Awesome, thanks for the reply! Good to hear you're enjoying it!

Speaking of spells, maybe this can help you with the Samurai spells - I recommend Gamefaqs when you want to compare the differences and find out about how the spells work.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/ps3/981422-wizardry-labyrinth-of-lost-souls

Do you think the dungeon layout/structure is simplified and not as interesting as Tales of the Forsaken Lands? I really wanted to jump into this one until I read in the reviews that TotFL has better mechanics and dungeons, so now I'm thinking it might be better to go for the PS2 game as my first Japanese Wizardry.

There's actually some mistakes in the FAQs that I've noticed.

For example, if we look at the first FAQ listed, and the spell descriptions, here are some parts that aren't accurate:
* Steel Skin: Only targets the caster (not one party member), and actually works similarly to the Bishop's Magic Wall, negating damage to the caster until it shatters.
* Graupel Hail: Only hits one enemy (and is actually weaker than Flame Arrow, for whatever reason).
* Thunder Arrow: Is not "much more powerful than Flame Arrow"; it's actually the same strength despite being a higher level.
* Ice burst: Weaker than Graupel Hail, but at least it hits all enemies (not just a group).
* Ice Field: It *is* stronger than Ice Burst, but doesn't make it obsolete, and it's worth mentioning that Flame Field is still stronger. Cold Snap, just one level higher, is much stronger and still hits a group.
* Iceberg Rain: Also inflicts paralysis.
* Volcanic Field: Also inflicts fear (as well as doing good damage).
* Thunder Burst: Damage is low (but still better than Ice Burst).
* Cloud of Death: I believe this is a pure instant death spell, and that enemies that survive won't take damage at all.
* Lightning Arrow: Also inflicts paralysis.
* Torch Light: Is not extinguished by dark fields, though the spell won't let you see in them.
* Battle Aura: Affects the whole party, can be used outside of combat, and lasts until you leave the dungeon or enter an anti-magic zone.
* Ball of Light: See Torch Light.
* Advanced Reflex: Like Battle Aura, can be used outside of combat and lasts until you return to town or enter an anti-spell zone.
* Escape: Actually takes you to the stairs that lead back up to the previous level (so on B5F the stairs to B4F), regardless of how you entered the floor. Will not work if you haven't yet found that staircase (for example, if you entered via the elevator, though if you *have* reached the floor via staircase, using it from the elevator is a nice shortcut if you haven't found the control switch)
* Break Curse: I believe this just removes (and possibly destroys, haven't actually tried this) cursed items (thost that your alignment or gender doesn't allow); don't know if there's anything else it does.
* [Haven't tried Plague Cloud; maybe I should see how that spell works?] Edit: Plague Cloud only hits one enemy, and if successful I believe it lowers the target to single-digit HP without displaying a damage amount. (Think MABADI from Wizardry 1-3, but less reliable.)
* [Haven't tried Mirror Shield either]
* Smite: Only hits a group.

I haven't played Tales of the Forsaken Land, so I can't compare, though to be honest, the dungeon layout is a bit lacking. Of the game's two main dungeons, the Dungeon of Trials is actually better in this respect, but Shiin's Dungeon has more interesting (and more rewarding) combat encounters. It also doesn't help that many of the events on the mid-levels won't trigger until you do a certain quest that you might not do until you've mapped those levels.

If you're looking for Japanese Wizardry, another option is Elminage Gothic; the dungeon design is more interesting there, but be warned that the game can get quite brutal after the first dungeon. (The game may not have the Wizardry name, but it plays just like a Japanese Wizardry game would play.)

Edit: Added detail to Plague Cloud, having tested it.

Interesting! It's possible the spells got reworked for the re-release. Otherwise it makes no sense, since both FAQs worked with the translated PS3 version. Do both have the same mistakes?

I've noticed the first more complete faq has a mistake in the respec part, so it looks like that's a change from the PS3 version.

"Disclaimer: the phrase 'respec' means to change your character's class at the
Guild. The bad news? This sets them back to Level 1. The good news? Aside from
the drastic drop to HP, all their stats remain intact. "

Oh, and there's this trick to get 47 bonus points in the PS3 version, or at least in the Japanese one. I wonder if this carries over to this release as well?

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/981422-wizardry-labyrinth-of-lost-souls/59507753

Yes! We've actually talked about Elminage before, but right now I'd prefer to try Wizardry, due to the brutal mechanics and discouraging of loading a save in a dungeon (time passes each time you reload a save outside of a city). :)

I don't know, but I actually do suspect that the FAQs were wrong about some of the details.

Incidentally, I have found the information contained on the Japanese webpage at
https://w.atwiki.jp/wizfan/pages/85.html
to be more consistent with what I observe in this game, with the exception of the Samurai's 1st level spells. (The page is accurate for the sequel, but the details, including Drain Life and Steal Life being the same strength, seem to hold for the original here.)

Also, Plague Cloud hits only one enemy, and if it's successful (and it often isn't), it displays a message about the enemy being on the brink of death (don't remember if it's the actual warning), and it probably lowers the enemy's HP to single digits without displaying a damage amount.


That's true, but you also lose half your SP (though, if your new class uses the same type of magic, you get a minimum of 1 SP per spell known).

I thought you said you go down 1 level, so eg. 6->5? So if you're back to level 1 and need to regain experience to start learning your class skills again, does that mean if you want to get spells for your other classes, it's worth it to take the magic class you want first and then go levelling up your main combat class again? Eg. make a warrior, switch him to a mage/bishop etc., get some spells, and then continue levelling him as a warrior?

And the reverse for Wizards if you want to gain some HP/stat gains? Or does the game not really have many class skills, so it's more about different stat gains? I'm used to respeccing from BG (dual classes), so this is little strange, unless it's easy to get back up to the level you had lost, since you retain your stats (but not the HP).

