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Furytear: Realistically a wizard would not by default be using solely melee or ranged weapon attacks with a full spell book at their disposal.
One can easily make a melee wizard. If he would default to magic it'd be a nightmare to fix. Octavia has that built into engine and you wouldn't believe how many people whined about it. Just right-click a cantrip and they would use it instead of basic attack like Octavia does.

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Furytear: mildly annoying having to pause and stop the flow of battle because a character gets critical hit or melee attackers are getting decimated by enemies that an intelligent wizard could be damaging with spells.
It's literally in the name. RTwP, where P stands for pause. It's just players didn't see an RPG that would kick their behind somewhat in years, so they kinda glanced over the pause part of the system. If you find it too cumbersome maybe turn based mod if for you.
Post edited March 15, 2020 by InEffect
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Furytear: Realistically a wizard would not by default be using solely melee or ranged weapon attacks with a full spell book at their disposal.
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InEffect: One can easily make a melee wizard. If he would default to magic it'd be a nightmare to fix. Octavia has that built into engine and you wouldn't believe how many people whined about it. Just right-click a cantrip and they would use it instead of basic attack like Octavia does.

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Furytear: mildly annoying having to pause and stop the flow of battle because a character gets critical hit or melee attackers are getting decimated by enemies that an intelligent wizard could be damaging with spells.
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InEffect: It's literally in the name. RTwP, where P stands for pause. It's just players didn't see an RPG that would kick their behind somewhat in years, so they kinda glanced over the pause part of the system. If you find it too cumbersome maybe turn based mod if for you.
In DND games that I have played such as the Neverwinter Nights series and Baldur's Gate spell casters can have the AI set to go all out casting all spells, conserve magic by only casting lower level spells or they can be set to exclusively attack using weapons and not cast spells(which is a good option if playing through an area with many enemies weak against weapon attacks with a tough boss in the area). Being able to pause the battle is a good option to have when implementing a strategy sure but it's kind of negated if the player is forced to manually select everything other than melee attacking then it might as well not have the RTB aspect and just be turn based.

I'm gonna try out the right clicking spells here in a bit maybe it will change my mind but for now I think there's no intelligence in having spell casters default to weapon attacks that'd be like a ranged attacker running in for melee attacks with their bow. if the enemy casters can cast spells by default then the PCs should be able to be set to also.
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Furytear: In DND games that I have played such as the Neverwinter Nights series and Baldur's Gate spell casters can have the AI set to go all out casting all spells, conserve magic by only casting lower level spells or they can be set to exclusively attack using weapons and not cast spells(which is a good option if playing through an area with many enemies weak against weapon attacks with a tough boss in the area). Being able to pause the battle is a good option to have when implementing a strategy sure but it's kind of negated if the player is forced to manually select everything other than melee attacking then it might as well not have the RTB aspect and just be turn based.

I'm gonna try out the right clicking spells here in a bit maybe it will change my mind but for now I think there's no intelligence in having spell casters default to weapon attacks that'd be like a ranged attacker running in for melee attacks with their bow. if the enemy casters can cast spells by default then the PCs should be able to be set to also.
Your casters spamming spells is not a problem in games that don't have time limits and as such limited rest. Beauty of this game is that you have to manage and conserve your spells, so your casters spend most of the time casting cantrips and usually expend about 2-3 spells slots per battle each if you play your hand right(so you don't have to babysit em every round). You actually don't want them to go nova in every combat and that'd be pretty hard to script. Once you get a good grip on combat systems in the game you will find the effort to micro things minimal. It's not SC ladder by any means. Even switching songs on a bard every round is actually not that big of a hassle since the battles are so short if you are already playing optimally.

Unlimited rest was the bane of all RPG's ever. Why even bother with melee? have your wizards turn everything into fiery hell instead. Yay. The light touch of pressure to the player is the best design decision they've made.
Post edited March 15, 2020 by InEffect
Yeah, baldur's gate is kind of a terrible example, unlimited rest is horrible design, and only really worked because players didn't know any better. The player either wasn't that good at the game, OR the player was roleplaying ON PURPOSE and as such wouldn't abuse over resting because they were used to a DM telling them something akin to, you've been awake for 1 hour, you can't go back to sleep now.

