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Tarm: Guys. All of you. Honestly I can't see how this can be the customers fault. This is a case of the customer having to adapt to a business marketing practice. That's just backwards. Marketing should come to the customer and not the other way around.
I think this is where you are fundamentally unclear about something -- most large businesses are in it to maximize profit, end of story. Almost all successful marketing strategies involve an element of psychological manipulation, and are meant to cause a person to take an active role in either purchasing that product/service or creating some sort of brand loyalty/image in their mind. Passive marketing that makes the customer easily able to ignore it is not effective marketing for the profit-driven business.

Where the line is drawn on what is ethical is certainly debatable, and I think this is a worthwhile discussion. Personally, I feel that the flash sale promotion tactic still allows for a lot of freedom of choice and I do not view it as inherently deceptive -- particularly as in any case the games are still discounted from their full value anyways. I think that certain branding and addiction tactics by companies like McDonald's and Coca-Cola are much worse, and also cause much more harm in the form of actively creating health problems for millions of people.
Post edited December 23, 2014 by the.kuribo
But how is the a Steam or even online videogame specific thing? How is this different from Black Friday sales? When I used to work retail I had people who would get pissed that they bought something for a certain price only to have it go on sale on Black Friday as a special for considerably less. This isn't a Steam thing, its a retail thing. Its gets people in the proverbial door to buy other stuff too.

You can debate the merits of this practice, but it seems to me that Steam's version is just sped up.
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Tarm: Greetings.

I got mad at one of steams flash sales which "cost" me 20% today. Started a thread about it on steam and promptly got swarmed by steam fanboys completely missing my point and saying it's all my fault.
Yeah I should have known but this is one of the times I got really irritated at steams sales policy.

I haven't decided if I should keep trying in the thread but here's the link if anyone is interested. :P
http://steamcommunity.com/app/289130/discussions/0/619574421563376801/?tscn=1419276281
Next time come here to complain about Steam. Here, there is only a 50% chance you will be swarmed by Steam fan boys. But there, in the heart of Mordor...it is guaranteed. But you weren't just attacked by Steam fan boys because Steam didn't do anything wrong(unethical). You were just ignorant when it comes to what goes on during the Steam holiday sales. Nothing wrong with that. Nobody is guilty of anything. Best to just move on.
Post edited December 23, 2014 by monkeydelarge
Tarm, I understand the anger you are feeling about this, and I agree it feels deceptive. I also feel you had a bad response from the Steam forums as most seemed to be ridiculing you--a typical troll response--without putting much effort into their posts.

I would like to point out that this marketing ploy was used long before Steam was more than just an idea. Even then, people would also feel betrayed as this is a normal reaction to this practice. Marketers must therefore strike a careful balance so as not to alienate consumers who purchased at full price versus those that purchased the next day for say, 99% off. I often wonder what anyone who's purchased a mobile app must feel finding out the app they purchased went free for promotion shortly after.

I know first-hand that even credit card companies use this tactic in soliciting new customers. They take the list they wish to solicit and offer an introductory APR of one percentage. Then, after the rounds are made soliciting them, they reduce the percentage and re-solicit the same group. The previous group that applied don't know about this, and the others probably don't remember the first solicitation.

Bottom line: at least the emotional response you had will help curb the instinctual buying reaction.
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Tarm: *snip*
I understand, I've had a similar issue myself which led to my boycott of purchasing any games requiring Steam for more than a year. Steam can get away with many illegal activities because the Consumer Watchdogs (like my own ACCC) are so technologically archaic, it's breeds a certain level of megalomania into the Support staff & those Zealots normally referred to as Fan-boys.

[Edit]: I probably should have added this next part as I've read a heap on Steam today.

