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General discussionThrowback Thursday: The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind(107 posts)(107 posts)
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Posted November 11, 2021
This week’s Throwback Thursday features a title from one of the most recognizable RPG series in the history of gaming – The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind GOTY Edition.

Elder Scrolls is the ultimate freeform adventure with epic tales of knights, thieves, dragons and magic. It is where enormous open worlds await and offer you a blank slate to make your own story. Morrowind is no exception and takes you on an epic adventure to explore a unique world full of strange and deadly creatures, different quests and stories where you make decisions that matter.



Let's hear from one of the GOG team members what are her's experiences with the game and why she loves The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind.

Recommended by Anna, Product Communication Manager at GOG

[i]Morrowind is a game that started my love for cRPGs. I discovered this game by chance as a kid - I was wondering what to play next (and I’ve just begun my lifelong adventure with PC gaming) and this game was added to my newly bought graphics card. I installed it and after the first minutes in Seyda Neen I knew that it was it - unique setting, weird monsters, and the freedom to just walk around Vvardenfell, visit different cities, read (a lot of) books, and do quests for different factions.

I go back to this game quite often (appreciating the music in the game even more) and go on an adventure with a newly created character. Morrowind is definitely a must play for everyone who loves cRPGs or looks for an unique open world setting and I hope that you will like it as much as I do. Just watch out for the cliff racers as they really want to follow you wherever you go ;) [/i]

Check out Piran Jade playing and streaming the game on GOG’s Twitch channel later today (Thursday, November 11th at 8 PM UTC).

The Throwback Thursday series is done in cooperation with The Video Games History Foundation – a non-profit organization dedicated to preserving, celebrating and teaching the history of video games. If you want to support them, we encourage you to check their donation page
Posted November 13, 2021
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dtgreene: A couple questions for those who've played the game and enjoyed it:
* Have you ever played through the main quest?
* Would you have still loved the game this much if it *didn't* have a main quest?

(I've never beaten the main quest of any Bethesda game, and the only ones I've played through part of are Arena and I believe Oblivion (though the latter probably only to allow Oblivion gates to open and get access to the master Restoration trainer).)

(One interesting thing about Morrowind is that, if you kill an essential NPC (which the game lets you do without exploits), the game displays a message that suggests the game may be unwinnable, but still lets you continue playing. Another interesting thing is that there's the "back path" to completing the main quest, if you can't (or don't want to) do it "properly", though it causes you to take a large amount of permanent health damage.)
There is a 'back path' to complete the main quest that you need to kill Vivec for but skips a lot of it like the corpus disease cure and early main quests parts, you don't even need to start the first main quest or hand in your package to Caius.

[url=https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Morrowind:Yagrum_Bagarn_and_Wraithguard]Morrowind:Yagrum Bagarn and Wraithguard[/url]
Post edited November 13, 2021 by Frogmancer
Posted November 13, 2021
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dtgreene: A couple questions for those who've played the game and enjoyed it:
* Have you ever played through the main quest?
* Would you have still loved the game this much if it *didn't* have a main quest?

(I've never beaten the main quest of any Bethesda game, and the only ones I've played through part of are Arena and I believe Oblivion (though the latter probably only to allow Oblivion gates to open and get access to the master Restoration trainer).)

(One interesting thing about Morrowind is that, if you kill an essential NPC (which the game lets you do without exploits), the game displays a message that suggests the game may be unwinnable, but still lets you continue playing. Another interesting thing is that there's the "back path" to completing the main quest, if you can't (or don't want to) do it "properly", though it causes you to take a large amount of permanent health damage.)
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Frogmancer: There is a 'back path' to complete the main quest that you need to kill Vivec for but skips a lot of it like the corpus disease cure and early main quests parts, you don't even need to start the first main quest or hand in your package to Caius.

[url=https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Morrowind:Yagrum_Bagarn_and_Wraithguard]Morrowind:Yagrum Bagarn and Wraithguard[/url]
Of course, there's also a third route. If you try to wield the necessary weapons without the needed other item, you will take health damage at a high rate. If you're able to survive that, you can still beat the final boss without killing Vivec and without properly doing the main quest.

