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InkPanther: Oh, and irony of your post is, that GOG started as a company fixing and selling old games not working on modern systems. Bugger off with your trolling.
Someone is butt hurt.
Post edited June 28, 2018 by Magmarock
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InkPanther: Oh, and irony of your post is, that GOG started as a company fixing and selling old games not working on modern systems. Bugger off with your trolling.
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Magmarock: Don't like it, start your own thread.
Why would I pass on an opportunity to point out you're laughable?

Linux is great and developing at an astounding rate. One day it may actually be a free, open source competitor to Windows. But as it stands now it lacks functionality and compatibility with too much software out there. To compete with Windows the system must become more Windows-like to be compatible with all the great things Windows offers. And for those that hate Micro$oft, yes there are GREAT things offered by the Windows platform to go with their shitty views on customer rights and users' control of their own machines.
OT: change a couple words here and there and this could be copy-pasted into a gOg Galaxy vs Steam client thread.

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I do hope Linux someday becomes an everyman alternative that doesn't require jumping through hoops to install and make into a day-to-day seamless and trouble-free experience. Without trying it myself - and just kinda watching from the sidelines - I do find this a bit telling:
You'd probably find some of the distros a lot less user-surly now.
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Linux is great and developing at an astounding rate. One day it may actually be a free, open source competitor to Windows. But as it stands now it lacks functionality and compatibility with too much software out there. To compete with Windows the system must become more Windows-like to be compatible with all the great things Windows offers. And for those that hate Micro$oft, yes there are GREAT things offered by the Windows platform to go with their shitty views on customer rights and users' control of their own machines.
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HereForTheBeer: OT: change a couple words here and there and this could be copy-pasted into a gOg Galaxy vs Steam client thread.

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I do hope Linux someday becomes an everyman alternative that doesn't require jumping through hoops to install and make into a day-to-day seamless and trouble-free experience. Without trying it myself - and just kinda watching from the sidelines - I do find this a bit telling:

You'd probably find some of the distros a lot less user-surly now.
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HereForTheBeer:
[edited]I've edited out the original comment. This is a Windows versus Linux but only in relation to DRM for installed software. That's what I meant to say.
Post edited June 25, 2018 by Magmarock
Around 15 years ago, I tried an old version of SuSe and hated almost everything about it. More recently though I tried the newest version of Linux Mint, and a lot of things are much better, especially for use as a simple web / office box. It can be quite jarring when changing from Windows / MS Office due to not just a different OS but all applications too and a lot of people throw in the towel on day one due to being overwhelmed with change. The key to success is probably dual-booting and gradual learning a little at a time over a year. It also helps when coming from Windows to familiarize on applications first (ie, a month before even installing Linux, get used to using LibreOffice, Firefox, Thunderbird, etc, for Windows so at least the "application learning experience" is reduced).

I still mostly use Windows though as my biggest frustration (other than many DirextX games) is "a lot of work in all the wrong areas". Eg, you've got potentially millions of coding hours spent "over-duplicating" DE's (Cinnamon, MATE, XFCE, KDE, GNOME, dozens I can't even remember), and yet simple but much needed stuff only needed to be written once, like full function drivers for Epson printers (eg, working ink monitoring / advanced page settings) is either unsupported or far harder work than it needs to be for many models. This is probably the downside to volunteer open-source development - no-one wants to write the boring unglamorous support code.

It has definitely improved from the past, and I hope it continues to do so but 1:1 replacement for DX-based Windows for gaming is definitely its weak spot, and it could certainly do with better drivers for non-HP branded peripherals.
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Magmarock: This isn't a Linux versus Windows conversation that I'm trying to have. I just want to know why the DRM free crowd wants to use something so dependent on internet connections.
You can mirror your own offline package repository if you wish to do so, or even mount the original installation media as a package repository in most cases. I assume you are aware of that?

As to why I sometimes use Linux for gaming, I can give you one clear example: Wine provides support for 16-bit executables while 64-bit Windows does not.
Post edited June 25, 2018 by WinterSnowfall
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Magmarock: This isn't a Linux versus Windows conversation that I'm trying to have. I just want to know why the DRM free crowd wants to use something so dependent on internet connections.
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Magmarock: My position on Linux and Windows.
By default it's a Windows-related conversation. If you think Linux is a shitty OS, then without going Apple what OS are you expecting people to use? And what OS are you expecting them to compare Linux it to, without using the same comparison that you started this thread with?
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Magmarock: My position on Linux and Windows.
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HereForTheBeer: By default it's a Windows-related conversation. If you think Linux is a shitty OS, then without going Apple what OS are you expecting people to use? And what OS are you expecting them to compare Linux it to, without using the same comparison that you started this thread with?
That did sound a bit dumb now that I think about it. I guess I want people to stay on topic and discuss how Linux improves your DRM free situation. I mean even the xbox lets you update your system offline with a usb stick.
Freedom of choice. I can and I do whatever I want with my Linux machines. I'm not dependent on microsoft/apple caprice. Everything work my way,

