I see DRM talk and trash all the time on the interent. You can't goto a site that talks about games these days with out some thread about DRM popping up. Or boycotts of games cause of DRMs, Even GOGs slogan is DRM free.. (though I guess it gets a pass even though you have to log in, to access the games.. (how is that not drm as I have many games that are considered to have DRM.. (inputting a key, that doesn’t even need to be online which is DRM??)


What i find most interesting are those that say even one time activation is to much. Some how setting up an account or typing in a Key is intrusive. Yet at the same time, the same people set up an account and log in just to complain about having to set up an account and then log in to activate a game.

The other part that i find even more confusing, are those that say, well if it has DRM i'll just steal it, cause i'm not really stealing cause i never 'actually stole something as it is so called intangible. So cause you cannot see it, some how that makes it ok, or it is technically NOT stealing.

How soo? I cannot see electricity, Or satellite tv, Or cellular waves, Yet if i Take any of those items with out paying, it is a federal crime. games cost money to produce just like it takes money to produce power., so when you steal code to play that game, you are physically stealing.. Just because you cannot see it, doesn't mean it does not exist. . the game code psychically exists on your hard drive does it not? So how is this not stealing?

And believe it or not, there is something that is even more confusing to me.. You never hear any complaints about DRM in online games. Isn’t that the biggest DRM around? Having to log into a server just to play a game? On top of that they typically cost way more money than any offline game. Yet they are some of the most popular games around.


the saddest part is people don’t really understand how much it hurts everyone.. It takes money away from future production, which can be seen as hurting every single person that is a fan of that game. When games don’t make money, they don’t have a future, and that means how many games, and how much content was not produced just because of theft? That also means less jobs, which in turn hurts the economy which effects everyone.. People that should have had jobs don't because a game lost out on 10 million dollars due to stolen code. Or those that did not get jobs or keep the ones they had, are now not spending money at the local stores, or tipping that local waitress. So instead of your local waitress getting getting 2 bucks for a tip she gets 50 cents cause the person is broke, and the ripple effect continues...


The worst is the rationalization. The ones that say well the game isn’t worth it, or I hate drm so I will steal it cause the company deserves it for making me log in, or what ever drm that company chooses. Or even better the game is over priced, but for some reason you can not wait for the price to come down. Maybe the game was not worth 50 bucks.. or is buggy at launch. But with more funding that could happen less. If game companies knew that they would have 10 million extra dollars cause no one stole their product, they might beable to spend a few more bucks or take a bigger risk and higher more developers, which would lead to a more complete, or bug free game. Even those that wait a few years for the price to drop in the end helps the future of that title, or perhaps gives money for future projects..


I guess what I’m saying is.. Please stop saying pirating games doesn’t hurt anyone, cause it is not really stealing.. when in fact it It is physical theft (if it wasn't you couldn't play the game), and it Hurts everyone…. From average joe gamer, to communities, to companies, and everyone in between…

The problem with these forms of DRM is that many companies (I'm looking at you EA) have had a tendency of taking down their servers, thus rendering games unplayable. I've heard a lot of complains about games that don't let you set up your own servers.
In any case, a "DRM" like this is often viewed as something that gives something back, unlike most other forms of DRM.

Some people will just use "it has DRM" as an excuse to pirate games, but those people would pirate games anyway, it is just a way for them to justify it to others. The general consensus here seem to be "don't buy it" rather than "pirate it", in case you don't agree with the company's methods of enforcing ownership of the product.

You really know nothing about the topic at all. So rather than write a sodding essay you should instead be asking questions you need answers to before forming opinions on the matter.

Has anyone really tried to use that logic? I think you're getting confused.

The argument isn't that it's intangible, it's that for something to be stealing someone has to be deprived of something.
If you steal some food from a supermarket, not only have to deprived the owner of the money they could have made by selling it, but you've deprived them of stock to sell.

If you pirate a game, you haven't magically made a copy disappear from a store shelf. In fact, the infinite duplicability of games is the reason digital distribution is so damn profitable.

Also the rest of your argument is not really worth taking seriously. There's so much you obviously don't understand.

Pirating isn't stealing, it's pirating.

