Greetings. I'm the first to admit that I'm out of the loop when it comes to the 'Enhanced Editions' (EE) of "Baldur's Gate", "Baldur's Gate II", "Icewind Dale", and "Planescape:Torment". I just never saw a reason to buy the EE versions of the other games since I had the originals and could mod them to work. That being said, the EE of "Neverwinter Nights" is the first time I've seen a reason to want to purchase one. I've had my fair share of graphical glitches with the original from driver issues. Furthermore, the EE Deluxe Edition comes with the long unavailable DRM Premium Modules. On top of it all, the introductory price looks more than tempting for someone like myself with an original copy. Everything seems to line up for a purchase, but I keep seeing criticism of Beamdog. Positive reviews of the other EE games talk about the improvements made to the game, but negative reviews seem to exist to spit venom at Beamdog more than to criticize the state of the EE game being reviewed. This has me concerned about making a purchase from this publisher. I'm not expecting a company to be a saint in a capitalist system, but what is driving this poor view of Beamdog? Did Beamdog really mishandle the other games? Are bugs in Beamdog versions really that bad? Did changes Beamdog make to past EE really deviate that drastically from the original editions? I want to make this purchase of NWEE. But if I'm going to do the purchase, I want to be as fully aware of the nature of the publisher as possible going in or if they are even a good company to buy from in the first place.

Beamdog made some mistakes in the past, also some people are mad at the fact that they have to pay again for the games, also there was a bullshit controversy about a transgender char that speaks 4 lines of dialogue in the Siege of Dragonspear expansion.

People just forget that some Beamdog members are former bioware members.

A lot of the hate still carries from when they first re-released the BG games.

-As I understand it, there were a LOT of bugs when the BG EE games were first released. Journal didn't work right, scrolling was a pain, graphics were screwy, settings didn't work right, all kinds of stuff. I also gather that a lot of these bugs have been worked out; there are reports of bugs that are still present, and there are reports that some bug reports have just been removed from the bug report list.

-There are complaints about how the extra content clashed with the existing content.

-There were complaints about how Beamdog added very little to the games that wasn't already done by mods.

-The EE editions were incompatible with nearly all mods when they were first released. Some, but not all, mods have been created or updated to work with EE.

-There were complaints about how the graphics were made very ugly. I gather that options were eventually added that let people (more or less) use the old graphics.

-There were complaints about how certain social justice issues were being ham-fistedly pushed in the games.

-There were statements by Beamdog reps about how mysogynist gamers were downvoting the game because they were mysogynist. I've seen one post by a company rep that almost-but-not-specifically asked people on the Beamdog forum to upvote the game because it was being downvoted.

-There was at least one in-game direct jab at GG, which was later removed.

-There are complaints about how Beamdog had the originals removed so that only the EE's are available, and at twice the price.

-Beamdog directly lied about why/how the original versions of the BG games were removed from GOG (they originally said they had nothing to do with it, that the removals were all GOG's doing). They later backtracked on this claim.

-I've heard reports of anti-Beamdog views being suppressed on the Beamdog forums, while users who hostilely piled onto anti-Beamdog posts were left alone.

-There are complaints about how Siege of Dragonspire had a terrible story.

-Beamdog writers directly said they changed certain female characters (Jaheira and Safana) for Siege simply because the writer(s) didn't like how the female characters acted/spoke (the characters were apparently written mysogynistically). This was received about as well as you might expect.

-And of course there is in-fighting going on between those who like Beamdog/BG:EE and those who hate Beamdog/BG:EE, and lots of mischaracterization and personal attacks from both sides keep the hate flowing. See Captainchicken's post in this very thread as an example from the Beamdog side.

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I've heard some of the anti-BG:EE say good things about the IWD:EE games, that a lot of the problems plaguing the BG:EE games weren't a problem in IWD:EE.

-Some of the NWN:EE complains are about how Beamdog jacked up the price (again, removing the originals) but didn't really add any content to the game, while BD supporters say the changes were all under-the-hood (making multiplayer easier to do, adding support for modern OS, adding certain tools to make modding easier).

Beamdog don't have a very good PR track record. They also have a less-than-stellar track record in general. A PR bot got caught out misleading people on these very forums (to be fair, only through ignorance, but they had to apologize).

"Did changes Beamdog make to past EE really deviate that drastically from the original editions?"

Yes, they did. Take for example:

https://lilura1.blogspot.com/2016/12/Icewind-Dale-Enhanced-Edition-Review.html
https://lilura1.blogspot.com/2017/08/Baldurs-Gate-2-Changes-and-Additions.html

Beamdog don't know what game-balance is. They also removed a lot of the original artwork (cutscenes, UI backdrops) just because they didn't fit their awful-looking current gen UI.

"People just forget that some Beamdog members are former bioware members".

Only a few of them are former BioWare members. That != BioWare from 1999-2003. Different era, different corporate culture. Also, none of their employees were involved in the dev-cycle of BG, BG2, IWD or PS:T (all of which they "enhanced").

