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Crosmando: Is putting it together yourself completely out of the question? You will save a lot of money doing it yourself and it's very easy, modern cases don't even use screws so you don't even need to use a screwdriver, you just slot it in, and the parts themselves come with instructions. The pre-built shops are going to put 20-30% on-top of the cost of the parts themselves put for doing something that takes them less than a hour.

I'd suggest you start here: http://4changboard.wikia.com/wiki/Falcon_Guide
And then buy according to your budget.
Th-they don't use screws anymore? H-how can I make it short-circuit anymore then?
(If they got rid of screws, good riddance. Those things were a system killer for me in the past)
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KneeTheCap: Th-they don't use screws anymore? H-how can I make it short-circuit anymore then?
(If they got rid of screws, good riddance. Those things were a system killer for me in the past)
Plastic clamps and switches. Imagine a long piece of plastic with bolts at the ends. The bolts fit into the holes of the devices like screws do. In the middle of the plastic piece is a knob, which you can turn to fasten it in the case (the case and the knob work together like a lock - there's probably a proper English word for that, but I'm neither a technician nor a native speaker. ;) )
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Leroux: (...)
Thanks to everyone who's willing to share some advice! :)
Maybe this thread of the ComputerBase.de - forum could help you.
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Leroux: I can't check at the moment, but from memory it's a duo-core 2.1GHz with 4 GB RAM, 250GB harddisk, and it used to have a GeForce 7300 LE, now it runs with onboard graphics. So pretty low standards. ;)
Now I know why I mostly remember you talking about point&click adventures. ;)

Joking aside, pretty much anything that you can buy today will be an improvement. No joke, I think it would be really difficult to find new hardware that would not improve your performance considerably. ;)

Given that you are content with lower peak performance, plan to keep the machine for longer, and ask about prices ... hmmm ...

I'd check whether you can save money by going with an i3 CPU. Most games are not CPU-limited, and even for those that are, the i3 does a pretty efficient job. You could perhaps save a bit of money with the graphics card as well, but I have little experience in the respective segment of the market. And I'd recommend quality brands if you want to keep the machine for long, especially wrt the PSU.

On the other hand, _if_ you want to keep a machine for very long, then it might also make sense to go the i5 / 660 GTX route, since that would pretty much guarantee that you won't have any problems playing anything that was ever targeted at one of the current consoles (which includes most popular AAA games).
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Leroux: On a German forum, for example, someone suggested that a user instead of buying the Hyrican PC I linked to above could get something like this for more or less the same price:
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Psyringe: That's a formidable machine as well. I'm not too fond of ASRock motherboards though (they are one of the cheapest brands on the market, and the ASRock board that I once had never worked really well, but others like them). And I think the PSU needs more power for this hardware. Don't skimp on the PSU, especially not if you're planning on keeping the same machine for many years.

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Leroux: Yeah, I should probably add that I'm perfectly happy playing games in lower resolutions like 1024*768 or so most of the time. I really don't have that high demands, I guess I wouldn't even know what I'm missing by not playing on the highest resolutions with all the special effects turned on, as long as the game still looks good enough to me. My current problem is mostly that lots of games already lag in the menus, because I don't have any kind of decent Shader support. Rather than playing everything maxed out, my priority would be just the games running smoothly while still looking nice, and that I don't run into the same issues I have now too soon again (like games not working at all or only with the settings so low that they're a pain to look at; e.g. Trine in 640x400 :D). So maybe these rigs are quite a luxury already compared to my actual needs?
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Psyringe: If that's your goal, then you can probably achieve that with a much cheaper machine. An i3 CPU would be sufficient, and you could downgrade the graphics card as well, though I can't tell by how much - I have little experience with cards below the nVidia 560. I _can_ tell that the 560 is already more than enough for what you have in mind, you wouldn't even need a 560 Ti.

What is your current hardware? (So that we can get a grasp of what you're used to.)

