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RWarehall: You do know that some of those steps are probably good ones...
Especially the specific DirectX packages they are asking you to install.

Do you know why? Because those are the packages they use on their test machines and they seemed to work for them.

It is not stupid they ask this. You are stupid for disregarding it completely and just complaining you aren't getting a refund for no work. Quite a few games need specific drivers to work correctly and the "latest" packages sometimes are not as backward compatible as they claim.
If it were known that the game tends to have issues with certain DirectX packages (or certain other things on the list), then I'd be quite a bit more willing to try those things. As it stands, though, the game seems to have crashing issues for quite a few people, and the source of the issue has proved rather elusive, for both the user-base and the developers. So once again, the various suggestions that were listed remain highly generic, and when taken in the context of random crashes that have proved elusive for even the devs, are likely to just prove a waste of my time (as well as having the potential to cause problems with some of the many other games I have installed that are all currently working flawlessly). I don't particularly mind troubleshooting if there's a good lead on what the problem may be and it's just a few quick things to try; it's the shotgun approach (like the laundry list I was asked to run through) that I take issue with, as in my experience that tends to do nothing more than waste my time (and the extent of the list shows quite a disregard for the value of my time).

I also find it rather amusing that it's now a couple of people who have brought up the criticism of "refund for no work"; when has it become a requirement to put in some given amount of work to get a refund if something bought proves unfit for purpose? I can buy a $200 item at the local home improvement store, and if for some reason it doesn't suit my needs return it the next day for a full refund, no questions asked. Yet for a $20 game I'm asked to run through a large list of steps before a refund is even considered. The discrepancy makes things seem a bit... petty.
Whenever there is a massive sale like this, I tend to notice that GOG's support slows to a crawl.
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timppu: Come on. Doing those listed things takes like 15 minutes altogether (not couple of hours), and it isn't about "messing up with my drivers", but making sure you are using the latest drivers (something that I do by default every now and then anyway).
Depends if you count the time needed to document the current state of my system and make sure I have everything needed to roll back to that state if the suggested changes cause any problems. I prefer not to change things unless there are known issues- in short, if it ain't broke, don't fix it. Given that my system is around 4 years old, has never needed an OS re-install, and runs pretty much flawlessly, I'm inclined to stick with this approach. Again, if there are known issues I'm happy to make fixes, but I'd prefer to stay away from the random "change all these things and see if it helps" approach, as in my experience it usually doesn't help, and somethings breaks other things.
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DJPomegranate: Okay, so it lists that information for SOME games, but it's not consistent.

I'm looking again at the listings for games I already have, that're compatible with gamepads, and for the most part, doesn't list that they're compatible with gamepads, even when they are.

FURTHERMORE, when a game SPECIFICALLY IS NOT COMPATIBLE with gamepads, no listing ever states that, to make it clear that you can only play the thing by keyboard.

For me, when a listing omits gamepad compatibility info, I can't just assume that the game ISN'T compatible with gamepads, because it's been proven true that some games ARE in fact compatible with gamepads, even when that info is omitted. It's kind of a Schroedinger situation. Is the cat dead or not? Is the game compatible with gamepads or not? The answer is both and neither "Yes" and "No" at the same time, until the truth is observed.
I guess controller support on the gamecard means that the game will run with all common controllers, while other games for which it isn't stated might or might not run with certain controllers. So you should be aware that you buy such games at your own risk. I guess GOG will still give you a refund (or at least store credit) when you ask for it for the first time (they are normally quite generous and helpful).
Just got resolution on the matter, and have updated the initial post to reflect that.
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RWarehall: You do know that some of those steps are probably good ones...
Especially the specific DirectX packages they are asking you to install.

Do you know why? Because those are the packages they use on their test machines and they seemed to work for them.

