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Icewind Dale seriesI wont recommend it(53 posts)(53 posts)
(53 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted September 25, 2013
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PetrusOctavianus: Never played Sacred, but I loved Icewind Dale.
As much as I love turn based combat and didn't like Real Time with Pause at first, now I'm glad that BioWare did something different with the Infinity Engine.

If you think Icewind Dale is an action game, then you have misunderstood. It is a hack&slash game, though, and a damned fine one at that.
And if you think story is what makes an RPG you are even more misinformed.
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deathknight1728: Its still too fucking hard. I mean the enemies you face in Baldurs Gate and Planescape are but a fraction of what you have to face in IWDale1. Its just brutally imbalanced and some of the enemies are impossible for any party. I rolled up a really good party with good stats and yet the enemies you face are just frustrating.

I played IWDale 2 a while back and that game like this one is crap as well. You can't expect people to get through games where you got to be 100% right all the time.

The makers of the game just littered each lvl with enemies regardless of their stats and abilities. It doesn't take a lot of smarts to know that the game wasn't properly finished.

I took my rogue through the lvls in stealth and all I found was enemy upon enemy upon enemy. In planescape and BG, there was at least some interaction and talking involved.

This game is a good reason why Black Isle went bankrupt.
The makers of the game just littered each lvl with enemies regardless of their stats and abilities. It doesn't take a lot of smarts to know that the game wasn't properly finished.

Each particular dungeon is actually designed with inherent, though not immediately obvious strategic advantages. The dungeons were people with monsters that have certain abilities and skills, and so they were also designed in such a way as to allow you to position your party in such a way as to take advantage of it's skills to fight those enemies effectively. This is, of course, contingent upon an assumption that you have created a balanced party with a wide range of skills. It's not your typical hack and slash, and it is a far cry from that steaming pile that was Sacred. a lesser man would call those fightin' words.
Posted September 25, 2013
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PetrusOctavianus: Never played Sacred, but I loved Icewind Dale.
As much as I love turn based combat and didn't like Real Time with Pause at first, now I'm glad that BioWare did something different with the Infinity Engine.

If you think Icewind Dale is an action game, then you have misunderstood. It is a hack&slash game, though, and a damned fine one at that.
And if you think story is what makes an RPG you are even more misinformed.
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deathknight1728: Its still too fucking hard. I mean the enemies you face in Baldurs Gate and Planescape are but a fraction of what you have to face in IWDale1. Its just brutally imbalanced and some of the enemies are impossible for any party. I rolled up a really good party with good stats and yet the enemies you face are just frustrating.

I played IWDale 2 a while back and that game like this one is crap as well. You can't expect people to get through games where you got to be 100% right all the time.

The makers of the game just littered each lvl with enemies regardless of their stats and abilities. It doesn't take a lot of smarts to know that the game wasn't properly finished.

I took my rogue through the lvls in stealth and all I found was enemy upon enemy upon enemy. In planescape and BG, there was at least some interaction and talking involved.

This game is a good reason why Black Isle went bankrupt.
There's a reason why Torment was oriented that way: That is what the Planescape tabletop campaign was about. It was about choice and consequence. I have yet to play Torment, but I look forward to it with much anticipation. However, I am also capable of doing a little research before I purchase a game. It seems like you purchased IWD thinking that it was story oriented just because it was an infinity engine game set in the Forgotten realms. As a gamer, such a decision making process is fatal. you need to go to the forums and participate in the discussions if you're as picky as you seem to be. That way, you will greatly minimize the risk of buying a game that you don't like (especially when you're dealing with veteran classics like these).
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deathknight1728: I really tried to like this game. It's set in the forgotten realms, its an infinity engine game, its top down. The problem is I just can't seem to get into the difficulty. Im talking about Dale 1, although Ive played the 2nd which isn't my fav either.

It just seems like every game ever made where you create a party instead of a character like Bg and PS:T, just doesn't have as much to offer. I can't say that there's been 1 experience where Ive created a party and enjoyed the game. It's either too hard or something else.

But if I can role-play with a character like BG, Avadon or PS: T, your in the money. Im sure that action/rpg fans must love ice wind dale as its got very little story enough to call it an rpg. Still up to chapter 2 is ok until you get to the lizard king. Then again action/rpg fans of sacred must love it.

For me, I prefer turnbased rpgs where I can give orders all at once.
For me, I prefer turnbased rpgs where I can give orders all at once.

I've always felt that the real time pause option in the AD&D games served exactly the same function with the excitement of real time adjustments. but that's me.
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PetrusOctavianus: Never played Sacred, but I loved Icewind Dale.
As much as I love turn based combat and didn't like Real Time with Pause at first, now I'm glad that BioWare did something different with the Infinity Engine.