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Magmarock: This isn't a Linux versus Windows conversation that I'm trying to have. I just want to know why the DRM free crowd wants to use something so dependent on internet connections.
Could you read that for me again? ; )
Post edited June 25, 2018 by mike_cesara
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Magmarock: This isn't a Linux versus Windows conversation that I'm trying to have. I just want to know why the DRM free crowd wants to use something so dependent on internet connections.
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WinterSnowfall: You can mirror your own offline package repository if you wish to do so, or even mount the original installation media as a package repository in most cases. I assume you are aware of that?

As to why I sometimes use Linux for gaming, I can give you one clear example: Wine provides support for 16-bit executables while 64-bit Windows does not.
As in my original post mirroring the entire repository is very time consuming and a little over kill for how much of it you'll end up using. I've tried and didn't find it very practical.

How does Wine 16 support compare to dosbox though. I mean even dosbox works on Linux why use Wine?
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Magmarock: I guess I want people to stay on topic and discuss how Linux improves your DRM free situation. I mean even the xbox lets you update your system offline with a usb stick.
Okay. I don't use Linux and can't answer that directly. I think others have made valid counterpoints, in that any other OS we might use today will have similar problems. On the Linux side, at least you're not tied into what Apple and MS force you into updating.

Problems aren't limited to the OS: I can't update my GPU driver without losing the ability to change my screen brightness. Further, finding offline installers for drivers and third-party software can be tough to find since they don't want you doing this stuff offline for some reason.

Anyway, that's OT. haha. Sorry - couldn't help myself. But it's not just Linux with these issues.
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mike_cesara: Freedom of choice. I can and I do whatever I want with my Linux machines. I'm not dependent on microsoft/apple caprice. Everything work my way,

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Magmarock: This isn't a Linux versus Windows conversation that I'm trying to have. I just want to know why the DRM free crowd wants to use something so dependent on internet connections.
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mike_cesara: Could you read that for me again? ; )
Yeah that was a dumb comment oops.

While you might not depend on Microsoft or Apple you do depend on those repositories being maintained. What about that?
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Magmarock: I guess I want people to stay on topic and discuss how Linux improves your DRM free situation. I mean even the xbox lets you update your system offline with a usb stick.
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HereForTheBeer: Okay. I don't use Linux and can't answer that directly. I think others have made valid counterpoints, in that any other OS we might use today will have similar problems. On the Linux side, at least you're not tied into what Apple and MS force you into updating.

Problems aren't limited to the OS: I can't update my GPU driver without losing the ability to change my screen brightness. Further, finding offline installers for drivers and third-party software can be tough to find since they don't want you doing this stuff offline for some reason.

Anyway, that's OT. haha. Sorry - couldn't help myself. But it's not just Linux with these issues.
I work in IT and have to deal with a lot of nonsense especially when it comes to old laptops. But once you have the drivers and updates on your disk they're there and they will work. Linux uses repository. Imagine if Steam was an operating system. Like a "Steam OS" :P so to speak. It works like that. It uses a client and installs packages directly from the net. It doesn't download package installers like exe or anything. This is what bothers me so much.
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AB2012: Around 15 years ago, I tried an old version of SuSe and hated almost everything about it. More recently though I tried the newest version of Linux Mint, and a lot of things are much better, especially for use as a simple web / office box.
It wasn't just that it was different. It's that it installs everything from the web directly. I can see why some people like it. I can't see why GOG people like it.
Post edited June 25, 2018 by Magmarock
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Magmarock: How does Wine 16 support compare to dosbox though. I mean even dosbox works on Linux why use Wine?
I am glad you asked, because I have tried both :P.

While you can install Windows 3.11 in DOSBox to be able to run some of the games I'm referring to, in this case:
a) Performance will get somewhat terrible at times, mostly because DOSBox is not built with this approach in mind
b) Some things will crash (either consistently or when you least want them to)

Wine has stellar support for 16-bit programs. I can't remember ever having issues with 16-bit executables in Wine, come to think of it, and I've tried quite a few.
Post edited June 25, 2018 by WinterSnowfall
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Magmarock: We’re all GOG users and one of the reasons GOG is so much better then Steam is because the games are DRM free. From a practical standpoint this means you don’t need internet to get your software to work.
well no, you do need internet to download your games from GOG.
It seems kinda dumb to rant in a digital store about the fact that software is distributed digitally.

You seem to totally misunderstand what the "DRM-free" label is all about.