This is what the any% speedrun does (though it uses a glitch that's since been patched to get the health). Without glitching, you can use super Fortify Health potions, but (assuming you're not using OpenMW or a certain Code Patch setting), you'll need to find some way to survive the fortify effects wearing off.

Incindentally, the way Fortify Health effects work in vanilla Morrowind is like an addictive substance. Essentially, you *must* keep using those effects to survive, in order to avoid dying when one wears off. Recovery is difficult but possible; you need to use a weaker effect to survive the stronger one, but with below your normal maximum HP; then you can use a Restore Health effect to regain health without fueling the dependence; then you just need to repeat with steadily weaker Fortify Health effects until you can survive the ending of the previous one. So tricky, but possible, and a rather interesting accidental (I think) mechanic.
Posted November 13, 2021
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Enebias: Ah, Morrowind. Never have I been THIS opportunist in a videogame!
Stealing everything that isn't nailed down, pickpocketing everyone, betraying any faction every time I gained something from it... good times.
Especially emptying the Hlaalu Vault in Vivec and the Indoril armory as early in the game as I could, so much good gear I shouldn't have had access to!
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BranjoHello: Then we played the game in very similar manner. :)
I just didn't betray anyone, because honor among thieves. xD

Dragging those huge heavy Dwemer cogs to nearest trader even though they are almost worthless...that's how you become a Morrowind millionaire. xD
My favorite playthrough was that time when I managed to take control of the ENTIRE criminal underworld of Vvardenfell.
I was the chief of House Hlaalu, Thieves guild, Morag Tong and allied with the Camonna Tong at the same time. Nothing was beyond my reach, the entirety of the illegal trade and a big part of the legal one was mine.
Posted November 14, 2021
The fun of the game does not come necessarily in doing every side quest available, but focusing in one or a couple of houses and roleplay with them, the game is rich and big enough to start over and doing things in a different way.

I am not saying it is not convenient or possible take the route of roaming and try to make quest in the mercenary way of things, but probably you can be overhewlmed and end up burnt of the game if you want to be extremely completionist.
The same with other brother games in the Elder Scrolls series. The are pretty flexible not forcing you to follow one fixed route. Or forced you to be completionist to be satisfied with the gigantic world or length of the game.
Posted November 14, 2021
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jackster79: I agree.

And I would argue that that is the point. If one plays Morrowind as intended (i.e. not do exploits or console cheats) one of the best feelings is naturally growing a character powerful enough that you finally come up with a creative way to overcome challenges, and if it makes your character overpowered, then, well, you have earned that privilege. Breaking game balance via player agency, done right, can be a very rewarding experience.

I found it so liberating being able to do this, balance be damned. From that point on rigidity with respect to magic, characters, etc always felt so suffocating, at least in the D&D world for sure. Though that may be more the fault of the design of the magic mechanics there than anything else...
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dtgreene: Take a look at the epic level rules from 3e Dungeons and Dragons (which you will find in the 3.5e SRD). There's rules for epic spellcasting, and the rues alow for creating your own spells, which in turn allows for breaking of game balance to Morrowind levels. (For example, you can create a spell that boosts your intelligence, which will allow you to meet the DCs needed to cast more powerful epic spells, including more powerful intelligence boosts.)

Unfortunately, no D&D game, to my knowledge, implements epic spellcasting with custom spells (you can only use the spells the game designer put into the game).

Then again, D&D 3.5 has a build known as "pun-pun", which uses an exploit to acquire a special abilities that was not written with player use in mind, and using it allows the player to break the game wide open. I would compare this to arbitrary code execution exploits in computer games; once you can get the game to execute your code, you can now do literally anything the platform the game is running on allows. (Note that this isn't quite the same thing as modding the game to run your own code, at which point you're basically taking the role of the game developer.)
I did not know that about 3rd ed. D&D. Interesting.

But I agree, the design of D&D is such you can only use what the system and the developers allow.

And again, that's the point.

The design is intentionally constraining.

Morrowind gave me a taste of life without those constraints, and it was so liberating.

I still enjoy games that are intentionally constrained by design.

I just view them differently post-TES3. I got a taste of the glorious freedom that was Morrowind and can now never go back and view any limiting system the same way ever again. Especially a sandbox game (for example: Kingdoms of Amalur: Reckoning).
Posted November 14, 2021
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jackster79: I agree.

