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Gilozard: Why is the OP downvoted? This is an interesting thing to now and something GOGers would be interested in.
Agreed. I have no idea why the OP was downvoted in this topic.

It's also annoying to those who are actually interested in the topic, as the link appears gray even when there are new posts, making it obnoxiously hard to follow.
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mechmouse: Would daughter not being able to play TombRaider while I play CIV5 count as a horror story?
It would probably count as a good example how little value you get out of an Steam account? While not being a horror story it would make a good story warning people to pay too high prices for games there because if more than one person wants to play them at the same time you have to buy them multiple times (under certain circumstances) and that is expensive.
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Gilozard: Ebooks are great.

DRM-removal software is free, easy and effective. Look up Calibre (library management software, like a virtual bookshelf) and Apprentice Alf's plugins (DRM-removal). I buy all kinds of ebooks and read them wherever using that software.

There's a lot of ebooks available DRM-free, especially public domain ones. Unless you really want a physical copy there's no reason to pay for a classic book anymore, just check out Project Gutenberg.
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omega64: Even if true why would I bother with drm removal software?
I'm not going to pay for it in the first place if they put those kinds of restrictions on me.
I don't have the space or energy to manage any more physical books. Ebooks are worth it for the ease of use, portability and space benefits.

There are lots of places to get DRM-free ebooks too, if you want. Smashwords is a good general publisher. Baen's ebook site sells fantasy and sci-fi. Archive of Our Own and FanfictionDownloader means that I have a lot of good stories at my finger tips for whatever show, movie or book I want.
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amok: 1) then it is not a separate point, and it is clearly stated on the TOS
2) Again, if it is marked that a Steam m agreement/account is needed then it is up to you to find out what it means. If this was not said at all, then you have a case.
3) sorry, I was not clear. I know this is the case today, what I am questioning is if this have not always been the case. You could never share an account before either. I questioned your statement that you could play one game one one account and your daughter a different game at the same time, and this was changed with the new TOS. I do not think this is correct, And would need to see some evidence to believe so.
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mechmouse: 3) I can't prove this, because there is no way to show you the pre 2008 version of Steam running. All I can hope is someone else with a 10Year + Steam account can remember it.

2) As mentioned, its not always disclosed at point of purchase. Even on physical packaging its small print, with no explanation.

1) Its still DRM causing issue, regardless if the TOS of said DRM supplier states the issue . 1 product effectively blocking an entirely different product, simple due to the choice of DRM.
3) the problem here is that you are making a claim, and you need to back it up. I remember never being able to do as you describe (without doing certain things... which you still can do), and I am a 10+ years Steam user. If you are right, there should be an outrage at the time, but a quick google do not show anything at all regarding this particular issue.

2) even if small print, then it is disclosed. It is up to you to read (and understand) the small print on anything you buy.

1) What I meant is, back in [url=https://www.gog.com/forum/general/eff_wants_your_drm_horror_stories/post39 ]post #39 [/url]you said "Firstly it assumes Steam is optional, it is not. For 80% of major games it is the DRM. " which is not an issue. That was what I was responding to, this is monoply, not DRM. Which makes it a monopoly horror story, not DRM horror story.
Post edited March 18, 2016 by amok
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Gilozard: Ebooks are great.
Indeed, having several hundreds of books on a thin and light 6" device is awesome.

Sadly, physical books are not quite as quick and easy to copy to the computer as CD's and DVD's are, so for books I have to actually get multiple copies if I want it in multiple formats (but I despise DRM, and will not support the practice, so I prefer a dead-tree version if a DRM-free ebook isn't available). I'm one of those who enjoy having the physical media (with their cases, if applicable) visible on a bookshelf while still having it quickly accessible on the computer (music, movies) or with me on the go (books, music).
Post edited March 18, 2016 by Maighstir
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omega64: At least now I have a clear reason never to get into ebooks.
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gooberking: When I was looking at it there was stuff that would get locked to a store (say B&N) but there were stores that let you buy books at a more generic level and load them onto generic devices. To do that you HAD to create an account with Adobe and their software would be required to monitor and authorize each install. There were limits to the number of devices you could have. It was a PITA if there ever was one.

