It seems that you're using an outdated browser. Some things may not work as they should (or don't work at all).
We suggest you upgrade newer and better browser like: Chrome, Firefox, Internet Explorer or Opera

×
avatar
IAmSinistar: As for whether having belief versus not makes one more motivated, I could argue that believers are less like to strive and work for change because they believe faith is enough, and that someone higher power will take care of the hard parts for them. This supposition is just as anecdotal as yours though, and I don't have any figures as to whether it is accurate.
It has been accurate at least in the past. At the turn of the first millenium (just before 1000 CE) in many parts of Europe economy and social life ground to a halt because there was an apocalyptic craze going on. People just expected the end of the world within weeks/days and stopped their daily business which lead to famines and other shortages, breakdown of communications and administrations and unrest. People who saw themselves as sinners beyond redemption went on violent rampages, pillaging and raping.

Also if you add to "work for change" in their lives you can count in all that religious suicide bombers. The promise of heaven lets them neglect the earthly life and what it has to offer. Their motivation is focused totally on the "beyond".

On a more "civil" scale: Feudalism could survive for centuries because it was taught as the "divine order of things". Rules were meant to rule since that is how some god(s) created the world. (Odin and Baldr included, the Norse legends also tell stories about how people are predestined to be Jarls, warriors or servant by their heritage.) Unrest occured when conditions got that bad that survival instincts kicked in, not because people rationally questioned this order. For centuries the majority of people was content with their place in the world. And also note that from the take-over Christianity in Rome until the Renaissance - when Christian europe slowly caught up to the knowledge of the ancient Greeks (by discovering their works, not by inventing themselves), when religion was cast in turmoil (the three bishops, reformation, Hus) and Humanism was "invented" - science and techological advance were almost absent from the Christian world.

On the other hand there was the (for it's time and compared to the Christian world) very advanced "Islamic medicine". This seems like a contradiction since Islam, at least in some of it's forms, is even more fatalistic (everything that happens to you is already decided by Allah). I have no real explanation for this, just a few hints that were beneficial:
- This science draw heavily from sources of ancient Greek, Indian (Ayurveda, popular even today) and ancient Iranian teachings. Other than the Christians they did not "burn the bridges" (or books).
- Many of the famed scholars were no muslims
- The muslimic world had a unifying "lingua franca" - Arabic, that was far more widely spread and natively spoken than the "Church-Latin". This fuelled communications and scientific intercourse across continents.

Sorry if this post is a little incoherent. Had to switch between typing and working (also typing for the most part ;-)) several times.
avatar
toxicTom: scientific intercourse
My imagination just ran off with your phrase.
avatar
grimwerk: My imagination just ran off with your phrase.
You have a dirty, dirty mind... ;-)
I am sorry for bumping this, but I just like to show you this new show on HBO called the Leftovers

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Shn1mPejr_4

Basically The Rapture happened with 2% of the population just dissappeared (no people ascending to the sky naked) and the story focused on the left behind people, specifically a number of characters.

Even children from age six or seven have been left behind.

Thoughts?
avatar
Elmofongo: I am sorry for bumping this, but I just like to show you this new show on HBO called the Leftovers

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Shn1mPejr_4

Basically The Rapture happened with 2% of the population just dissappeared (no people ascending to the sky naked) and the story focused on the left behind people, specifically a number of characters.

Even children from age six or seven have been left behind.

Thoughts?
Two words, face palm.
avatar
Elmofongo: I am sorry for bumping this, but I just like to show you this new show on HBO called the Leftovers

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Shn1mPejr_4

Basically The Rapture happened with 2% of the population just dissappeared (no people ascending to the sky naked) and the story focused on the left behind people, specifically a number of characters.

Even children from age six or seven have been left behind.

Thoughts?
avatar
pimpmonkey2382: Two words, face palm.
Its made from one of the creators of ABC's LOST.
Two awesome tv series that put our universe and scientific achievements into perspective.

Original 1980 (hosted by Carl Sagan)
Cosmos: A Personal Voyage

New 2014 (hosted by Neil deGrasse Tyson)
Cosmos: A Spacetime Odyssey

I can't post links, but if you want to see a cool short little clip, search for this on youtube:
"The Pale Blue Dot - Cosmos: A Space Time Odyssey"
avatar
grimwerk: My imagination just ran off with your phrase.
avatar
toxicTom: You have a dirty, dirty mind... ;-)
BUMP since I feel like I have something to say:

I just came to the realization that Religion in essance is a fandom. Christianity was just a sub-cult of Judism because someone made a fanfic of God having a Son and received pothsumous reception.

Than I look at Apple fans, Bronies, Trekkies, Creepypasta, even Game of Thrones fans and it hit me.

How long unitl all the old Religions will fall and be supplanted by a new generation of faiths in the future.

Appleism where the faithful worship their Messiah Steve Jobs and their Bibles are Ipads.

Bronyanity the popular religion of friendship with worshiping the twin Goddeses (Celestia and Luna) and the Holy Six, but than a sub cult appears where one of the Holy Six ascended to become a Goddess (Alicorn) herself and the the Holy Twin Goodesses became the Holy Trinity of Goddesses.

Creepypastas will sort of be evil demonic paganism. worshipping the evil Archdemons of Smile Dog., Ben, Sonic.exe, Slenderman, and Jeff the Killer by perforoming ritual sacfrices to become powerful half demons themselves.

Wow I really put way to much thought into this.
Good stuff:
http://www.atheistmemebase.com/tag/science/page/4/
no nooo noooooo! die thread! die!! die!!! DIEE!!!!

also, Bertrand Russel ftw
avatar
toxicTom: You have a dirty, dirty mind... ;-)
avatar
Elmofongo: BUMP since I feel like I have something to say:

I just came to the realization that Religion in essance is a fandom. Christianity was just a sub-cult of Judism because someone made a fanfic of God having a Son and received pothsumous reception.

