NO U

Nah, fam. Just them.

They're both very jumpy, as if startling them elicits a self-preservation mechanism because they might be on the team with the smaller number of members. Jumpy people are naturally sus. Or maybe they just got some dope ass PRs and wanna use them. I know I'd be hella bummed if I got a solid PR and didn't get to use it because of (mis)lynch on D1.

He gave a couple of examples where my scenario backfired on scum and thus utilized those very visible anecdotes to dismiss the possibility of it occurring again because of those two instances he knows of having gone badly.
So he's basically using those two anecdotes because they went beyond his own selection process to argue his point, overlooking any instance when this scenario actually play out accordingly. Depending on scale, whether we are speaking strictly of GOG, Mafia forums, or Mafia in general (offline included), this scenario could have successfully happened too many times to be worth counting or just a few times where it's relevant for our own context.

It's like thinking you can drop out of college and become a billionaire because you hear of all those randos doing it. But you don't hear of the millions who don't make it, do you?

Make a case for the other? Pls explain.

I will later. I'm feeling tired.

After going through his posts so far I do find AZ to be scummy, particularly how he seemed not serious even after I claimed.

Vote Ambiti0nZ

Post Part 3 of 3 (Last)

dedoporno (to FrostburnPhoenix): Who were you again? You seem to know your way around here.
https://www.gog.com/forum/general/gog_mafia_76_trouble_in_the_lucas_arts_multiverse/post35
And someone else is getting the feels that Frost seems to know his way around here and doesn't play like a newbie.

dedoporno (to JoeSaphhire): As a matter of fact I didn't understand what buck was talking about until I saw Frostburn's post when I had to go back and check.
https://www.gog.com/forum/general/gog_mafia_76_trouble_in_the_lucas_arts_multiverse/post40
If not for Frost, Catte's change from Salvador to Sanspoof would have went unnnoticed for this poster here.

ZFR: Trying to organise new players by experience
https://www.gog.com/forum/general/gog_mafia_76_trouble_in_the_lucas_arts_multiverse/post54
At this point, I only owned up to having played three fast game on with a 6-8 hour cycle about ten years ago, while not mentioning that I had co-modded a bunch of games after around that same time. Even with me struggling with acronyms, he still figured out that I'm probably at the more experienced end and put FrostburnPhoenix right under me. This is also why I think Frost is not 100% completely new. I think it was you that previously said that ZFR has a brain like a computer and can be trusted with statistics.

FrostburnPhoenix: No experience, but read the previous game while it was ongoing.
https://www.gog.com/forum/general/gog_mafia_76_trouble_in_the_lucas_arts_multiverse/post57
Again, he doesn't post like someone who only read a prior game. Also if he really did read the previous game, he would know that Catte was mafia in that game. You do want to randomize it, but you also want to make sure that you don't have people that are always mafia or always town. This is just common sense. I'm calling this an outright lie.

ZFR (to FrostburnPhoenix): What did you misread?
https://www.gog.com/forum/general/gog_mafia_76_trouble_in_the_lucas_arts_multiverse/post82
This is referring back to Frost's second post and is technically the start of the ZFR-Frost debate.

FrostburnPhoenix: The flavor above the player list. Speaking of which, it appears all scum have PRs based on it's wording.
https://www.gog.com/forum/general/gog_mafia_76_trouble_in_the_lucas_arts_multiverse/post87
Frost is the first person to suggest that all mafia have special roles. The mafia loose nothing if the town knows that all members of the mafia have special roles.

FrostburnPhoenix: I don't remember. I corrected it almost instantly. I do remember that it made me think it was going to be role madness.
https://www.gog.com/forum/general/gog_mafia_76_trouble_in_the_lucas_arts_multiverse/post103
I had to look up "role madness" and found that it is a type of game where most (if not all) players have a special role. https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Role_Madness There is a difference between, 1) "I thought everyone had a special role" and 2) "I thought this was a role madness game." While at face value, they are essentially saying the same thing exact thing. The difference is that in 2), there is the use of mafia game terminology. When I last played mafia, we didn't have the term role madness because there were not enough unique roles to go around and would require a lot of doubling up on roles.

