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General discussion (archive)The Problem with Anti-piracy Schemes(28 posts)(28 posts)
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Posted March 07, 2012
The Problem with Anti-piracy Schemes
By Stardock's CEO, Brad Wardell
When Stardock was running Impulse, we got to hear a lot from companies regarding to their feelings towards software piracy. In many cases, it was clear that the motivation to stop piracy was less about maximizing sales and more about preventing people who didn't pay for the game from playing it. I felt this was misguided.

When I see our games pirated, it definitely annoys me. I put a lot of myself into our software and seeing someone "stealing" it is upsetting. But at the same time, the response to piracy should be, to paraphrase The Godfather, "Just business". Simply put, the goal should be to maximize sales, not worry about people who wouldn't buy your game in the first place. I've said this in the past but until we were digitally distributing third party games, I didn't realize how prevalent the "stop those pirates" philosophy was.

Part of the problem with piracy is the terminology. There are really two, completely disparate groups that get lumped together. There are the people who just won't pay for software no matter what and there are the people who pirate software out of convenience.

The former group is much larger than the latter but it is the latter group that the lost potential sales really come from. Apple has become the world's most successful company by focusing its attention on the customer experience. iTunes songs don't even have DRM as most would define it today. They focus their attention on people who buy things. I think this is the most profitable way to focus ones efforts.

If game developers can focus more attention on improving their user experience and less on worrying about people who would never buy their product in the first place, I think they'd see their sales go up. That doesn't mean they need to remove all forms of copy protection, rather, they should ensure that whatever they do to protect their intellectual property doesn't materially affect the user experience.
I agree with this, but if it requires Steam like DRM or SecuRom etc... then that affects the user experience.
Posted March 07, 2012
The thing is, people use Steam because of the user experience.
Posted March 07, 2012
Does it really affect the user experience? I don't know your connectivity stats, but even with the slightly ropey one I had up north it was pretty much unnoticed. Most people aren't noticing the DRM. Those who are, notice more what it's about, and what it could mean, rather than what it does. Except for Ubisoft of course, who require always on, then don't have the servers.
Posted March 07, 2012
bought Skyrim, hate the steam experience.
I don't like it having an open port to the web now that I've finished with Skyrim.
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PhoenixWright: The thing is, people use Steam because of the user experience.
Posted March 08, 2012
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PhoenixWright: The thing is, people use Steam because of the user experience.
Yes, give them a little friends list and achievements and suddenly they start liking DRM while before they didn't like it. A miracle to me.

Actually nobody knows if people really like the DRM part of Steam. I have to admit that also all my retail discs always worked, so my user experience was never materially affected by DRM.

I think he has a good point but it doesn't work for me. I hate DRM because of its existence.
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wpegg: ...Except for Ubisoft of course, who require always on, then don't have the servers.
Also such things can happen with Steam. I know of one guy who currently cannot play a Steam game because the client suddenly displayed the message that the game needs to be converted to a more efficient state, then started downloading 4GB but never finished. A re-install did not work until now although maybe cleaning everything should work.

Let's just say, usually most of the customers are not affected materially by any DRM, even Ubisoft as long as they have an internet connection nowadays.

So Brad simply says: DRM is acceptable as long as you don't see it.
Post edited March 08, 2012 by Trilarion
Posted March 08, 2012
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PhoenixWright: The thing is, people use Steam because of the user experience.
No, they don't. They use Steam because all of the current triple-A titles depend on it, because they've used the friends list functionality on it and because they have large numbers of Steam-only friends and now they're reluctant to start spreading their purchases around and want to keep their friends list in one place.

Not forgetting the achievement junkies out there, those too lazy to download patches, those that feel that driving 10 minutes down the road to buy a game is too much like hard work and those that feel waiting a day for a game to be delivered is an unacceptably long time.

I know very few people who actually praise the user experience of Steam.
Post edited March 08, 2012 by jamyskis
Posted March 08, 2012
"The Problem with Anti-piracy Schemes
By Stardock's CEO, Brad Wardell"

Stopped reading there.
Posted March 08, 2012
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PhoenixWright: The thing is, people use Steam because of the user experience.
Then again, other people avoid Steam because of the user experience.
Posted March 08, 2012
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PhoenixWright: The thing is, people use Steam because of the user experience.
In a lot of cases there isnt much choice when a game uses Steam DRM for activation or Steamworks :/. Opting out usually means no other options or way to get the game :/
Posted March 08, 2012
The Problem with Anti-piracy Schemes
By Stardock's CEO, Brad Wardell

I fully agree with that man.

And as this will go down into the inevetable Steam bashing, let me say this. Steam has enhanced my gaming experience. In many different ways. But many people here are more like "if it doesn't work for me, it is bad".

People who avoid Steam on princible can do that, but they have no right to complain. If you use Steam and run into problems because of Steam, that is something to complain about.