I wouldn't go below 8 GB RAM with a 64-bit operating system, but given your target performance, I'd say you could definitely go with a weaker/cheaper machine than the ones you posted.

Edit: If you value longevity higher than peak performance, then you're probably better served by buying high quality brands with lower actual performance. And you should probably tell that at other forums as well where you ask the same question, because you'd then have unusual preferences. Which is absolutely no problem, but people will usually suggest systems targeted for different goals when you ask them about advice.

Edit 2: One other thing that I keep forget mentioning is noise. Modern graphics cards can be pretty loud even if if advertised as "silent". If performance isn't the penultimate goal, then you have the option of getting a low-noise PC; might be worth a consideration. I know that this is important for me since my PC stands right next to a bed in which two people sleep at odd and varying times, but that's probably an unusual scenario as well. ;)
A little OT, but...

I think this is the kind of thing you pay for when you get a pre-built PC - guys that know what each brand & model and how things work together. Guys that know that "Video cards from y don't work too well with motherboard x with this chipset generation..." and "spend a little less on x and put it towards better quality y" stuff. That's sometimes worth the premium, not just plugging parts together.

I remember building a PC years ago, trawling forums and blogs trying to figure out exactly which motherboard to get... it was extremely time-consuming and confusing.
Now that I think of it Leroux - you have managed to wait quite long already, wouldn't you mind lasting another year or so? Just saying, because in a year, next-gen consoles will be out and you will be able to get a PC based on their spects, pretty much ensuring that anything in the following 4 - 5 years will run relatively well. Just don't buy a weaker PC than that mentioned in the OP - saving money now is nice, but it'll get outdated that much faster.
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Fenixp: Now that I think of it Leroux - you have managed to wait quite long already, wouldn't you mind lasting another year or so? Just saying, because in a year, next-gen consoles will be out and you will be able to get a PC based on their spects, pretty much ensuring that anything in the following 4 - 5 years will run relatively well. Just don't buy a weaker PC than that mentioned in the OP - saving money now is nice, but it'll get outdated that much faster.
Only if you plan on playing bad console ports for the next 4-5 years.
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Crosmando: Only if you plan on playing bad console ports for the next 4-5 years.
No, if he plans to play vast majority of videogames which will come out for the next 4-5 years, including, but not only, console ports. I thought you have apologized for all the trolling the other day, guess it doesn't mean much - back to the ignore list you go then.
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Fenixp: No, if he plans to play vast majority of videogames which will come out for the next 4-5 years, including, but not only, console ports. I thought you have apologized for all the trolling the other day, guess it doesn't mean much - back to the ignore list you go then.
Ignore list? You run a browser script specifically to block users you don't like on the internet? Kinda brings a new meaning to the word butthurt.
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Crosmando: Ignore list? You run a browser script specifically to block users you don't like on the internet? Kinda brings a new meaning to the word butthurt.
As shocking as that is, you can ignore people without a script :-P (Just by the way. I genuinely thought it was rather nice. Oh well.)
Post edited September 08, 2013 by Fenixp
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Fenixp: As shocking as that is, you can ignore people without a script :-P (Just by the way. I genuinely thought it was rather nice. Oh well.)
How am I trolling exactly? I can guarantee you the vast majority of games next 4-5 years will be either multi-platform or MMO's. And the ones that aren't will be indie games which won't need much computing power.
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Fenixp: Now that I think of it Leroux - you have managed to wait quite long already, wouldn't you mind lasting another year or so?
I guess so, provided it's worth waiting for that. It's not like I wouldn't have any less demanding games or modules to play in the meantime, quite the opposite actually. And in general my PC is still running fine, so buying a new one just for "modern" gaming is a luxury in any case.