JoeSapphire (to ZFR): what do you think Frostburn's trying to cover?
https://www.gog.com/forum/general/gog_mafia_76_trouble_in_the_lucas_arts_multiverse/post104

ZFR: A slip that all (three) Mafiosi have roles.
https://www.gog.com/forum/general/gog_mafia_76_trouble_in_the_lucas_arts_multiverse/post105
ZFR is just repeating what FrostburnPhoenix when he said that "it appears all scum have PRs based on it's wording." The only thing that ZFR has added that out of twelve players, three are mafia. If you have played enough games with a specific person always running them, you're going to have a general idea of how many mafia members there are from the beginning. ZFR saying that there are three is just statistics.

FrostburnPhoenix: No, I was trying to cover a slip that I had a role. And it very much seems you were rolehunting me.
https://www.gog.com/forum/general/gog_mafia_76_trouble_in_the_lucas_arts_multiverse/post106
I think Frost's slip was intentional because this is where it occurs. Since there can be a few vanilla townies in a role madness game, it doesn't reveal anything about your individual role situation. Additionally if you really did misread things and think it might be a role madness game, you're not required to be totally honest about it. Also I did another Google search, this time for "mafia rolehunting" and found https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Mastin%27s_Guide_to_Scumhunting which does have the term power role hunting. Again we have Frost using game terms, not acting new.

FrostburnPhoenix: Since I already revealed I have a role, should I claim? Or wait?
https://www.gog.com/forum/general/gog_mafia_76_trouble_in_the_lucas_arts_multiverse/post119
I've already covered this in prior recent posts where I brought up the fake voteless townie incident. The only thing I will add about the Voteless Townie incident was that the mafia player in question never got lynched or killed through someone else's night actions. I can think of no advantage for an actual town-aligned player to reveal their role on day one. There is an advantage for a mafia-aligned player to fake claim a role if the town is willing to completely buy into it.


For a guy who only "read the previous game while it was ongoing," he is using more game-specific jargon more than anyone. Jargon sticks out to me only because I have worked in places with "no jargon/slang" rules to facilitate communication. There's been several other posts where he was giving someone else the feeling that he's not entirely new to this game. The Catte situation at the beginning reads a bit like trying to put a target on Catte, while the exchange with ZFR reads like taking advantage of an opportunity to imply that he has a special role and is town-aligned. There's also been some inconsistencies with his own posts, such as ZFR saying that Frost gave away that all mafia had rolls... only to have Frost correct that and say it was about his own special role, then offer to reveal what it is.

Trust me, you don't want me to be too serious about your already miniscule posts. Slicing those up isn't too hard, but what's more telling about you is the stuff that you don't say and how your attitude is almost entirely reactionary to what's going on. So that's to say you're mostly on the prowl and latching onto things.

Alas, I do agree with LordCthulhu. You're no new player. If you haven't played before, you've at least watched games before because your use of lingo like flavor, PR, role madness etc right off the bat from when the game started is too much on the nose.

Hey man, it's better than posting once every 30 some hours with a sentence/paragraph or two and reading too much into mod flavor or reacting to people like a jumpy cat.

When they were talking about that, it was a long-running joke. That players can't be mafia twice in a row as some "logical" excuse not to vote them. For the integrity of the game, roles must be purely random, else everyone could enter a game knowing one player is Town since the previous games they were scum. Prior games and roles have no influence on anyone's roles this game. There have been players getting scum maybe as many as 4 times in a row. Don't treat that as a point in Catte's favor.

Nah, fam. We don't do that here.

1 zfr can be trusted with statistics except when he's being sarcastic af ;)

2 i think when saying your few games not-on-gog made you highly experienced was more ripping-on-gog than genuine sentiment ;p

So who has been posting and who has not:
Format game day - actual day

I'm including Lifthrasil only because these are when vote updates occurred if bold and clarifications occurred if not bold.


