie, who will be levels behind him, but those two get magic.
The Rogue can backstab for up to, I think, 4X damage with swords and daggers, and has no need for the Vitality attribute, or shields, once his Stealth skill takes off (he will almost never be targeted!) Put a Fighter up front with him to take the heat, protected by Guardian Angel.
I don't use hybrids that much, but I hear that the Samurai up front can dish out the pain, especially with Lightning Strike? I don't use them, so I don't know.
In ranged combat, the Ranger can get instant kills without having to invest in a skill (this is dependent on Ranged Combat skill, something you should invest in regardless).
The Ninja gets thrown weapon auto-penetrate and thrown weapon instant kills.
Too long didn't read: My point is, neither the Bard, nor the Gadgeteer, really excel at melee or ranged combat the way other classes do, so I wanted to give them *Light Swords* so they could at least do respectable damage. Their Tripleshot Crossbows will allow them to get many shots off in ranged combat, though I doubt I will use them that much, as this is a MDP.

Thankfully, you only have to rescue 3 NPCs in this game: Glumph, Drazic, and Rodan. They are a liability when in the party, due to their extremely low level compared to mine. This is why I want to instantly teleport them to their leaders, so that they see no fighting.
Also, RIP Jan-Ette. Her ship got shot down by the Dark Savant, and as the last survivor, got locked up by the Rynjin. Her last dying words were to me. I can avenge their deaths by checking their Black Box; I then gave these coordinates to Z'Ant. Unfortunately, the T'Rang have no weapon to attack the Black Ship by themselves. This is when the Alliance Quest comes in, but first, Drazic and Rodan have to be rescued.
I wonder if breaking into the Rapax Away Camp and slaughtering everybody except Drazic, Rodan, and the Rapax Queen (you can unlock her cell, but she never leaves), is the way to go? I'm certainly high enough level, though that battle can take around an hour. This would avoid having to do the Templar Quest, and besides, all is forgiven once I do a certain favor for Al-Sedexus.
Edit: Can I mess up the game by doing this? The Rapax Templar start out neutral, and they stand at the Rapax Away Camp entrance, warning me to "leave and we won't follow you". If I make the Rapax Templar faction hostile, then I may be attacked by them in the Rapax Castle, preventing me from doing the Rapax Templar initiation. I know that Ferro is always friendly, however (he's all business).

Except that I've been ignoring that skill with my Ranger and she's doing well with her Giant Sword.

I'm pretty sure you don't have to go to any place where there are Templars to complete the initiation.

One rather curious fact:
* If you talk to Antone about the Dark Savant Alliance, he will get angry and attack.
* But if you talk to Ferro about it, even if not a templar, he talks about the alliance in a positive manner, while still remaining friendly.


I believe there's one other way to mess up your game. Set a portal in the cave in the Wilderness Clearing, and make sure you have not portals elsewhere. Then, get at least 2 artifacts, then cast Return to Portal. You are now in the cave with the Rapax Queen and no way out. This, I believe, is a softlock.