It is not stupid they ask this. You are stupid for disregarding it completely and just complaining you aren't getting a refund for no work. Quite a few games need specific drivers to work correctly and the "latest" packages sometimes are not as backward compatible as they claim.
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DarrkPhoenix: If it were known that the game tends to have issues with certain DirectX packages (or certain other things on the list), then I'd be quite a bit more willing to try those things. As it stands, though, the game seems to have crashing issues for quite a few people, and the source of the issue has proved rather elusive, for both the user-base and the developers. So once again, the various suggestions that were listed remain highly generic, and when taken in the context of random crashes that have proved elusive for even the devs, are likely to just prove a waste of my time (as well as having the potential to cause problems with some of the many other games I have installed that are all currently working flawlessly). I don't particularly mind troubleshooting if there's a good lead on what the problem may be and it's just a few quick things to try; it's the shotgun approach (like the laundry list I was asked to run through) that I take issue with, as in my experience that tends to do nothing more than waste my time (and the extent of the list shows quite a disregard for the value of my time).
...snip...
To me that sounds like you want the game to work for you only if you are having the same problem as everyone else. In other words, if the reason the game is not working for you is unique or rare, then you don't want the game to work for you at all.

It seems to me that if you don't help troubleshoot your circumstance, then no one else can benefit from what you are experiencing either. If you do help troubleshoot your circumstance, then maybe it would help someone else, too.

Overall, what you have described sounds to me like more of a customer's experience with purchase decisions rather than experience with customer service of trying to get something to work. I mean from reading what you've posted all that I can learn from it is that I should research about a game and whether it'll work on my system before purchasing (which is what I do already).

I think what you copy/pasted is probably posted in GOG's troubleshooting section for just about any game (which I've reviewed before purchasing games) so that info is familiar to me and I have made sure I was comfortable with the possibility before purchasing. (I have a Mac so most of that doesn't apply to me anyway. But I did find out beforehand.) What happens after that troubleshooting would be something new, would be about the customer service itself, but you are saying you aren't going to follow through with obtaining customer service. To me all of this boils down to just your experience with a purchase decision.

Not to belittle that. I mean, it's a great reminder to do research beforehand, so thank you for that reminder. I just think it would have been more helpful to have this thread titled differently to reflect that instead of implying that you had more experiences to share.

I guess I was expecting a "hero" who helped out, but maybe it didn't work out because the issues remained mysterious regardless of everything that was tried. But no, nothing was tried, there wasn't even an interest in following through. So it's more like a story from a passerby than from a participant.

I do find it interesting that having to troubleshoot was a surprise. So I do think that this is worth knowing, that more people should become informed about the possibility of troubleshooting to get the game to work to make the purchase worthwhile instead of just giving up. Perhaps this thread will help with that so more persons will research more before purchasing and also be prepared to attempt troubleshooting (or alert a dear friend of the need for an in person visit to help out with that).
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Stryder2931: I found this:
https://www.gog.com/support/website_help/money_back_guarantee

Step 6 does, in part, state:
"We will get back to you with what we think might help fix your problem. If we can't get it working together, you will get your money back."

Then step 8:
"8. What if I don't want to bother with trying to get my game working? All I want is my money back!
Our top priority is to help you get the game working, and this means that we will require some cooperation from you. We won't ask anything extravagant, or super time-consuming, like a system reinstall, but if you absolutely refuse to try anything, we won't be able to determine whether the problem can be fixed or not, and won't be able to issue a refund.
This is especially relevant if there are some glaring issues with your computer, like DirectX faults, or drivers that are ancient, or even missing."

While all this seems fair, anything after step 3 in what you posted, may seem excessive for some people, especially if they are unsure what other conflicts may arise from taking those steps, or if the reinstall fails.

I would be interested if others agree or disagree.
I agree with that but,if I don't wish to try all of their suggestions then money should be refunded immediately.
In principle all the measures they propose are quite meaningful as general actions on a Windows system. They probably help a lot to avoid general problems. I also understand they have to do that in order to avoid paying refunds where a simple driver update would have done the trick already. So I actually would have done all that and then ask for the refund.

However, in some specific cases GOG support might decide to take a shortcut, especially if it is a known instability. So, if many people report the same issue and it cannot be in general resolved, then they could speed up the refund. Either they didn't have this policy so far or they thought that this issue may be resolvable.