Day 1-1

Page 01: Lifthrasilx3, JoeSapphire, FrostburnPhoenix, JoeSapphire, FrostburnPhoenix, JoeSapphire, my name is catte, JoeSapphire, ZFR, bucktoothgamer, LordCephy, FrostburnPhoenix, Ambiti0nZ, JoeSapphire, Ambiti0nZ, JoeSapphire, LordCephy, FrostburnPhoenix

Page 02: JoeSapphire, bucktoothgamer, FrostburnPhoenix, JoeSapphire, Lifthrasil

Day 1-2

Page 02: my name is catte, JoeSapphire, JoeSapphire, ZFR, babark, dedoporno, detective_razza, dedoporno, JoeSapphire, dedoporno, Ambiti0nZ, JoeSapphire, Lifthrasil, my name is catte, dedoporno

Page 03: my name is catte, dedoporno, my name is catte, Lifthrasil, dedoporno, JoeSapphire, detective_razza, my name is catte, FrostburnPhoenix, LordCephy, JoeSapphire, JoeSapphire, Lifthrasil, ZFR, dedoporno, ZFR, FrostburnPhoenix, JoeSapphire, RWarehall, Lifthrasil

Page 04: Lifthrasil, detective_razza, dedoporno, LordCephy, RWarehall, ZFR, JoeSapphire, detective_razza, HypersomniacLive, detective_razza, Ambiti0nZ, HypersomniacLive, detective_razza, Ambiti0nZ, dedoporno, LordCephy, Ambiti0nZ, RWarehall, Ambiti0nZ, JoeSapphire

Page 05: my name is catte, ZFR, my name is catte, JoeSapphire, dedoporno, LordCephy, FrostburnPhoenix, ZFR, JoeSapphire, bucktoothgamer, LordCephy, LordCephy

Day 1-3

Page 05: ZFR, dedoporno, my name is catte, Ambiti0nZ, my name is catte, Lifthrasil, FrostburnPhoenix, my name is catte

Page 06: LordCephy, ZFR, FrostburnPhoenix, JoeSapphire, ZFR, FrostburnPhoenix, dedoporno, ZFR, dedoporno, FrostburnPhoenix, ZFR, dedoporno, ZFR, RWarehall, HypersomniacLive, dedoporno, ZFR, ZFR, FrostburnPhoenix, HypersomniacLive

Page 07: ZFR, fgjnyuiy568 (bump), ZFR, my name is catte, HypersomniacLive, dedoporno, LordCephy, ZFR, ZFR, Ambiti0nZ, LordCephy, ZFR, Ambiti0nZ, Ambiti0nZ, LordCephy, Ambiti0nZ, Ambiti0nZ, FrostburnPhoenix, ZFR, bucktoothgamer

Page 08: Microfish_1 (bump), bucktoothgamer, RWarehall, RWarehall, LordCephy, Ambiti0nZ, LordCephy, FrostburnPhoenix, FrostburnPhoenix, Ambiti0nZ, Ambiti0nZ, LordCephy, Ambiti0nZ

Day 1-4

Page 08: ZFR, babark, dedoporno, babark, ZFR, my name is catte, dedoporno

Page 09: Lifthrasil, Ambiti0nZ, dedoporno, my name is catte, JoeSapphire, FrostburnPhoenix, FrostburnPhoenix, HypersomniacLive, ZFR, FrostburnPhoenix, LordCephy, ZFR, HypersomniacLive, dedoporno, FrostburnPhoenix, ZFR, gafdhgadsfhaef (bump), ZFR, FrostburnPhoenix, LordCephy

Page 10: ZFR, detective_razza, dedoporno, Lifthrasil, Ambiti0nZ, ZFR, my name is catte, Microfish_1 (bump), ZFR, Ambiti0nZ, Ambiti0nZ, Ambiti0nZ, ZFR, my name is catte, JoeSapphire, LordCephy, bucktoothgamer, RWarehall, Ambiti0nZ, Ambiti0nZ

Day 1-5 (Yesterday)

Page 11: ZFR, dedoporno, ZFR, ZFR, Ambiti0nZ, my name is catte, Ambiti0nZ, ZFR, JoeSapphire, ZFR, FrostburnPhoenix, Lifthrasil, my name is catte, Ambiti0nZ, Ambiti0nZ, ZFR, Ambiti0nZ, bucktoothgamer, my name is catte, FrostburnPhoenix