And I would argue that that is the point. If one plays Morrowind as intended (i.e. not do exploits or console cheats) one of the best feelings is naturally growing a character powerful enough that you finally come up with a creative way to overcome challenges, and if it makes your character overpowered, then, well, you have earned that privilege. Breaking game balance via player agency, done right, can be a very rewarding experience.

I found it so liberating being able to do this, balance be damned. From that point on rigidity with respect to magic, characters, etc always felt so suffocating, at least in the D&D world for sure. Though that may be more the fault of the design of the magic mechanics there than anything else...
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Frogmancer: Morrowind god mode for me comes once you get grand soul gems and summon golden saint scrolls and enchant exquisite clothes with constant effect restore health and fatigue on them, the shirt, trousers and belt can have restore 4 health and 10 fatigue a second split across them so you never run out.
That's fine.

You put in the work and came up with a creative way around the limitations in the game, and so as far as I am concerned you earned all the benefits that come with doing so.

Who cares if it made you overpowered?

If it bothers you then sell that gear and don't make any more like that.

If it doesn't bother you then use to your heart's content.

Your copy is yours to play however you wish. :-)

By the way: one suite of mods you might like that limit that kind of customization is B2B's Game Improvements. Dunno if it is still around but it is one I use. Personally I dislike the changes it makes to enchanting but I like many other changes and since the components are meant to all be used together I use them all. I think that once I get to it I will be making changes to that portion of the mod. If you have not used that mod and decide to try it out please let me know what you think.
Posted November 14, 2021
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dtgreene: A couple questions for those who've played the game and enjoyed it:
* Have you ever played through the main quest?
* Would you have still loved the game this much if it *didn't* have a main quest?
I have played through the main quest and completed it. It is well-written and worth doing - you uncover quite a lot about the Morrowind history/lore through playing it.

Second question: yes, I think I would have. In fact, the first time I played the game, I more or less ignored the main quest and just went off exploring, somewhat amazed at how much there was to do/explore. In my opinion, it is one of the game's biggest strengths - how much optional side content there is, to the extent that each person's playthrough will be quite unique.

In fact, a major criteria I use to judge how good an open-world game is, is how much fun you can have if you ignore the main quest and go off exploring in a random direction. Morrowind passes that test with flying colors and is the best example of an open-world RPG I have played.
Post edited November 14, 2021 by Time4Tea
Posted November 14, 2021
Another strong point in the game should be praised about is the art drection and the aesthetics of the game and the world.

Where Oblivion is a voluntary and self conscient cliché fantasy world, medieval centric tradition, and Skyrim is a Viking, Northern R.E. Howard's Cimmeria etc, Morrowid is completely original pseudoalien World. All is verymmersive From the Architecture, to the Culture system of Houses and Lore, or the creature and monsters, all is very strong and coherent in its originality. And mixed with that the contrast with the Imperials like a Frontier Roman Empire of some kind. It is probably one of my favourite world designs in a videogame.

Probably if they launch a new TES based in the southern lands and jungles the potential to make something equally original would be there. With inspiration in old Indo aesthetcs and other original ideas even in te monsters designs. Something original (coherent with the TES Lore) can be less popular than Skyrim or Obivion but I think that the Franchise is AAA and strong enough to take some risks and sell well after all.
Posted November 14, 2021
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dtgreene: A couple questions for those who've played the game and enjoyed it:
* Have you ever played through the main quest?
* Would you have still loved the game this much if it *didn't* have a main quest?

(I've never beaten the main quest of any Bethesda game, and the only ones I've played through part of are Arena and I believe Oblivion (though the latter probably only to allow Oblivion gates to open and get access to the master Restoration trainer).)

(One interesting thing about Morrowind is that, if you kill an essential NPC (which the game lets you do without exploits), the game displays a message that suggests the game may be unwinnable, but still lets you continue playing. Another interesting thing is that there's the "back path" to completing the main quest, if you can't (or don't want to) do it "properly", though it causes you to take a large amount of permanent health damage.)
I have never completed the main quests in The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind, because I always get distracted by doing the side quests and then just going and exploring the video games map and just killing NPC's and just taking every single item that I can take whenever I can and hoarding it in a house because I am a pack rat.

Then mods come into play where I keep downloading mods that add new armor, new dungeons, new NPC's, new quests, and new weapons.

