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Might and Magic seriesWorld of Xeen challenge?(9 posts)solved(9 posts)solved
(9 posts)solved
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Posted March 20, 2023
I'm looking for a way or ways to make the World of Xeen game much more challenging.

I don't want to do "hardcore" in the sense of starting over every time the party dies--to me, that is more tedious than challenging.

I recently started a game with Ninja, 3 Clerics, Druid, Sorceror, with the restriction that I would cast no combat spells (only transportation, knowledge, and buff/protection spells). I'm around level 10 and starting to feel like it's going to be easy anyway. Maybe I'll have to take away buff and/or protection spells, too.

Does anyone have other good suggestions for self-imposed challenges?
e.g is it challenging (and fun) to play a 2-character party? (My sense is that a 1-player party might be challenging but is certainly not fun.)

Thanks!
This question / problem has been solved by dtgreeneimage
Posted March 20, 2023
See how far you can get without training. In other words, no using the training halls in any of the towns.

With this restriction, can you defeat the Mega Dragon? (It's possible.)

A different challenge might be to avoid all fountains and other temporary stat boosts. Or you could try avoiding permanent boosts as well.

(Note that "no training" and "no temporary boosts" might not be a feasible combination.)
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Malachi1971: the restriction that I would cast no combat spells (only transportation, knowledge, and buff/protection spells). I'm around level 10 and starting to feel like it's going to be easy anyway. Maybe I'll have to take away buff and/or protection spells, too.
Combat spells aren't that great in this game anyway. They're interesting, but not actually that useful in the long run.

Therefore, I'd suggest allowing combat spells, but not buff/protection spells; this rule will keep combat interesting by allowing the use of magic, while keeping things challenging by not making physical attacks overpowered by end-game.

Another idea along these lines would be to, instead of disallowing combat spells, instead disallow physical attacks, as it's those that are the most powerful. (With this said, I would consider replacing at least one Cleric with another Sorcerer, just so that you have more offensive spells to throw.)

Another idea: Remove that ninja, and see how far you can get and how much you can explore, and what quests you can still complete, without any Thievery character in the party. (So, no Robber or Ninja.)

Edit: The "no physical attacks" rule does need an exception: If you're fighting a Lord Xeen, you are allowed to use physical attacks against that particular enemy type only. (Otherwise, it would be impossible to beat Clouds of Xeen with that rule.)
Post edited March 20, 2023 by dtgreene
Posted March 20, 2023
Thanks for the suggestions, dtgreene, I might try more than one of these challenges. I'm happy to take away fountains because it's a pain to time and coordinate fountain visits, and they seem to make the party totally OP anyway.. For that reason, I'm not so interested in the "no training" challenge.

One reason I like the limited spells is that it's hilarious to me to take a Sorceror (elven, of course) and force him to fight with a dagger or staff the whole game as though he were a tank. The title of my game is "Squishies," for obvious reasons.

That being said, I agree that magic makes the game more interesting, as long as it isn't too strong.

Do you happen to know if there are enemies that can't be defeated without magic? Would that rule need exceptions?

Maybe no physical attacks will be my next run, assuming there is one. I'll wind up with a Robber or Ninja standing around doing nothing during combat. (I like finding items too much to give up lockpicking) I can name him catman. My cat lies around doing nothing, too.

It would be nice if games like these had more difficulty levels.
Posted March 20, 2023
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Malachi1971: Do you happen to know if there are enemies that can't be defeated without magic? Would that rule need exceptions?
There is exactly one enemy that can't be defeated without magic, and it's the one I mentioned in the post. That particular enemy is the only enemy you'd need an exception for.
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Malachi1971: I'll wind up with a Robber or Ninja standing around doing nothing during combat. (I like finding items too much to give up lockpicking)
Worth noting that the rule does not forbid using spellcasting items, and there's that nice "recharge item" spell.

(On the other hand, note that the most powerful spells can't be found in rechargeable items in this game, and there seems to be a bug that can give enemies an extra turn when an item is used.)
Post edited March 20, 2023 by dtgreene
Posted March 20, 2023
I thought you said that Lord Xeen couldn't be defeated without physical attacks. Are you saying he also can't be beaten without magic?
Posted March 20, 2023
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Malachi1971: I thought you said that Lord Xeen couldn't be defeated without physical attacks. Are you saying he also can't be beaten without magic?
Either I misspoke, or you misread what I was saying.

That Lord Xeen enemy can only be harmed with one particular weapon, and no other way.

Every enemy can be killed with physical attacks, but for some (like the ones in Winterkill), you will need to either have elemental weapons or the weapon I mentioned earlier.

(Worth noting that, since you can trade that weapon between party members, I would justify using the "I Lost It" cheat to get extra copies of that weapon, but only after you've obtained the weapon through the normal method.)
Posted March 21, 2023
To elaborate a bit on dtgreene's point: Lord Xeen is 100% resistant to all damage types that can be resisted. There exists one special weapon in the game that deals a damage type which cannot be resisted. All spells, and all weapons other than this special one, use damage types that can be resisted, and are therefore unable to harm Lord Xeen. Since this weapon cannot be resisted, it is therefore able to harm Lord Xeen. It has the additional slightly exploitable property that because its damage cannot be resisted, it can harm highly resistant enemies more efficiently than other weapons.
Posted March 21, 2023
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advowson: Since this weapon cannot be resisted, it is therefore able to harm Lord Xeen. It has the additional slightly exploitable property that because its damage cannot be resisted, it can harm highly resistant enemies more efficiently than other weapons.
On the other hand, it doesn't get the large to-hit and damage bonuses that weapons made of fancy materials like Obsidian get, so there actually is a trade-off there.
Posted March 22, 2023
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advowson: To elaborate a bit on dtgreene's point: Lord Xeen is 100% resistant to all damage types that can be resisted. There exists one special weapon in the game that deals a damage type which cannot be resisted. All spells, and all weapons other than this special one, use damage types that can be resisted, and are therefore unable to harm Lord Xeen. Since this weapon cannot be resisted, it is therefore able to harm Lord Xeen. It has the additional slightly exploitable property that because its damage cannot be resisted, it can harm highly resistant enemies more efficiently than other weapons.
Thanks for the clarification. :)
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Might and Magic seriesWorld of Xeen challenge?(9 posts)solved(9 posts)solved
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