What bothers GoG posters the most is that they remove the originals as separate purchases and bundle them with their "Enhanced" editions in order to ensure that the original doesn't outsell their edition, and that their edition essentially becomes the only edition. They want to control the narrative of Infinity and Aurora (their bots spam public venues and throw around the word "official" like it means anything). Their versions are not even objectively superior because they are imbalanced and riddled with bugs. Even after five years of patching and updating, their versions still have bugs. Also, they are more expensive than the original, now-removed purchase.

In addition, in many ways (not all), NWN2 has for years been NWN:"EE." Many of the improvements Beamdog are looking into are by default extant in NWN2 (and NWN:EE will never have terrain sculpting, true full party control, XML UI, a toolset as powerful as Electron, or a real-time overland map).

Here are some GoG threads to check out:

Apology:
https://www.gog.com/forum/planescape_torment/regarding_the_removal_of_the_original_ie_games_from_sale_on_gog
In relation to:
https://www.gog.com/forum/general/release_planescape_torment_enhanced_edition_7fa05/post117
https://www.gog.com/forum/general/release_planescape_torment_enhanced_edition_7fa05/post149

Other threads filled with love for Beamdog:

https://www.gog.com/forum/neverwinter_nights_series/buy_nwn1_asap/page1
https://www.gog.com/forum/neverwinter_nights_series/nwn_1_enhanced_edition_beamdog
https://www.gog.com/forum/neverwinter_nights_series/breaking_news_beamdog_strikes_agian
https://www.gog.com/forum/general/neverwinter_nights_enhanced_edition
https://www.gog.com/forum/neverwinter_nights_series/neverwinter_nights_enhanced_edition_steam_release_date_confirmed_gog_release_date
https://www.gog.com/forum/general/the_revival_of_neverwinter_nights_campaign
https://www.gog.com/wishlist/games/do_not_remove_the_original_neverwinter_from_the_store
https://www.gog.com/forum/general/gog_deleted_the_beamdog_is_the_parasite_of_the_industrygogmix

Did you actually try the Enhanced Edition of Neverwinter Nights? it really IS NOT good. as a matter of fact my copy crashes in the tutorial and I can't rogress any further.

My case isn't really hate for them, I like the rest of the work, aside from the seige of dragonspear that was mentioned earlier, I don't care about the transgender character, but lets be honest, back in time then they would have killed you for such, tolerance towards such has been ENFORCED since the 80's, relatively new idea yet, is a stupid idea at that. (Lets be honest, if you can't be happy as YOU ARE, your not gonna change it by making yourself something YOU AREN'T, it is just not possible).

as far as the rest of their work I myself am happy with it all (meaning planescape EE. Baldurs Gate 1 & 2 EE and Icewind Dale EE), own all of them on PC here at Gog, own them at Steam as well, and Have them all at the playstore on top of that (3 copies apeice).

I don't think they playtested this new version of neverwinter nights, pretty bad. and 50$ for a "deluxe" version of a game that old.. someone is on drugs, and it is the people at beamdog.

Thank you Captainchicken84, Bookwyrm627, Lilura, and capricorn1971ad for replying to my post. After reading through your responses and the links provided, I think I have an understanding of the situation condensed to the following points:

* First, Beamdog is a legitimate company that takes over the licenses of older Bioware games. Beamdog does do 'enhancement' work and does offer support for newer operating systems. At the same time, Beamdog does push for the removal of the original game from sale on the storefront.

* Second, much of the hate for Beamdog seems to stem from Beamdog's handling of the Baldur's Gate Series. This seems to be their first big contract and they messed it up. BG:EE had questionable content added. BGII:EE was of questionable value. BG:SoD was an unnecessary bit of fanon with tastelessly added gender politics. In general, it's best to stay away from the Beamdog versions of the Baldur's Gate Series if the originals are already in your collection.

* Third, IWD:EE and PT:EE are characteristically better Beamdog products. There are still problems/bugs with both, but they don't suffer from the same level of problematic 'enhancement' that originally earned Beamdog so much hate.

Based on what I'm seeing, Beamdog sounds like a company trying to balance both making a quick buck off the classics while providing an updated and supported product that the fan base will love. It also sounds like they don't have very good talent when it comes to that balance.

I think I will purchase NWN:EE. I already have NWN:DE in my collection and I have had issues running it. Beamdog may not be the best company, but at least having an active company supporting the product means that there is a chance that there will be more compatibility patches in the future.

Siege of Dragonspear is fine, just try it out by yourself, there's just one transgender char who can be easily avoided, and only talks a few lines of dialogue anyway. Seems you might have fallen for the trolls and beamdog haters already....you know, it's hip to hate on beamdog now. ;)

That's a weird criticism to bring up though. NWN and NWN2 are completely different games with their own fanbases, and their own pool of modules (and no compatibility between the two). I'm also pretty confident that many in the NWN fanbase would not agree with NWN2 being a better version of NWN, but that's a matter of opinion.