Then there is the level uncapper mod, which lets me level up infinitely so I get distracted just wanting to keep on playing for hours and hours and hours and hours to level up infinitely and ignore the main quests.

Those are the reason why for me The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind is the best RPG video game in fact best video game for me, because of all of these things that The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind lets me do.

Not even The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion or The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim, which both of those video games I have beaten their main quests probably four times or something already is well these two The Elder Scrolls video games I just never have so much fun enjoying playing them like I do when I play The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind.

For me The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind has way more freedom to allow us to do anything and whenever we want more than The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion and The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim, with The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind having all NPC's killable, no essential immortal NPC's that cannot be killed. I hated when I saw Bethesda Game Studios add essential NPC's in The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion and in The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim.
Posted November 14, 2021
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Johnathanamz: For me The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind has way more freedom to allow us to do anything and whenever we want more than The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion and The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim, with The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind having all NPC's killable, no essential immortal NPC's that cannot be killed. I hated when I saw Bethesda Game Studios add essential NPC's in The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion and in The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim.
Morrowind does have essential NPCs; it's just that they are killable, unlike in Oblivion or Skyrim. It's just that, if you kill one of them, you get a message basically informing you of the fact that the game is now likely unwinnable. (Note that there are a few cases where the essential flag has the wrong value for an NPC.)

Arena and Daggerfall don't have essential NPCs because the game doesn't allow you to attack anyone important; your swing will just go through them harmlessly. (This also means that, in Daggerfall, you can't cast Charm on an NPC, which is a problem because I think that's the only use for the Charm effect, making it completely useless.) The common people who wander the town can be killed with a melee weapon (but not a spell, and I believe not a bow), but doing so is treated as a crime, with guards coming after you.

(By the way, in Daggerfall, if the guards are after you and you take damage from *any* source (including things like sun damage for being a vampire, falling damage, or the minor damage caused by using items with that negative property), it counts as the guards having hit you, and you're prompted to surrender. Also, surrendering in a region with no towns reduces your current HP to 1, I believe, without taking you to court.)
Posted November 14, 2021
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Johnathanamz: For me The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind has way more freedom to allow us to do anything and whenever we want more than The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion and The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim, with The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind having all NPC's killable, no essential immortal NPC's that cannot be killed. I hated when I saw Bethesda Game Studios add essential NPC's in The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion and in The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim.
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dtgreene: Morrowind does have essential NPCs; it's just that they are killable, unlike in Oblivion or Skyrim. It's just that, if you kill one of them, you get a message basically informing you of the fact that the game is now likely unwinnable. (Note that there are a few cases where the essential flag has the wrong value for an NPC.)

Arena and Daggerfall don't have essential NPCs because the game doesn't allow you to attack anyone important; your swing will just go through them harmlessly. (This also means that, in Daggerfall, you can't cast Charm on an NPC, which is a problem because I think that's the only use for the Charm effect, making it completely useless.) The common people who wander the town can be killed with a melee weapon (but not a spell, and I believe not a bow), but doing so is treated as a crime, with guards coming after you.

(By the way, in Daggerfall, if the guards are after you and you take damage from *any* source (including things like sun damage for being a vampire, falling damage, or the minor damage caused by using items with that negative property), it counts as the guards having hit you, and you're prompted to surrender. Also, surrendering in a region with no towns reduces your current HP to 1, I believe, without taking you to court.)
So what is essential about the NPC's that are essential in The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind if I can kill every single NPC's?

When I look at the NPC's files like their ID numbers and all of that what items they have on them, etc I do not see anything important.

So what is essential about the NPC's?

I am just very happy that NPC's are not immortal in The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind.
Posted November 14, 2021
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dtgreene: Morrowind does have essential NPCs; it's just that they are killable, unlike in Oblivion or Skyrim. It's just that, if you kill one of them, you get a message basically informing you of the fact that the game is now likely unwinnable. (Note that there are a few cases where the essential flag has the wrong value for an NPC.)

Arena and Daggerfall don't have essential NPCs because the game doesn't allow you to attack anyone important; your swing will just go through them harmlessly. (This also means that, in Daggerfall, you can't cast Charm on an NPC, which is a problem because I think that's the only use for the Charm effect, making it completely useless.) The common people who wander the town can be killed with a melee weapon (but not a spell, and I believe not a bow), but doing so is treated as a crime, with guards coming after you.

