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CthuluIsSpy: And of course, there's always the case of the Russians in World War II; they used quite a few women in their ranks as Tank Operators and especially snipers, so there is a precedence.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snipers_of_the_Soviet_Union
Yes - and we all know how well the Soviet Union turned out :)

In seriousness: I believe there's mandatory military service for women in Israel, so you don't have to look back to WW2 for an example.
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Red_Avatar: , women were allowed in the ranks but turns out that almost none could pass the exam (written and physical).
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orcishgamer: Exactly what was keeping the women from passing a written test?
Written test included psychological profiling, mental endurance tests and stress tests. Basically, all the mental and psychological parts like staying cool under pressure, etc. Don't ask me why many failed, it was just reported that they did.
God, this topic is so dumb. Both genders have their own categories in sports and everyone understands why - but once someone talks about women in the military it's that whole "meeeeh, equality" shit all over again. You don't want to put people's lives at risk just to make little Sally's dream come true.
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orcishgamer: Exactly what was keeping the women from passing a written test?
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Red_Avatar: Written test included psychological profiling, mental endurance tests and stress tests. Basically, all the mental and psychological parts like staying cool under pressure, etc. Don't ask me why many failed, it was just reported that they did.
I wouldn't have called those "written" then, I would call them psych tests. At any rate, if they were written to specifically assess men then it's not surprising that women would often fail them. If they performed a valid assessment of both sexes then who the fuck knows? I don't.
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CthuluIsSpy: And of course, there's always the case of the Russians in World War II; they used quite a few women in their ranks as Tank Operators and especially snipers, so there is a precedence.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snipers_of_the_Soviet_Union
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Jonni: Yes - and we all know how well the Soviet Union turned out :)

In seriousness: I believe there's mandatory military service for women in Israel, so you don't have to look back to WW2 for an example.
Why yes, there is compulsory military service in Israel, regardless of gender. I had forgotten about that.

The Roman Empire used only men for their Legions, and we know how they turned out as well :D
Post edited January 29, 2013 by CthuluIsSpy
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F4LL0UT: God, this topic is so dumb. Both genders have their own categories in sports and everyone understands why - but once someone talks about women in the military it's that whole "meeeeh, equality" shit all over again. You don't want to put people's lives at risk just to make little Sally's dream come true.
I agree, because in the military muscle mass vs. body ratio is the only thing that matters!
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Red_Avatar: Written test included psychological profiling, mental endurance tests and stress tests. Basically, all the mental and psychological parts like staying cool under pressure, etc. Don't ask me why many failed, it was just reported that they did.
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orcishgamer: I wouldn't have called those "written" then, I would call them psych tests. At any rate, if they were written to specifically assess men then it's not surprising that women would often fail them. If they performed a valid assessment of both sexes then who the fuck knows? I don't.
When I said "written" I basically added all the tests that involved, well, writing and not physical aspects and that DOES include psych and other tests. And when it's clear that many of the women who want to join aren't emotionally ready to do the job that was needed, then they should have failed, full stop. State police (which no longer exists now) dealt with all the big crimes - murder, robbery, drug smuggling, etc. They saw more action than a soldier would so were trained just as hard.

And duh, of course the tests were adjusted and even checked and approved to make sure they were fair. This wasn't the US ;).
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F4LL0UT: God, this topic is so dumb. Both genders have their own categories in sports and everyone understands why - but once someone talks about women in the military it's that whole "meeeeh, equality" shit all over again. You don't want to put people's lives at risk just to make little Sally's dream come true.
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amok: I agree, because in the military muscle mass vs. body ratio is the only thing that matters!
Dude, that kind of argument doesn't even work for men, so just because they are women it's suddenly supposed to be good enough? Sexist!

And what matters more is the psychological influence the presence of women has on men. I know, all those feminists out there treat this argument like bullshit but seriously, ANYONE knows that female presence (especially in a predominantly male group) has all sorts of effects on male behavior. And when I read or hear reports by soldiers who say that they can't focus because some protective instinct kicks in and they all care too much about that one female comrade I fucking believe it. But yeah, what do they know, they are just soldiers and probably sexists and blablabla...
Post edited January 29, 2013 by F4LL0UT
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amok: I agree, because in the military muscle mass vs. body ratio is the only thing that matters!
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F4LL0UT: Dude, that kind of argument doesn't even work for men, so just because they are women it's suddenly supposed to be good enough? Sexist!

And what matters more is the psychological influence the presence of women has on men. I know, all those feminists out there treat this argument like bullshit but seriously, ANYONE knows that female presence (especially in a predominantly male group) has all sorts of effects on male behavior. And when I read or hear reports by soldiers who say that they can't focus because some protective instinct kicks in and they all care too much about that one female comrade I fucking believe it. But yeah, what do they know, they are just soldiers and probably sexists and blablabla...
Cultural conditioning for the win!
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amok: Cultural conditioning for the win!
Yeah, because there is no such thing as hormones, that makes us pick mates, fornicate etc., it's all this damn culture! In fact even men could give birth if they just wanted to!
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CthuluIsSpy: The Roman Empire used only men for their Legions, and we know how they turned out as well :D
Uh, pretty... well?
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CthuluIsSpy: The Roman Empire used only men for their Legions, and we know how they turned out as well :D
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WBGhiro: Uh, pretty... well?
Not really. They kinda collapsed and went all decadent in the end. For all of its glory, the Roman Empire wasn't a very nice place to live. Unless you were a Roman noble.

But you have a point; I could have provided a better example, but that would involve godwinning the thread.
And I will not be that guy today.
Post edited January 29, 2013 by CthuluIsSpy
Our army has women in the rank-and-file. It's important to note how much fucks everyone gives. None whatsoever.

And from my personal experience, (some) women are damn tough bastards while holding an assault rifle.
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CthuluIsSpy: [ ...] the Roman Empire wasn't a very nice place to live. Unless you were a Roman noble.
So the same as in every other place on Earth at any point in time?

And I seriously doubt that the downfall of the Roman empire was due to their army failing.
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WBGhiro: Uh, pretty... well?
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CthuluIsSpy: Not really. They kinda collapsed and went all decadent in the end. For all of its glory, the Roman Empire wasn't a very nice place to live. Unless you were a Roman noble.

But you have a point; I could have provided a better example, but that would involve godwinning the thread.
And I will not be that guy today.
True, after 1000 years or so, they had a pretty good run:)