If you think Icewind Dale is an action game, then you have misunderstood. It is a hack&slash game, though, and a damned fine one at that.
And if you think story is what makes an RPG you are even more misinformed.
avatar
deathknight1728: Its still too fucking hard. I mean the enemies you face in Baldurs Gate and Planescape are but a fraction of what you have to face in IWDale1. Its just brutally imbalanced and some of the enemies are impossible for any party. I rolled up a really good party with good stats and yet the enemies you face are just frustrating.

I played IWDale 2 a while back and that game like this one is crap as well. You can't expect people to get through games where you got to be 100% right all the time.

The makers of the game just littered each lvl with enemies regardless of their stats and abilities. It doesn't take a lot of smarts to know that the game wasn't properly finished.

I took my rogue through the lvls in stealth and all I found was enemy upon enemy upon enemy. In planescape and BG, there was at least some interaction and talking involved.

This game is a good reason why Black Isle went bankrupt.
If you want to dual class, you have to make sure that your characters have at least the minimum ratings for their requisite stats, and you should create the party with particular classes in mind for each character. There is no multi-classing in this series, so you should dual-class early to ensure that you get the full benefit of doing so.
Post edited September 25, 2013 by Cullen12
Posted September 25, 2013
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Coelocanth: A party of 2? There's nothing wrong with that, but keep in mind the game was designed with the intent that you'd be playing a six character party. If you're having that much trouble with your party of two, then I recommend adding at least one other member.

That being said, what character classes are you playing with your party of 2? The beetles are fairly easily handled with a simple magic spell like Web or Entangle, then pelt them with ranged weapons. Or you could use summons to act as meat shields/cannon fodder. Depends on what your party is capable of.
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deathknight1728: I completely understand what you are trying to say, however I am not very bad where I don't think its the characters I made. My characters happen to be a bunch of little badasses, the problem I am having is moreso that I havent played all my tactics yet and don't want to be forced to using them. Im going to have to use some of the most cheap tactics its just Im not used to this game after just finishing Planescape Torment and Baldurs Gate. If this was turn based I would be using 4 or 3 characters, but its real time and PS:T and BG 1 and 2 Ive used only solo and 2 man parties.

I find a party of 6 is too confusing to manage all the players. The less characters you rely on the better. Besides your telling me that a party of 6 at least 2 of the characters aren't worthless compared to the rest. There's ALWAYS at least 2 characters that can't pull the weight. Also a team of 2-3 badasses is much more realistic.

I know it isn't realistic but solo characters if there wasn't a lvl cap would be the most insane. Who wants to mess with a badass warrior who can utilize number of different utility skills and be as powerful as a team of 4.

Im using a human Paladin who wields a Longsword and Shield with plate mail armor and defensive items. He is resistant to weapon damage and has high health. My thief is a badass too. He is elven and wields a scimitar +2 which is lucky. He deals damage on par with my paladin and has 1 thaco better than my pally which is awesome as he is a thief. He also has similar health points to my pally (from items) which is awesome seeing as my pally has a good constitution.

Any tips on the party weapons? I wanted to give the pally a better weapon like a mace but wasn't sure that would be ideal as swords are usually better in most of these games.
It is very important to understand that IWD deliberately does not manifest as many generally protective items and spells as say BG or BG2, because it was designed to force the player to synergise in order to solve the general problem of the game. It will also manifest a number of items that are alignment specific. A Paladin will only be able to use certain weapons. What are your weapon proficiencies? That will help me answer that question for you. Because fighters, like the Paladin, can choose any proficiency they desire in this game. It gets down to preference. If you like Great swords, then try to stick to great swords, because you will take a THAC0 penalty if you use a weapon that you do not have a proficiency in. That may also be one of the reasons why you find this game so hard. Are you paying attention to your character's weapons proficiencies, or are you just giving them the weapons that seem the best? You should also try to have a cache of other weapons that each character carries with them (especially the fighters); because, like in BG & BG2, there are numerous enemies that can only be hit by weapons with certain THAC0 ratings (+1, +2, etc). However, the number of such enemies in IWD appears to be much lower than in BG2. I hope this helped answer your question about weapons in IWD, and please feel free to ask me more questions.
Posted September 26, 2013
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Coelocanth: A party of 2? There's nothing wrong with that, but keep in mind the game was designed with the intent that you'd be playing a six character party. If you're having that much trouble with your party of two, then I recommend adding at least one other member.