In the end, "poor customer service" is probably a bit exaggerated.
Post edited June 14, 2016 by Trilarion
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DarrkPhoenix: If it were known that the game tends to have issues with certain DirectX packages (or certain other things on the list), then I'd be quite a bit more willing to try those things. As it stands, though, the game seems to have crashing issues for quite a few people, and the source of the issue has proved rather elusive, for both the user-base and the developers. So once again, the various suggestions that were listed remain highly generic, and when taken in the context of random crashes that have proved elusive for even the devs, are likely to just prove a waste of my time (as well as having the potential to cause problems with some of the many other games I have installed that are all currently working flawlessly). I don't particularly mind troubleshooting if there's a good lead on what the problem may be and it's just a few quick things to try; it's the shotgun approach (like the laundry list I was asked to run through) that I take issue with, as in my experience that tends to do nothing more than waste my time (and the extent of the list shows quite a disregard for the value of my time).

I also find it rather amusing that it's now a couple of people who have brought up the criticism of "refund for no work"; when has it become a requirement to put in some given amount of work to get a refund if something bought proves unfit for purpose? I can buy a $200 item at the local home improvement store, and if for some reason it doesn't suit my needs return it the next day for a full refund, no questions asked. Yet for a $20 game I'm asked to run through a large list of steps before a refund is even considered. The discrepancy makes things seem a bit... petty.
I find it amusing you are a lazy bum who wants to do absolutely nothing yourself to troubleshoot the problem. Installing a couple old redistributables is not very time consuming at all and is often necessary to get old games running on a new operating system. These are steps you get from Microsoft themselves. And the fact you attacked GoG's customer service without lifting a finger and before contacting them, makes you pretty much an asshole. So enjoy your refund...
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RWarehall: I find it amusing you are a lazy bum who wants to do absolutely nothing yourself to troubleshoot the problem. Installing a couple old redistributables is not very time consuming at all and is often necessary to get old games running on a new operating system. These are steps you get from Microsoft themselves. And the fact you attacked GoG's customer service without lifting a finger and before contacting them, makes you pretty much an asshole. So enjoy your refund...
I don't think you understand what the phrase "fit for purpose" means. It means when you buy a product you are entitled to a product that works as intended. If it doesn't then you have the right to a refund. This is going by European business law. A game's purpose is to played and if the customer cannot do that then they have the right to ask for a refund. While it is okay to ask the customer to try the solutions to fix the problem but ultimately it's not the customer's job to fix it.

To call the customer an asshole and a bum for wanting a product that is fit for purpose is just asinine and make you look like a fool.
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GR00T: I understand the need for GOG to require the customer to jump through a few hoops in order to get a refund (update graphics drivers, install as admin, provide a DXDiag report, maybe even reinstall the game itself). If they didn't, I'm pretty certain the whole thing would be abused severely just with people that don't like a particular game and want their money back (after playing for hours or through the whole thing).

But some of those requirements are extreme. You shouldn't have to reinstall Visual C++, .NET Frameworks, or DirectX if you already have the latest versions.

And you shouldn't have to go to outside (the developers') support either. GOG sells the games, they should support the games or contact the developers themselves.

As Tauto put it: "Not good at all".