Than I look at Apple fans, Bronies, Trekkies, Creepypasta, even Game of Thrones fans and it hit me.

How long unitl all the old Religions will fall and be supplanted by a new generation of faiths in the future.

Appleism where the faithful worship their Messiah Steve Jobs and their Bibles are Ipads.

Bronyanity the popular religion of friendship with worshiping the twin Goddeses (Celestia and Luna) and the Holy Six, but than a sub cult appears where one of the Holy Six ascended to become a Goddess (Alicorn) herself and the the Holy Twin Goodesses became the Holy Trinity of Goddesses.

Creepypastas will sort of be evil demonic paganism. worshipping the evil Archdemons of Smile Dog., Ben, Sonic.exe, Slenderman, and Jeff the Killer by perforoming ritual sacfrices to become powerful half demons themselves.

Wow I really put way to much thought into this.
"Think of it like a movie. The Torah is the first one, and the New Testament is the sequel. Then the Qu’ran comes out, and it retcons the last one like it never happened. There’s still Jesus, but he’s not the main character anymore, and the messiah hasn’t shown up yet.

Jews like the first movie, but ignored the sequels, Christians think you need to watch the first two, but the third one doesn’t count, Moslems think the third one was the best, and Mormons liked the second one so much they started writing fanfiction that doesn’t fit with ANY of the series canon."
Post edited November 13, 2014 by Soyeong
avatar
Elmofongo: BUMP since I feel like I have something to say:

I just came to the realization that Religion in essance is a fandom. Christianity was just a sub-cult of Judism because someone made a fanfic of God having a Son and received pothsumous reception.

Than I look at Apple fans, Bronies, Trekkies, Creepypasta, even Game of Thrones fans and it hit me.

How long unitl all the old Religions will fall and be supplanted by a new generation of faiths in the future.

Appleism where the faithful worship their Messiah Steve Jobs and their Bibles are Ipads.

Bronyanity the popular religion of friendship with worshiping the twin Goddeses (Celestia and Luna) and the Holy Six, but than a sub cult appears where one of the Holy Six ascended to become a Goddess (Alicorn) herself and the the Holy Twin Goodesses became the Holy Trinity of Goddesses.

Creepypastas will sort of be evil demonic paganism. worshipping the evil Archdemons of Smile Dog., Ben, Sonic.exe, Slenderman, and Jeff the Killer by perforoming ritual sacfrices to become powerful half demons themselves.

Wow I really put way to much thought into this.
avatar
Soyeong: "Think of it like a movie. The Torah is the first one, and the New Testament is the sequel. Then the Qu’ran comes out, and it retcons the last one like it never happened. There’s still Jesus, but he’s not the main character anymore, and the messiah hasn’t shown up yet.

Jews like the first movie, but ignored the sequels, Christians think you need to watch the first two, but the third one doesn’t count, Moslems think the third one was the best, and Mormons liked the second one so much they started writing fanfiction that doesn’t fit with ANY of the series canon."
Than some hipster came in and said, "Screw all 3 movies, they are overrated I rather watch Shinto."
Post edited November 13, 2014 by Elmofongo
avatar
Elmofongo: BUMP since I feel like I have something to say:

I just came to the realization that Religion in essance is a fandom. Christianity was just a sub-cult of Judism because someone made a fanfic of God having a Son and received pothsumous reception.
Religion is Man reaching out to God. Jesus is God reaching out to Man.

Your theory re sub-cult & fanfic is fallacious. There are numerous Jewish prophecies to the coming of the Messiah - which were all perfectly fulfilled in Jesus.

It was no coincidence that the prophecies turned out correct. It was divine revelation. Christianity is Judaism made perfect.

(edited to add extra thought)
Post edited November 18, 2014 by DRM_free_fan
avatar
DRM_free_fan: Religion is Man reaching out to God.
What about polytheists?

avatar
DRM_free_fan: Jesus is God reaching out to Man.
Which lead to human sacrifice/murder. Didn't go too well then...
avatar
Elmofongo: BUMP since I feel like I have something to say:

I just came to the realization that Religion in essance is a fandom. Christianity was just a sub-cult of Judism because someone made a fanfic of God having a Son and received pothsumous reception.
avatar
DRM_free_fan: Religion is Man reaching out to God. Jesus is God reaching out to Man.

Your theory re sub-cult & fanfic is fallacious. There are numerous Jewish prophecies to the coming of the Messiah - which were all perfectly fulfilled in Jesus.

It was no coincidence that the prophecies turned out correct. It was divine revelation. Christianity is Judaism made perfect.

(edited to add extra thought)
I was only kidding around and besides its an old post.

But I somewhat think that fandoms in time will become there own religeon. I mean Star Wars has a very small but real religeon or Cult callled Jediism:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jediism

The Matrix movies aswell:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matrixism

Bronys and Apple fandoms are close to BE their own Faiths I give it years.
avatar
DRM_free_fan: Religion is Man reaching out to God.
avatar
toxicTom: What about polytheists?

avatar
DRM_free_fan: Jesus is God reaching out to Man.
avatar
toxicTom: Which lead to human sacrifice/murder. Didn't go too well then...
One thing I have against the Abrahamic faiths is the arrogant belief that their God is the real god and ALL societies gods and faiths are false.

Who are you to come in and say your god/gods are false while this one is the true absolute real God. Especially I dislike the concept of Missions. Going to another person's entirely different culture and try to convert them away from their God/gods and faiths. Its cultural imperialism.
Post edited November 18, 2014 by Elmofongo