Pillars of eternity introduced some interesting camping supply systems that helped limit that, and pathfinder kingmaker sort of runs with that theme to even more extremes. (Although the first mechanic I saw to limit it was in the nwn2 dlc that added a curse that effected resting slightly).

Baldur's gate casters were so vastly overpowered that the strongest 6 man party of the epic level expansion pack throne of baal (for baldur's gate 2), was literally, 1 sorcerer. There literally wasn't any party of 6 characters that was stronger than 1 sorcerer alone.

He could cast like 50 fireballs (delayed and/or fire trap) per rest (simulcrum), he couldn't be targeted by enemies ever (simulcrum+invis+immunitytospellsthatdispelslashpenetrate), and he could stop time. If he had party members that would just ruin his stealthy strategy, and lead to there being pockets of terrain he couldn't blast because party members were in that spot.

Not to mention added party members would be a waste of exp.
Post edited March 15, 2020 by left1000
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left1000: Yeah, baldur's gate is kind of a terrible example, unlimited rest is horrible design, and only really worked because players didn't know any better. The player either wasn't that good at the game, OR the player was roleplaying ON PURPOSE and as such wouldn't abuse over resting because they were used to a DM telling them something akin to, you've been awake for 1 hour, you can't go back to sleep now.

Pillars of eternity introduced some interesting camping supply systems that helped limit that, and pathfinder kingmaker sort of runs with that theme to even more extremes. (Although the first mechanic I saw to limit it was in the nwn2 dlc that added a curse that effected resting slightly).

Baldur's gate casters were so vastly overpowered that the strongest 6 man party of the epic level expansion pack throne of baal (for baldur's gate 2), was literally, 1 sorcerer. There literally wasn't any party of 6 characters that was stronger than 1 sorcerer alone.

He could cast like 50 fireballs (delayed and/or fire trap) per rest (simulcrum), he couldn't be targeted by enemies ever (simulcrum+invis+immunitytospellsthatdispelslashpenetrate), and he could stop time. If he had party members that would just ruin his stealthy strategy, and lead to there being pockets of terrain he couldn't blast because party members were in that spot.

Not to mention added party members would be a waste of exp.
With stratagems it's not as braindead when it comes to BG, but the resting thing still ruins everything.
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InEffect: Unlimited rest was the bane of all RPG's ever. Why even bother with melee? have your wizards turn everything into fiery hell instead. Yay. The light touch of pressure to the player is the best design decision they've made.
I could never understand why people actually did this. Whack two goblins with 3 cloudkill and then rest. Yawn. Must have been boring to play like that. I always found it fun to try to restrict spells and go for as long as possible, and would actually quite regularly have people tire out from time/fatigue, so I had to sleep due to that rather than emptying spells. Same with Pillars games, tried to restrict it there too, though those games were kinda broken spellwise due to all the "per combat" stuff.

Back on topic, this seems to be largely fixed now? I started out without AI on everybody, but it became a chore and pause fest. Still manually direct the spellcasters, but everybody else are doing their own things, which generally works well. Especially for melee, who smash up one enemy and then move on to the next without me having to direct them. Makes combat much smoother. And then I can focus on casting some spells from the backline, and use cantrips in easy combat, and to kill trolls.
Post edited April 26, 2020 by Pangaea666
The AI does have issues. Mainly cause it doesn't do much apart from pile-on. And is rather braindead when it comes to running into AoE's. And for companions people want scripts like in pillars so they can kick back and watch the game play itself.
Not sure what the scripts did in Pillars, because I never used them. Would be nice with something like that here too for the people that want it and would use it, but it's not easy to program. Especially if you want spellcasters to use scripts, but not blow the most powerful spells on 'nothing' encounters.

Am used to micromanage fights from other games like this, so melee AI working decently is actually a step forward from my perspective. Combat is fun, especially as a caster, as you can turn the tide. Basically sitting back and letting it play out wouldn't be much fun for me, but I guess people differ.