*edit* And in a case of a game like this, where it seems there are known crash issues that apparently haven't been solved over several patches, there shouldn't even be a question about refunds.
^This, and double so regarding the very last bit.
I updated the original post, but also wanted to post here in case anyone already following the thread skipped over it. According to the support rep their standard policy is to offer store credit in the initial response as an alternative to trying to trouble-shoot the process (given that people have different levels of tolerance for how much troubleshooting they're willing to do). This wasn't included in the initial response I received as an oversight (understandable since the support reps are pretty busy at the moment). So in hindsight my own response to this was an overreaction resulting from a small miscommunication. Ultimately GOG support handled the issue quickly, professionally, and courteously, for which I commend them. I also apologize for some of my initial harsh words, which in hindsight were uncalled for.
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RWarehall: I find it amusing you are a lazy bum who wants to do absolutely nothing yourself to troubleshoot the problem. Installing a couple old redistributables is not very time consuming at all and is often necessary to get old games running on a new operating system. These are steps you get from Microsoft themselves. And the fact you attacked GoG's customer service without lifting a finger and before contacting them, makes you pretty much an asshole. So enjoy your refund...
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jepsen1977: I don't think you understand what the phrase "fit for purpose" means. It means when you buy a product you are entitled to a product that works as intended. If it doesn't then you have the right to a refund. This is going by European business law. A game's purpose is to played and if the customer cannot do that then they have the right to ask for a refund. While it is okay to ask the customer to try the solutions to fix the problem but ultimately it's not the customer's job to fix it.

To call the customer an asshole and a bum for wanting a product that is fit for purpose is just asinine and make you look like a fool.
I think you are the one who doesn't know what he is talking about. Fit for purpose does not enable a buyer to do nothing. In fact, the phrase "significant effort" is contained in the law.

You are the one being a fool. So every box copy on the market one should be entitled to a refund because a patch is available but the consumer wants to be lazy and not apply it? Now you are the one being silly. A customer is still responsible to make reasonable effort.
Well, I'm glad EVERYONE ELSE is having such a better experience with GoG's customer service, 'cuz I'm not; they flat-out denied me a refund, so it doesn't look like I'll be purchasing much else on GoG for awhile, unless I know for a fact that the game supports gamepads, and is on sale for 25% of its original price.

Probably just get most off of my games DRM-Free off of Humble Bundle from now on; GoG's not the ONLY outfit that sells digital games DRM-Free, y'know! Humble Bundle, I've had great experiences with their customer service, so I'll probably end up sticking with them more often...until they piss me off, as well. :/

Man, and right after I just started getting involved in the forums here...

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Lord_Kane: Whenever there is a massive sale like this, I tend to notice that GOG's support slows to a crawl.
That's a good thing to point out. No point buying a game full price when GoG is having one of their large sales, because if it's not on sale that day, it probably will be later.

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PaterAlf: I guess controller support on the gamecard means that the game will run with all common controllers, while other games for which it isn't stated might or might not run with certain controllers. So you should be aware that you buy such games at your own risk. I guess GOG will still give you a refund (or at least store credit) when you ask for it for the first time (they are normally quite generous and helpful).
That's another good thing to point out, because I've never seen "Controller Support" on the game product pages/gamecards for (EDIT: SOME) of the games I already own, that ARE compatible with gamepads (see: Feist, Freedom Planet, Pid).

EDIT: Okay, "Controller Support" is listed under the "Features" bullet point, in the list right under the "Add to Cart" button, and I've seen for: Anodyne, Braid, Dust: An Elysian Tale, Shovel Knight, Valdis Story.
Post edited June 14, 2016 by DJPomegranate
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DarrkPhoenix: UPDATE: After declining to trouble-shoot the issue as described below I was offered store credit, a result which I'm perfectly happy with. While I still feel the initial response left something to be desired, I thank the GOG support rep for being flexible on this matter as well as being so quick in their response.

UPDATE 2: According to the support rep standard policy is to offer store credit as part of the initial response as an alternative to trouble-shooting, since people have different levels of tolerance to the amount of trouble-shooting they're willing to do (the rep forgot to include this in the initial response, as they've understandably been a bit swamped with the sale going on). I must say I'm very pleasantly surprised by how this was ultimately handled, and would also like to commend GOG support on the professional and courteous matter in which they responded.

*Original post removed as I now believe much of it stemmed from a simple oversight that resulted in me taking the tone of the response in a very different way than was intended. I feel leaving up my original complaint would be unfair to GOG in light of this. If one of the GOG staff also wishes to change the title to something less negative (such as "Customer support experience" I'd also be fine with that).
This is good to know, and thank you for updating. I would gladly take store credit, rather than having to go through the 10+ steps originally posted. I am glad it all worked out.