Edit: And DRM is also illegal. If you own a game, in 120 or so years that game will become free to the public. So, if by some miracle, you pass on a copy of your game disc to your great-grandchild, the DRM will illegally restrict them from freely accessing the content.

Oh and you only give waitresses tips in the US. In Europe they actually make a decent wage.

I'm not a pirate, I don't steal games. I hate DRM, and don't think they should be in any game. DRM does not stop piracy. Most games are already easily illegaly downloaded by the day they come out, no matter the DRM . DRM is a joke it stop the used game sale market, and to increase the profits of game companies. It is not there to stop piracy, only to stop honest customers from having the ability to sell games they no longer want. You can pretty much sell anything you own to someone else, so why is it okay to put DRM on games that don't allow you to resell them? It's a joke, and letting the game companies do it without opposition is unwise.

I have watched over the years as DRM has become more and more oppressive. Today, more and more games now demand always online internet. Soon there will come a time, where most if not all the game files are located at a remote site and we will be "renting" them and not truly owning them.

This site is mostly dedicated to Old games, the people who come to this site, in large part, do so because they love old games and still play them to this day. I still have many old Cd-roms even floppy games that I like to play sometimes. They work fine still, and there DRM is nonexistant (save a cd-key or disc-check, which doesn't bother me much). What about these new games though, with their new and less customer friendly DRM? What happens when I want to play them 10 years from now 20? Good luck, would be my guess.

Sorry, if I lost my way in this message, but, after reading most of your long post, my head is fatigued. I have read post similar to yours many times. When is everyone going to realize that DRM does not stop piracy? Sure one day they can create a DRM that might, maybe, who knows, but I bet that DRM will strip more customer rights away. When does it become no longer acceptable to punish the many honest people, because of a small percentage of dishonest ones? But, like I already said: Today, DRM is not about stoping piracy, it is only about profit and maximizing it at the cost of paying customers. DRM is a joke my friend, a sick lie to help companies obtain more of the pie.

http://dontdrinkbeer.files.wordpress.com/2011/12/1595201-oh_look_its_this_thread_again_super.jpg

also, tl;dr :P

and obviously, you missed the entire point of my post... Pirating is stealing, and Does hurt others..... DRM is just some failed attempt at logic of why it is ok..

but good job missing the entire point...


Copying is stealing... If you do it with out permission.. it doesn't mater if you believe it or not...

Copying is copying. If you steal it and copy it then it's stealing.

Funny you should bring that up. It looks like DRM might soon be illegal in Canada because (in many of its common forms) it fits the CRTC's new definition of spyware.

Now, now, don't be nasty. You should always tip unless the service was unsatisfactory (or just completely medicore, which counts as unsatisfactory).
The English aren't great tippers, but you should see France, for example. While I was studying there during my year abroad, a friend of mine made 4-5x as much from tips while working evening shifts in a pub than she did from her regular salary.

You apparently missed my post with a perfectly clear explanation as to the difference between stealing and copyright infringement.

I'll give you that, but in the US, if you are a waitress you make $3/hour (the minimum wage is $7). So while here it is a compliment to your good service, in the US it is all your going to get.

Edit: I looked it up and each state sets it's own wage for tipped employees, with half the minimum wage being the average and no state paying full minimum wage.

We all know that pirating software isn't doing any good, but until we find a cost-efficient and moral (ethical, PR wise, goodwill enhancing, whatever) way of combating it, you might as well cry out loud for all the good that does.

But I'm not missing the point at all. I didn't even state my own opinions on the matter. For all you know I might agree with the general sentiment of what you're saying, but feel that your ignorance and soap-boxing is detrimental to my position as it makes for some very easy straw men for those who oppose my views.

Much like how ignorant teenage loudmouth atheists piss me off more than the preachy brimstone and hellfire brigade.

I don't feel like deconstructing your argument point by point (although tempting, that would be time consuming), but I will point out that in no way is piracy a criminal matter unless you're profiting from it. For instance, Megaupload profited from piracy so it became a criminal matter in their case.

Also you'll note that GOG's 'DRM' doesn't actually affect the games or their installers at all. They promise DRM-free games. Not accounts. Nobody would want one of those.