Page 12: dedoporno, ZFR, my name is catte, ZFR, my name is catte

Day 1-6 (Today)

Page 12: HypersomniacLive, LordCephy, detective_razza, JoeSapphire, JoeSapphire, ZFR, babark, JoeSapphire, JoeSapphire, my name is catte, JoeSapphire, Ambiti0nZ, babark, Ambiti0nZ, JoeSapphire

Page 13: Ambiti0nZ, JoeSapphire, my name is catte, Ambiti0nZ, my name is catte, Ambiti0nZ, JoeSapphire, Ambiti0nZ, my name is catte, HypersomniacLive, HypersomniacLive, FrostburnPhoenix, LordCephy, RWarehall, LordCephy, Ambiti0nZ, FrostburnPhoenix, LordCephy, Ambiti0nZ, Ambiti0nZ

Even though I am completely convinced that FrostburnPhoenix is mafia, here's my 100% totally dead serious vote. All prior votes really were poking and seeing what happens.

vote babark

This guy doesn't post much. His first few posts were on the level of "here's my vote" and didn't really go beyond that until detective_razza voted to have him lynched page #12. He could just be a disinterested vanilla townie that hates his assigned role, but I would rather have a participating mafia member because at least they're playing.


kk - It's sometimes hard to tell what banter is serious and what isn't around here.


Don't you mean Yog-Sothoth as in the Outer God baby daddy of Cthulhu and Hastur?

I'd switch to the 50 posts per thread page format going forward. It keeps things cleaner in terms of page numbers. I used to do 20 per page in previous years and nowadays I'm wondering why did I ever do that because seeing multiple pages of new posts, even though smaller, is a lot more disheartening if you have to catch up and do lots of backtracking for analysis.


Considering yogy's personality and prowess, I'd say this is pretty adequate.

I'm sorry. We had a medical emergency in the family. All is well again, but it was a full day and I am very exhausted. I don't have the head to count votes, I need sleep. But I'll post an update and vote count in the morning.

@joppo, can you do a vote count?

oh goodness, quite a lot was said in the hours i was away O.o
i think i will do some reading and thinking and vote again in the morning B)

I'm not joppo, but I'm very sympathetic to medical emergencies as I've dealt with more than a few earlier this year. Here's the vote update and brief notes.

Prior Official Vote Count (212)
ZFR 1 - frostburn 138
babark 1 - dedo 202
bucktooth 1 - catte 187
dedo 2 - Joe 24, RWare 59
AmbitionZ 2 - babark 155, ZFR 193

Changes:

Ambiti0nZ 217 -> vote ZFR
This is continuation/end of Ambiti0nZ vs ZRF debate

detective_razza 228 -> vote babark
Doesn't know what to think of anyone and is trying to give babark a nudge by voting for them.

RWarehall 254 -> unvotes dedoporno, vote Ambiti0nZ
Thinks detective_razza is scum but won't vote for new players on day one, also thinks that either ZFR or Ambiti0nZ is hiding in plain sight (https://blog.n0p.me/img/hide-in-plain-sight/meme.jpeg) with Ambiti0nZ being more suspicious

FrostburnPhoenix 257 -> vote Ambiti0nZ
Claims that Ambiti0nZ seems scummy

LordCephy 264 -> vote babark
After several long posts, with links to other posts, detailing suspicions on Frost not being all that new and even saying outright that I think Frost is mafia, votes for babark instead on the basis I'd rather have a participating mafia over a possibly disinterested townie.

Current Count:
ZFR 2 - frostburn 138, Ambiti0nZ 217
babark 3 - dedo 202, detective_razza 228, LordCephy 264
bucktooth 1 - catte 187
dedo 1 - Joe 24
AmbitionZ 4 - babark 155, ZFR 193, RWarehall 254, FrostburnPhoenix 257

You forgot to remove my vote from ZFR.

Man, you're just so wholesome.