I personally agree with everything except for this point. As it stands now, the Baldur's Gate: Enhanced Editions are superior to the orginials. A lot of the bugs have been squished and the company keeps improving the game. Added kits and classes (such as the Shaman) breath new life into a game that many have already played thousands of time. The Black Pits is also an over looked gem that came with the games.

Added content is opinion based. If one does not want to play with the new companions, they can be ignored (maybe after a forced cutscene, but they still can be). A person also has to remember that they were tredding into unfamiliar territory when attempting to enhance the Baldur's Gate trilogy. Adding additional content was part of the way they thought they'd be able to sway people who already had the game to repurchase it. Once the BG1 & 2 were released, they realized that this extra content wasn't needed.

SoD is worth a play through. It's about a 7/10. Its main problem is that it suffered from a lack of scope. A lot of the characters are fantastically written (once again, my opinion) and the dungeons and encounters through out are great with AI employing better tactics. There are multiple paths to completing a majority of the quests as well. I'd say check out the Steam reviews for a better reflection of SoD as a person needs to own the game there to write one.

~
Neverwinter Nights is also Trent's baby. A lot of the work done on this game have been under the hood, however, they reached out to people still working on the old version of the game for their input on what they would like fixed. I think that is a telling sign of them taking the gaming community around this title serioously.

They do keep pushing out updates for it (more frequently than the IE games) and I personally expect that trend to continue. It is a niche game however, and they can't resort a lot of man power to it, so expect slow progress on things like graphics.

I'd be the first to tell you their PR sucks, but they do have a passion for the titles they work on. I am glad you are giving the game a chance.

The EEs are not objectively superior to the originals. They have imbalanced BG and IWD with BG2 content. They have self-injected their own bugs that weren't in the originals. They have added fan fiction-level drivel to BG and BG2. They have removed original art because it wasn't compatible with their ugly and clunky UI "enhancements". In the case of IWD:EE, they have failed to include a key feature in party arbitration. They have broken compatibility with mods over the last 5 years, on and off. The EEs have been updated and patched for 5 years and they are still being updated/patched whereas the originals have been in an authoritative state for 15 or so years. The community also fixed many bugs and added lots of content long before the EEs came out. Thus, it is easy to see that for many people the originals are where it's at.

If one wants to play the games as the original devs intended, how they have been for 15 or so years, and not how a bunch of people who came along 10 years later and weren't involved in the development of the originals flippantly changed the game to suit their own "taste", one will play and prefer the originals. In my email correspondence their PR was professional and friendly (Lee Guile). I also don't doubt Trent Oster's professionalism; I interviewed him and found his responses to be open, honest and informative (though I don't agree with some of the things he said). It is just one of their low-tier PR bots that has made a couple of mistakes. It is odd that Beamdog would hire someone for PR whose native language isn't English. A PR bot should have mastery of the English language in order to communicate effectively with the public.

Maybe I'm "special" in that I play, enjoy and commentate on both NWN and NWN2. And the Infinity Engine games such as BG, IWD and PS:T. Thus, I have no bias. But no, I'm not special and unique because I know a lot of people that play Infinity, Aurora and Electron. My readership, for example. I know there are also fanatics in each camp that attempt to devalue the other camps at every opportunity, and if there isn't one they attempt to create it. These people mostly wallow on the Beamdog forums, from which I was banned. Yes, I insulted them but what can you do, I'm a Codexer, and I've been banned from pretty much every RPG-related site, anyway. Someone who gets 1 mil views per year on their own platform is hardly gonna care about being banned from an insipid echo chamber like that.

Basically, anyone who shitcans the one or the other gets written off by me.

I thought Trent Oster was one of Bioware founders and was personally involved in the development of BG and NWN. Isn't that so?

afaik, he did some modelling on BG but he was never involved in anything remotely resembling a heavy capacity with the original IEs.

OTOH, he was director and producer on NWN, in which he was obviously one of the major spear-heads (for good and for bad). The point I made before was that the Beamdog crew currently deving EE is a far cry from the BioWare crew that made the original NWN (as well as being a different era/corporate culture).

Just look at how different the IE:EEs are compared to the originals to see the effect of that.

I've said it before, but I wouldn't care if Tim Cain came back and made Fallout: EE; it wouldn't be the authoritative version. The original Interplay version would remain authoritative.

Trent Oster is one of the six Bioware founders. He also founded Beamdog with Cameron Tofer. Both are credited in the original BG under "3D modeling" and "additional programming". Their involvement with those games is overstated by Beamdog in order to make people think that the EEs were made by the same team and are therefore legitimate. I find that to be a stretch, specially considering the lead designer (James Ohlen) and writer (Lukas Kristjanson) haven't been involved.

NWN is a different story, as Oster was the original lead designer. PST:EE was also overseen by Chris Avellone. Not by coincidence, those haven't been mangled by questionable additions and changes.