Use Firefox or Chrome with the Enhanced Steam add-on before purchasing anything. This small add-on injects extra information onto the page when viewing games in the Steam store, invaluable information about the price you should pay. If you intend to continue using Steam, get it.
Post edited December 23, 2014 by Ebany
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Tarm: *snip*
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Ebany: I understand, I've had a similar issue myself which led to my boycott of purchasing any games requiring Steam for more than a year. Steam can get away with many illegal activities because the Consumer Watchdogs (like my own ACCC) are so technologically archaic, it's breeds a certain level of megalomania into the Support staff & those Zealots normally referred to as Fan-boys.
You boycotted Steam because you bought a game and missed out on a later deal that was better because you didn't know better?
I'm fairly sure there is nothing illegal in changing the discount of a product in any way shape or form, at least not in any capitalism-based Western society. Which most of us are in.
Immoral? I disagree, it's a very well signposted deal, and frankly, if you buy at anything less than 100% there's always a RISK of the product later being available for a better price. The question is how much later and how much risk there is. If I have to wait ten years for the price of something that I want now to drop, then chances are I'm going to buy it now every time. If I have to wait ten minutes to see if something is going to be lower than full price, chances are I'll wait every time. The balance comes in between the two scenarios, and if you approach it sensibly enough it's simply balancing two risks-that of the game coming off special, and that of it going on greater special.
If Steam was duplicitous about how their flash sales worked, then I would consider it immoral.
But as it is, they're about as fair as they can be without locking prices. Even if they went on sale for half the year, there would be people at the end of the sale complaining they missed out, and people at the beginning of the sale complaining that they missed out.
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JMich: I'm not sure about the flash sales. I do recall that the community voting started on GOG though, back in Battle of the Games.
Daily sales probably predate steam as well.

Either way, just like you've been answered in the Steam thread, you value your time more than your money. You spent ~€5 so you won't have to spend so much time on Steam, waiting for a better deal. Same reason quite a few people buy the games they want as soon as GOG sale starts, and why so many people disliked Insomnia sales (did you rant about Insomnia sale btw? It did "force" you to spend most of your time on said distributor, to save a couple of bucks).
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Tarm: Nope I don't think I've ranted about this before. :P

Guys. All of you. Honestly I can't see how this can be the customers fault. This is a case of the customer having to adapt to a business marketing practice. That's just backwards. Marketing should come to the customer and not the other way around.
This is an example of continuation. You keep watching shows to find out what happens next. Turner did something like this back in the 80's/90's. They would run programs from 5 after the hour or half hour till 5 after. The logic is that you're watching my channel to see your show, and once it ends, other shows are already in progress, so you'll keep watching my channel because you'll see my next show in its entirety.

It's not despicable, it's not dishonest, it's just marketing. The goal is to get you to pay attention and spend money. It works. People lacking the will power to wait, or the time, or who just don't mind paying a little more are the ones they like buying anyhow. So congratulations. As much as you hate their marketing practice that obviously works, you're their target audience.
I see the most titles are almost the same as the last few sales. There are few titles that have a bit higer discount than before, but nah... I decided to pass on this one.

Edit:
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rtcvb32: "And here's this game which is 75% off... like it was last time... and the time before that..."

"And here's another steam sale, and this game is on sale again. I'm sure by now everyone has this game"

- TB
This. :)
Post edited December 23, 2014 by astropup
who cares if you lost out on a small deal :/ just move on and enjoy life ;)
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Nirth: The answers at Steam is not surprising though, you can't say anything there without the assholes come swarming on you. Another good lesson, only start a thread if absolutely necessary.
Make that two important lessons, and a game still sounds like a pretty good deal
This kind of thing always happens. I've seen people say it about GOG sales (that they bought just before the price drop), which aren't that different from Steam's.
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astropup: I see the most titles are almost the same as the last few sales. There are few titles that have a bit higer discount than before, but nah... I decided to pass on this one.
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rtcvb32: "And here's this game which is 75% off... like it was last time... and the time before that..." - TB
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astropup: This. :)
It's paraphrased. Thinking about it now it might have been closer as 'And this game is 80% off, like it is on every single steam sale' or something really close to that. Actually I could probably start adding more and more phrases from him.

I don't know, I just like TB's voice and general attitude regarding ethnics in gaming. I've watched most of his WTF's and currently listening to him and cox banter on Terraria (like 3 years ago).
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Tarm: Steam doing sneaky sales is the customers fault? Hmmm...
Yep, welcome to the upside down world of the 21st century, where caveat emptor has returned with a vengeance because so many consumers act against their own self interests.

It's also the consumers fault when they buy a game that doesn't run on their machine and it's ALWAYS, ALWAYS the customer's fault when anything, anywhere, anytime goes wrong with regard to Steam [or insert any name here, including GOG] to Steam [or insert any name here, including GOG] fanboys. Which is a significant amount of Steam's [or insert any name here, including GOG] consumer base.

It doesn't matter how legitimate the beef is, there will always be someone that will defend Steam [or insert any name here, including GOG] no matter what. It's the damndest thing, but it is a corporate wet dream to have undying loyal fans instead of critical, demanding consumers.
One time I went in and paid for gas at $2.85/gallon and then by the time I was done pumping they had changed it to $2.81/gallon. FUCKERS. That's how you deal with it, you just yell FUCKERS, really loudly. It'll be okay.