That being said, what character classes are you playing with your party of 2? The beetles are fairly easily handled with a simple magic spell like Web or Entangle, then pelt them with ranged weapons. Or you could use summons to act as meat shields/cannon fodder. Depends on what your party is capable of.
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deathknight1728: I completely understand what you are trying to say, however I am not very bad where I don't think its the characters I made. My characters happen to be a bunch of little badasses, the problem I am having is moreso that I havent played all my tactics yet and don't want to be forced to using them. Im going to have to use some of the most cheap tactics its just Im not used to this game after just finishing Planescape Torment and Baldurs Gate. If this was turn based I would be using 4 or 3 characters, but its real time and PS:T and BG 1 and 2 Ive used only solo and 2 man parties.

I find a party of 6 is too confusing to manage all the players. The less characters you rely on the better. Besides your telling me that a party of 6 at least 2 of the characters aren't worthless compared to the rest. There's ALWAYS at least 2 characters that can't pull the weight. Also a team of 2-3 badasses is much more realistic.

I know it isn't realistic but solo characters if there wasn't a lvl cap would be the most insane. Who wants to mess with a badass warrior who can utilize number of different utility skills and be as powerful as a team of 4.

Im using a human Paladin who wields a Longsword and Shield with plate mail armor and defensive items. He is resistant to weapon damage and has high health. My thief is a badass too. He is elven and wields a scimitar +2 which is lucky. He deals damage on par with my paladin and has 1 thaco better than my pally which is awesome as he is a thief. He also has similar health points to my pally (from items) which is awesome seeing as my pally has a good constitution.

Any tips on the party weapons? I wanted to give the pally a better weapon like a mace but wasn't sure that would be ideal as swords are usually better in most of these games.
Also: just because certain classes can't use certain weapons doesn't mean that you shouldn't consider using them. It just means that they will be that much more proficient in the weapons that they can use (especially if you give them proficiency slots in such). And ranged weapons are ABSOLUTELY ESSENTIAL in this game. That's yet another reason why it's better to play with a full party that has magic, range, and melee capacities. Again, there are numerous combinations, just try something. So you'll have to start over; you don't have to do it now. come back to it in few months or so.
Posted September 26, 2013
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deathknight1728: The thing that gets me so annoyed about the game is the same reason I get annoyed about many games that are good but refuse to let me finish them and are generally frustrating beyond reason. What annoys the heck out of me is that I WANT to be able to finish it, I get into it A LOT and then the game just becomes unplayable for my party.

If the game sucked completely I would just be like ok whatever, but when a game has a lot of good qualities and then just bails on me, I get IMMENSELY frustrated.

I think that my party was a good 2 man party but I just don't know what to do to get past those beetles in Dragons Eye.
The beetles on the first level of Dragon's Eye do not use Call Friends, as I recall, so the best tactic is to try to coax a few of them out at a time. Also, ranged weapons and magic really help in Dragon's eye, as it is designed to allow you to exploit it's environment in that way. But once you get to the lower levels, before the final floor, area effect spells such as web a number of the druid AE spells will help you deal with the challenges that the game will throw at you in this chapter. Again: each stage offers new challenges, like any good game does. It is your task, as the gamer, to meet those challenges and do what you have to solve the problem.
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deathknight1728: The thing that gets me so annoyed about the game is the same reason I get annoyed about many games that are good but refuse to let me finish them and are generally frustrating beyond reason. What annoys the heck out of me is that I WANT to be able to finish it, I get into it A LOT and then the game just becomes unplayable for my party.

If the game sucked completely I would just be like ok whatever, but when a game has a lot of good qualities and then just bails on me, I get IMMENSELY frustrated.

I think that my party was a good 2 man party but I just don't know what to do to get past those beetles in Dragons Eye.
Why don't you try just going to another part of the cave and exploring? There is a battle in the first level of Dragon's Eye that gives the antidote you need to deal with those beetles. That is a basic gaming rule: if you can't budge in one direction, try another, and you will likely find a more defensible position or an item that will aide you in gaining territory in that other section of the dungeon. You have to be PATIENT.
Post edited September 26, 2013 by Cullen12
Posted September 27, 2013
I always enjoyed the overall story arc of Icewind Dale. I know you don't have the inter personal relationships you get from the Baldur's Gate series but there is something to be said for creating your own group as well.

The story line at the end wasn't something I expected at the start of the game, I really liked the twist at the end :)
Posted October 01, 2013
I had to stop playing. I think a lot of it comes from me not being very good at party based games. I always like to play single character rpgs like fallout and eschalon and the quest-and I am pretty good at them too. When it comes down to party based games, I just don't get into the tactics of the game. Thats probably why I play with such a small group. For me, a lone badass will always accomplish more and it will be more fun in the process.