Steam was never targeted to combat piracy in the first place. Steam games are amongst the first and easiest pirated games. And valve never tryed any legal BS like CDP did.
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jamyskis: Not forgetting the achievement junkies out there, those too lazy to download patches, those that feel that driving 10 minutes down the road to buy a game is too much like hard work and those that feel waiting a day for a game to be delivered is an unacceptably long time.
Honestly? Bashing progress for progress sake? Real mature.
Post edited March 08, 2012 by SimonG
Posted March 08, 2012
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SimonG: And as this will go down into the inevetable Steam bashing, let me say this. Steam has enhanced my gaming experience. In many different ways. But many people here are more like "if it doesn't work for me, it is bad".

People who avoid Steam on princible can do that, but they have no right to complain. If you use Steam and run into problems because of Steam, that is something to complain about.
That's what you don't seem to get. You seem to assume that people who are complaining about Steam have never used it. Steam fanboys just can't get it into their head that plenty of people have problems with Steam all the time. For every person who says that it "enhances" their gaming experience, I can find five that say that it is unnecessary bloat and a problem.

I went to launch Skyrim yesterday. I have very few longer periods of free time at the moment and was looking forward to sitting down and playing it on PC for a couple of hours, because the PS3 was being used by my girlfriend.

I start the game - "This game is currently not available". After five tries I do the inevitable integrity check. Nothing wrong. I launch offline mode. Game won't start. Relaunch Steam in online mode...and it spontaneously decides to start re-downloading some random 1.5GB of the game. That's my Skyrim evening out the window, and not for the first time.

This is not a rare occurrence, not for me, nor for anyone else I know personally. It is negatively affecting the user experience.

But no - for Steam fanboys, if it works for them, everyone else who is having problems is just too plain fucking stupid to get it right.

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SimonG: Honestly? Bashing progress for progress sake? Real mature.
And if your response to my raising questions over whether Steam is really progress is for you to question my maturity, I think we're done here.
Posted March 08, 2012
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jamyskis: Not forgetting the achievement junkies out there, those too lazy to download patches, those that feel that driving 10 minutes down the road to buy a game is too much like hard work and those that feel waiting a day for a game to be delivered is an unacceptably long time.
Just like there are so many people buying a GOG here because they're too lazy to change 4 CDs constantly, ripping their CDs to play on a netbook, searching their old retail box somewhere in the attic, finding an old used copy on eBay without paying outrageous sum, or downloading patches and looking for compatibility fixes.

Preferring a convenience in accessing and/or playing your games is not bad in itself.

EDIT: And speaking as someone living in a 'third-world country', I wish I can drive 10 minutes down the road to get an original game with a reasonable price.
Post edited March 08, 2012 by Catshade
Posted March 08, 2012
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SimonG: And valve never tryed any legal BS like CDP did.
Somehow, I feel going after the pirates who are not customers at all, is preferable to banning legitime customers from all their Steam games for minor or no TOS offences. Your mileage apparently varies.
Post edited March 08, 2012 by timppu
Posted March 08, 2012
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PhoenixWright: The thing is, people use Steam because of the user experience.
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jamyskis: No, they don't. They use Steam because all of the current triple-A titles depend on it, because they've used the friends list functionality on it and because they have large numbers of Steam-only friends and now they're reluctant to start spreading their purchases around and want to keep their friends list in one place.

Not forgetting the achievement junkies out there, those too lazy to download patches, those that feel that driving 10 minutes down the road to buy a game is too much like hard work and those that feel waiting a day for a game to be delivered is an unacceptably long time.

I know very few people who actually praise the user experience of Steam.
I completely agree. If you dismiss everything that other people consider beneficial about Steam then it's a horrible service.
Posted March 08, 2012
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jamyskis: Not forgetting the achievement junkies out there, those too lazy to download patches, those that feel that driving 10 minutes down the road to buy a game is too much like hard work and those that feel waiting a day for a game to be delivered is an unacceptably long time.
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Catshade: Just like there are so many people buying a GOG here because they're too lazy to change 4 CDs constantly, ripping their CDs to play on a netbook, searching their old retail box somewhere in the attic, finding an old used copy on eBay without paying outrageous sum, or downloading patches and looking for compatibility fixes.

Preferring a convenience in accessing and/or playing your games is not bad in itself.

EDIT: And speaking as someone living in a 'third-world country', I wish I can drive 10 minutes down the road to get an original game with a reasonable price.
Agree totally!
The time I don't have to spend riding to the store, changing CDs, waiting to spin it up, entering CD-keys, storing CDs, I can totally use to play games ;-)
Like music, some people still buy vinyl or CDs, but a lot of others just buy the digital version. It's all about convenience.
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General discussion (archive)The Problem with Anti-piracy Schemes(28 posts)(28 posts)
(28 posts)