Game's getting a "meh" overall score (not really surprising to me), but seems to be selling okay.

You go down to level 1 and you change class, and yes, thad does mean you want to take your magic class first, or if you want 4's in every spell level as a non-caster, Biship.

The only skills that transfer between classes are spells; the few other skills learned (like the fighter's Trick Attack) do not transfer between classes. Also, I don't think class affects stat gains; only race seems to matter here. (But do note that equipment can give bonus stats, and most equipment has some class restrictions.)

Getting back up to your old level isn't hard (as long as the level isn't too far past 50, but a that point HP are the only important thing you get from leveling up anyway) thanks to the ability to convert gold into experience, combined with the existence of items that sell for 6-figure amounts (like the Dragon Kite selling for 290k).

I've been googling a bit and finally came across this thread...

Does anyone know if there is a way to get your Growth Fruit back? It's seeming like for the later part of the game it's probably irrelevant, however, I used them before I had any clue what they were, how the game's stats worked, that the stats could even be "rerolled" in the first place, and I had one left. I did a lot of trying with the last one I had. I gave it to a character, saved the character, deleted the character, saved the game. It was gone.

So I tried to uninstall the DLC, launch the game, delete all but my main, save the game, reinstall the DLC, launch the game. It remembers I had 0 left and all my other characters were still deleted.

If reinstalling the entire game would work I'd be willing to give that a go, but I'd really rather know before flushing it just to get 'em back. I thought they were this games "alternative" to rerolling stats and was super confused when I used the first ones. :P

in case anyone is interested I thought I could go through a quick tl;dr version of the different Japanese Wizardry spinoffs, since there's a lot of them and they are from different companies and some of the companies have went on to make their own games.

this may not be 100% accurate since I haven't played most of these and I'm just getting most of this information second or third hand, but it's still probably enough to give you an idea of what's out there.

Wizardry Gaiden - ASCII (I think all of these were fan translated)

Wizardry Empire, Wizardry Asterisk - Starfish (they went on to make the Elminage series)

Busin: Wizardry Alternative - Racjin (the first one of which was localized as Tale of the Forsaken Land)

Wizardry Xth - (team whom some of the members went on to become) Experience (also, elements of Wizardry Xth apparently were recycled into both the Class of Heroes and Experience's Generation Xth/New Tokyo Legacy series. Experience also makes some other somewhat similar dungeon crawlers like Stranger of Sword City and Demon Gaze)

Wizardry Reneisannce - Aquire (that includes this game)

there's some more, but that probably is most of the major Japanese Wizardry games.

Well, there are a lot of one star reviews that really shouldn't be there. You can't just say, "this isn't like Wizardry 8" and give it one star.

Yea that one just brings the whole rating down for no actual reason other than, "I dOn'T lIkE iT."

I don't think the game will pull in any new people into Wizardry, but it probs sells well to the ones who know what they're getting into. Ironically, that's pretty niche, but whatevs.

Wizardry DIMGUIL, which I believe doesn't have a fan translation, could also be considered a part of this series.

One thing notable about this particular spin-off series is that the games are mechanically faithful to the originals, even to details like accuracy calculations and the chance of inspecting or disarming chests. This does lead to some balance quirks, like the fact that 20+ AGI (not sure if 20 is enough), something impossible in Sir-Tech 1-5, is enough to guarantee that the character will always act before any enemy gets a chance to act.

Another type of Japanese Wizardry game would be arrangements of some of the earlier games in the series that changed some things around. Two examples:
1. Wizardry 3: Knight of Diamonds (Famicom). Basically, take Wizardry 2, add the ability to create characters, re-arrange the map, add monsters from Wizardry 1-4 (including some to populate the early floors that beginning characters have a chance of killing), and add a fetch quest. This game was officially translated as Wizardry 2: Knight of Diamonds for the NES, and it was remade for the Super Famicom and arranged for the Game Boy Color.
2. Wizardry 4 Arranged Version. Found in Wizardry: New Age of Llylgamyn, take Wizardry 4, but chance the way monster summoning works. Instead of summoning 3 groups of monsters that you don't control, you now summon 5 individual monsters that you can control during battle, and you can have them cast spells outside of battle (and will want to right away, actually). Also, there are a couple new enemies and a few other things thrown in, particularly once you leave the dungoen. Unfortunately, there's no full English version of this game. (It's worth noting that the same package also includes the Classic Version, which is Wizardry 4 as you remember it, with full English as an option and an optional automap feature (which makes the game quite a bit easier).)

Sorry mate, as much as I find such idiotic reviews annoying, assessment of every game basically boils down to "I like it" or "I don't like it" and it's their right to dislike the game for such a petty reason. Just as it is your right to say that these reviews are crap.

I would filter out all 1 or 0 star reviews and possibly 5 star as well(as often big fans of some games don't rate fairly either).

And yeah, rating 1 star because a game "isn't like some other game" (to me) isn't a good rating/review.

=====================================

Nice list....thanks for doing that. :)

==============================

They can do it, but those reviews are essentially useless.....saying I like/dont like x or y game because it's not like/like some game that came before it or is similar to it is a cr*p review.

People should list more info as to what is good or bad(if anything) about a game, and be more verbose.....just saying "didn't like it" or "really liked it" helps almost no one.

He has a point. The whole reason for the rating system is to be helpful. Ratings such as don't like the game or it's not my type aren't helpful. For the same reason rating a game badly because you think it should be like a later title isn't helpful.

At least be more descriptive like puzzles just don't make sense (Sierra). Or combat is too hard or easy or game mechanics don't work or bugs make certain parts of the game unenjoyable.

And yeah people can downrate this post I don't care. This site is going down the drain when it comes to ratings.