Im sure ice wind dale is fun, but I can't get past chapter 2 without turning into a sociopath in the process. Its too relentlessly brutal and that means 1 less game to play.
Posted October 02, 2013
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deathknight1728: I had to stop playing. I think a lot of it comes from me not being very good at party based games. I always like to play single character rpgs like fallout and eschalon and the quest-and I am pretty good at them too. When it comes down to party based games, I just don't get into the tactics of the game. Thats probably why I play with such a small group. For me, a lone badass will always accomplish more and it will be more fun in the process.

Im sure ice wind dale is fun, but I can't get past chapter 2 without turning into a sociopath in the process. Its too relentlessly brutal and that means 1 less game to play.
I finished IWD1 with a solo multi-class fighter/thief/mage not too long ago so you can try that. To my surprise, it made the game much easier than I thought, especially when you get your hands on the sunfire spell and the ring of wizardry.
Posted October 03, 2013
Someone makes a 2 char. party and then complains about difficulty? Really? :-\

IWD has certainly a steeper difficulty than most modern games (your characters can actually die and everything) but it's by no means a particularly hard game. If the game keeps handing your head to you, you are doing something wrong. In this case it's fairly obvious what it is.
Post edited October 03, 2013 by RaggieRags
Posted October 05, 2013
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deathknight1728: I think that my party was a good 2 man party but I just don't know what to do to get past those beetles in Dragons Eye.
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Coelocanth: A party of 2? There's nothing wrong with that, but keep in mind the game was designed with the intent that you'd be playing a six character party. If you're having that much trouble with your party of two, then I recommend adding at least one other member.

That being said, what character classes are you playing with your party of 2? The beetles are fairly easily handled with a simple magic spell like Web or Entangle, then pelt them with ranged weapons. Or you could use summons to act as meat shields/cannon fodder. Depends on what your party is capable of.
Ok I decided to give this game another chance even though it friggin kicked my ass last time. Im going to try a new idea I had so any info on this would be great.
What about a Druid and a Thief party? You can use your druid as a summoner which is deadly when you can swarm the enemy with a host of monsters that you summon. From there you can let the druid fight as a makedo fighter with scimitar, while the rogue backstabs the enemy mage/what not. You've got healing/summoning/fighting and a host of monsters to make the party of 2 more like 4 or 5.

Will that work successfully? I really want to find something that works with my playstyle. I obviously have a lot to learn but Im hoping that the pain and frustration will land me the ability to eventually beat this game with a 2 man party!
Posted October 05, 2013
Why not simply cover the bases with the two man party and go with a FTR/Thief and a Cleric/Mage? That way you've got healing, arcane casting. melee, and thief skills. All wrapped up in two characters.
Posted October 06, 2013
I'd encourage the following party build for IWD1:

1 ranger
1 paladin
1 cleric
1 thief
1 fighter/ magic-user
1 specialist wizard

For IWD2:

1 sorcerer
1 fighter
1 barbarian
1 druid
1 cleric
1 wizard

You get into multi-classing easier in IWD2, but those choices will set you up for long-term success even if you never multi-class.
Posted October 06, 2013
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Larias: I'd encourage the following party build for IWD1:

1 ranger
1 paladin
1 cleric
1 thief
1 fighter/ magic-user
1 specialist wizard
All well and good and not a bad suggestion, except the OP is looking for a two character party.
Posted October 06, 2013
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Larias: I'd encourage the following party build for IWD1:

1 ranger
1 paladin
1 cleric
1 thief
1 fighter/ magic-user
1 specialist wizard
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Coelocanth: All well and good and not a bad suggestion, except the OP is looking for a two character party.
I'm sorry. I hadn't read all the posts.
Posted October 07, 2013
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Larias: I'd encourage the following party build for IWD1:

1 ranger
1 paladin
1 cleric
1 thief
1 fighter/ magic-user
1 specialist wizard
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Coelocanth: All well and good and not a bad suggestion, except the OP is looking for a two character party.
Im sorry I am bothering all but I really want to find a way to get through this game and make a successful group of badasses without making the game shit easy by using a fighter/thief or fighter/mage. Trust me, I made a fighter/thief in Shadows of Amn and it defeats the purpose of the game its so easy. I don't like multi classes for a reason that they are overpowered.

If I can solo dragons in BG2 with solo fighter/thief thats a little ridiculous. Whats the point of a party when you got a munchinized solo nut.
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Icewind Dale seriesI wont recommend it(53 posts)(53 posts)
(53 posts)