That was a few years ago so stuff might have gotten vendor locked a lot more since then. E-books have a lot of the same issues music does with how much DRM gets in the way of expected usability. It's interesting that music DRM buckled under the problems it was creating where as books seem to be getting away with it a lot more successfully.
I have a generic reader, and I can buy DRM-free books at some web bookstores. Still a PITA in the sense that the catalog is seriously limited when compared with what I could get from Amazon or B&N, but in fact, it's not unlike the videogames situation. You just have to find a good independent e-bookstore.
Edit : Ninja'ed

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Gilozard: There are lots of places to get DRM-free ebooks too, if you want. Smashwords is a good general publisher. Baen's ebook site sells fantasy and sci-fi.
Oooo, I have to see if those have region locks or if they are available for me! Thanks for the references, man!
Post edited March 18, 2016 by Kardwill
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amok: 3) the problem here is that you are making a claim, and you need to back it up. I remember never being able to do as you describe (without doing certain things... which you still can do), and I am a 10+ years Steam user. If you are right, there should be an outrage at the time, but a quick google do not show anything at all regarding this particular issue.

2) even if small print, then it is disclosed. It is up to you to read (and understand) the small print on anything you buy.

1) What I meant is, back in [url=https://www.gog.com/forum/general/eff_wants_your_drm_horror_stories/post39 ]post #39 [/url]you said "Firstly it assumes Steam is optional, it is not. For 80% of major games it is the DRM. " which is not an issue. That was what I was responding to, this is monoply, not DRM. Which makes it a monopoly horror story, not DRM horror story.
I remember it well as me and the wife both used my account. She played her games and I played mine. It changed when they added achievements and the like. The social side of Steam was separate to the main client. Until then I cold have the client online on both computers and the chat online on mine.

When they changed it I had to rebuy her games.

As for noise. Its timing was perfect. Steam was optional. It was growing having about 7 million registered accounts, but still an experimental service. To be using the service you had to be a part of a minority. Broadband was a very expensive luxury, and to be frank most of its users fitted in with a certain social isolated sterotype. Some noise was made, i remember posting asking for some kind of family sharing system. However those post have long since gone.

Many people just went back to buying physical games. But Steam had got terminal velocity and kept growing, the majority of Steam users never knew anything else.

2) Steams TOS are not available at point of purchase, UNLESS you buy from Steam directly. I can walk to my local Game, buy Rise of The TombRadier and not see the SSA until after you've started to install. Yes I have the legal right to return, but the Store will not like it. I can buy a physical disc online and never know Steam is required. Its a life long contract yet has no real warning. Imagine buying a mobile and never seeing the contract until after you've paid for it.
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mechmouse: I remember it well as me and the wife both used my account. She played her games and I played mine. It changed when they added achievements and the like. The social side of Steam was separate to the main client. Until then I cold have the client online on both computers and the chat online on mine.

When they changed it I had to rebuy her games.

As for noise. Its timing was perfect. Steam was optional. It was growing having about 7 million registered accounts, but still an experimental service. To be using the service you had to be a part of a minority. Broadband was a very expensive luxury, and to be frank most of its users fitted in with a certain social isolated sterotype. Some noise was made, i remember posting asking for some kind of family sharing system. However those post have long since gone.

Many people just went back to buying physical games. But Steam had got terminal velocity and kept growing, the majority of Steam users never knew anything else.
and I don't remember this at all, except having to do things like putting one machine in offline mode to be able to do as you describe. And I know we had to do this. Would be good if anyone can confirm either or.

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mechmouse: 2) Steams TOS are not available at point of purchase, UNLESS you buy from Steam directly. I can walk to my local Game, buy Rise of The TombRadier and not see the SSA until after you've started to install. Yes I have the legal right to return, but the Store will not like it. I can buy a physical disc online and never know Steam is required. Its a life long contract yet has no real warning. Imagine buying a mobile and never seeing the contract until after you've paid for it.
I don't know about you, but if anything I buy says it requires you to have something, I would find out what it is first. And as I said before, as long as this is printed on the box, be it in small print, you have been given fair warnings. It is up to you to take a chance on something you do not know or not.