(By the way, in Daggerfall, if the guards are after you and you take damage from *any* source (including things like sun damage for being a vampire, falling damage, or the minor damage caused by using items with that negative property), it counts as the guards having hit you, and you're prompted to surrender. Also, surrendering in a region with no towns reduces your current HP to 1, I believe, without taking you to court.)
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Johnathanamz: So what is essential about the NPC's that are essential in The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind if I can kill every single NPC's?

When I look at the NPC's files like their ID numbers and all of that what items they have on them, etc I do not see anything important.

So what is essential about the NPC's?

I am just very happy that NPC's are not immortal in The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind.
They're "essential" in the sense that you may not be able to complete the main quest if you kill them.

(Of course, there is that "back path:" that can be taken, as well as the option of ignoring the item that keeps you from being damaged by the weapons you need and just tanking that damage.)
Posted November 14, 2021
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Tarhiel: Skyrim Anniversary release when? :)
If that comes here to GOG, all GOG gamers that buy Anniversary should get all of the old versions of Skyrim for purchasing Anniversary too - i.e. Skyrim Legendary; and Skyrim Special.

Why?

Mods, that's why. Anniversary broke a lot of stuff (mod-wise)...and so we can still rely on the other 2 versions for mods that work in those old versions.
Post edited November 15, 2021 by MysterD
Posted November 15, 2021
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Tarhiel: Skyrim Anniversary release when? :)
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MysterD: If that comes here to GOG, all GOG gamers that buy Anniversary should get all of the old versions of Skyrim for purchasing Anniversary too - i.e. Skyrim Legendary; and Skyrim Special.

Why?

Mods, that's why. Anniversary broke a lot of stuff...and so we can still rely on the other 2 versions for mods that work in those old versions.
Every remaster of a video game that gets released for sale on gog.com needs to come with the original release of the video game included in gog.com.

I am still waiting for THQ Nordic and Deep Silver to include the original version of Metro 2033 and Metro Last Light before I ever purchase Metro 2033 Redux and Metro Last Light Redux.

The same goes for Red Faction Guerilla Steam Edition I do not know why THQ Nordic even renamed it to Red Faction Guerrila Steam Edition when they removed Games for Windows Live they should of just kept the name Red Faction Guerilla.

Etc and so on and so on.
Posted November 15, 2021
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MysterD: If that comes here to GOG, all GOG gamers that buy Anniversary should get all of the old versions of Skyrim for purchasing Anniversary too - i.e. Skyrim Legendary; and Skyrim Special.

Why?

Mods, that's why. Anniversary broke a lot of stuff...and so we can still rely on the other 2 versions for mods that work in those old versions.
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Johnathanamz: Every remaster of a video game that gets released for sale on gog.com needs to come with the original release of the video game included in gog.com.

I am still waiting for THQ Nordic and Deep Silver to include the original version of Metro 2033 and Metro Last Light before I ever purchase Metro 2033 Redux and Metro Last Light Redux.

The same goes for Red Faction Guerilla Steam Edition I do not know why THQ Nordic even renamed it to Red Faction Guerrila Steam Edition when they removed Games for Windows Live they should of just kept the name Red Faction Guerilla.

Etc and so on and so on.
About RF:G Steam Edition - that version got Steam Achievements and Steamworks-supported stuff...so in a sense, it kinda makes sense to re-brand it, to let Steam-users know: "This supports Steamworks in full now, not G4WL." RFG was notoriously known to use G4WL (Games For Windows Live) and I'm sure most companies that used that G4WL junk want to get that G4WL stink off their game.

But, yeah - I'm all for if they do Remasters, bundle access to the old versions with it. That'd be awesome if say Metro 2033 Redux gave access to old versions and the same goes for LL Redux too giving access to LL Original.

I'm sure something like say those that bought GTA Trilogy Definitive (Remasters) really wish it came with access to the old GTA Trilogy Classics (old versions of GTA3, VC, and SA) right about now. ;)
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Community
General discussionThrowback Thursday: The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind(107 posts)(107 posts)
(107 posts)