I've not had problems with backliners firing their weapons, though. Tristian does that quite regularly for me. He uses a crossbow fine enough. The game is touchy when casting spells though. Often it will bug out and do nothing if I order a new spell upon autopause when the last was cast. Can be lethal in the wrong fights.
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InEffect: Unlimited rest was the bane of all RPG's ever. Why even bother with melee? have your wizards turn everything into fiery hell instead. Yay. The light touch of pressure to the player is the best design decision they've made.
There could be other solutions, for example, repawning enemies on rest (like Dark Souls).
BTW, from my perspective, most offensive spells are useless, only selected few are strong. Sometimes higher-level offensive spell is actually weaker that low-level one (for example, Blade Barrier is better than any 7-9 lvl spells). Most offensive spells require significant buffs,

Sure, i can uderstand, why this game has so poor AI for party members - if developers couldnt find enough means to make different icons for different spells, how they could afford complex AI? We should be really grateful they made so good game with so poor funding.
Post edited April 27, 2020 by MortalKombat33
Respawns would do nothing good. Never do. it's just more grind and they already had to reduce combat exp significantly due to the crpg nature of the game, so that would have to be nerfed even further. And most importantly it would do nothing to cull rest spam. So what if things respawned? You aint going back to check.
Wonder how they will solve this in the next game, though, where we (presumably) won't have a kingdom to manage with harsh timers for problems to knock on our door. Maybe they'll do something similar with other mechanics.

Although it's terribly unrealistic, I think the need for overly heavy supplies has worked well. Has hopefully restricted the rest spamming for those who like to do that, and it doesn't really negatively impact the way I play (restrict spell usage until we truly need it, and try to get through a whole map without resting).

Haven't noticed identical icons all that much, but it's definitely an annoyance for healing spells and remove disease spell (?) that seemingly everybody have in abundance. Means I need to hover every time one of those must be used.

Main thing: I hope the next game will be launched without such colossal problems with bugs. From what I've read all over the place, it was pretty much unplayable on release. With a more normal release (even these days, games usually aren't so bad upon release), the game may have sold a great deal more, on the back of more positive reviews from both users and errr, others.
given the next game will be even bigger I wouldn't count on a bug-free release. I would prefer it, but I'm rather realistic about it. Buggy releases is just the norm of an industry at this point. If AAA games get a free pass I don't see a reason to drag indies for it so long as they make em playable at a reasonable pace.
I'm definitely not expecting a bug FREE release, but from all I've read about the game, it sounded like it was nigh on unplayable at release with serious bugs and show stoppers galore. That is a good deal worse than what is the norm, even in today's market. And I bet it caused the game to sell less than it should have. So I hope they have learnt from that. It's better to postpone the release than release it in that kind of state.
Release was indeed kinda rough, but the game was 'playable' in less than a month after, so I'll give it a path. There are more than enough AAA titles releasing with a critical path bugs and those are not fast on their feet to fix em cause they have consoles to validate patches on.
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InEffect: Unlimited rest was the bane of all RPG's ever. Why even bother with melee? have your wizards turn everything into fiery hell instead. Yay. The light touch of pressure to the player is the best design decision they've made.
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MortalKombat33: There could be other solutions, for example, repawning enemies on rest (like Dark Souls).
BTW, from my perspective, most offensive spells are useless, only selected few are strong. Sometimes higher-level offensive spell is actually weaker that low-level one (for example, Blade Barrier is better than any 7-9 lvl spells). Most offensive spells require significant buffs,

Sure, i can uderstand, why this game has so poor AI for party members - if developers couldnt find enough means to make different icons for different spells, how they could afford complex AI? We should be really grateful they made so good game with so poor funding.
If you like Spiderweb Software, his new came, Queen's Wish, tried to solve this issue CRPG's have had since forever. Basically, resource based games with no way to enforce the resource. Well, fix it without just giving up and going to a per-encounter system, like something like Dragon Age did, which has it's own issues.

Basically, once you enter a dungeon, you have to beat it without leaving to recharge. If you recharge, it's back from square one. You can't overstock on potions, you have a set number (that does get bigger) that also refill. So, you have to manage resources to clear a dungeon in one shot.

The game had tons and tons of issues, but I liked the attempt, as I'm really tired of having to put 'rest restrictions' on myself in these types of games.