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Crosmando: I can guarantee you the vast majority of games next 4-5 years will be either multi-platform or MMO's. And the ones that aren't will be indie games which won't need much computing power.
If a majority of games will be MMO's, I won't have that many problems, as I'm not interested in them at all. ;)

Anyway, Fenixp and Crosmando, feel free to discuss or ignore each other, but please don't get into a fight here, as I appreciate both of your help and opinions. Thanks! :)
So, I'm tending towards just getting the Hyrican PC from the OP, since I don't want to build one myself and ordering a comparable custom-build from hardware stores seems to be more expensive even (more or less the same price as the PC in the OP, but without Windows; so all in all I'd have to pay 100 euros more for more or less the same thing).

Only, I read a comment by a user who bought this PC and it didn't sound so good. They write that they like the PC because it's solidly manufactured and fast and already set up for a quick start, but the only thing they don't like is that there's a process called "interrupts" or something that sometimes pushes the CPU load up to 100%, and that it's annoying when the PC just pauses / stutters / lags one to three times for a moment.

It's the only comment I've found on the net, and I have no clue what this user did, if that's a general problem of this set-up or connected to something else and if it's relevant for anyone else, but then again, I'd hate to spend this much money for a PC that doesn't run smoothly. Is this enough to worry? Could that mean that the mainboard is rubbish? Or should I just ignore it?
Post edited September 13, 2013 by Leroux
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Leroux: So, I'm tending towards just getting the Hyrican PC from the OP, since I don't want to build one myself and ordering a comparable custom-build from hardware stores seems to be more expensive even (more or less the same price as the PC in the OP, but without Windows; so all in all I'd have to pay 100 euros more for more or less the same thing).

Only, I read a comment by a user who bought this PC and it didn't sound so good. They write that they like the PC because it's solidly manufactured and fast and already set up for a quick start, but the only thing they don't like is that there's a process called "interrupts" or something that sometimes pushes the CPU load up to 100%, and that it's annoying when the PC just pauses / stutters / lags one to three times for a moment.

It's the only comment I've found on the net, and I have no clue what this user did, if that's a general problem of this set-up or connected to something else and if it's relevant for anyone else, but then again, I'd hate to spend this much money for a PC that doesn't run smoothly. Is this enough to worry? Could that mean that the mainboard is rubbish? Or should I just ignore it?
I would say yes, if other reviews are positive ignore it and move on. In terms of meeting your stated needs it looks like a good system (average performance) for a current generation system and should have some longevity for you moving forward.

Not sure about the motherboard being poor quality though as the post doesn't indicate what it is using and even on the site, the details page for the system don't identify the motherboard being used.

I would stay away from the second system you listed where the motherboard is questionable and the power supply, as one of the other contributors on this thread indicated, is a little lower in a system to be used for gaming and not sure about the quality of it, as in my experience power supplies can be one of the major failure points.

The graphics card can run most things for sure, buying an off the shelf system myself some years ago the two things I replaced (as in planned on replacing as they didn't meet what I wanted) were the Power Supply and the Graphics Card.

There are so many graphics cards coming out though I think you would have to work in the hardware industry to stay current with them, such that I've found a site like videocardbenchmarks to really help. The section I'd recommend for value systems rather than performance systems is - http://www.videocardbenchmark.net/gpu_value.html. The GTX 660 is in the top 10 for the value cards so it's a good one to have (value in this site being defined as performance vs price, not just price as in many sites). The listing for the system doesn't tell you which manufacturer would be using the chipset or how much ram would be on the card 1GB is good currently, though some higher end more expensive cards have 2GB or more now; but, in most cases it shouldn't matter.
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BlueKronos: I would say yes, if other reviews are positive ignore it and move on.
The problem is, there are no other reviews to be found anywhere on the net, neither positive nor negative. ;)

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BlueKronos: Not sure about the motherboard being poor quality though as the post doesn't indicate what it is using and even on the site, the details page for the system don't identify the motherboard being used.
Which is kind of suspicious and might suggest that this is where they saved some money ... (The motherboard includes USB 3.0, but I have no clue if that's any indication of its quality.) Maybe I could try asking the seller about it, but I doubt they will be able to tell me.