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General discussion (archive)Games with Keys?(76 posts)(76 posts)
(76 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted May 26, 2012
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spinefarm: They are there maybe cause many of those games that have it are mainly single player games. Or they are very old that they can't remove it.
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vrmlbasic: They said that there's only one key given out per GOG account. That makes me think that GOG endorses this wonky DRM. They'll give out the single player version of a game, a game which is all about single player, with no restrictions, but they'll put the kibosh on the included coop mode? I just can't see the logic in it. It's like they'll give us complete freedom with 95% of the game, but then go all totalitarian regime on us with the last 5%.

I mean, I'd buy another copy of the game to do try out this coop mode. I wouldn't be smiling, but I'd do it. GOG doesn't provide for this, which seems like an oversight. I don't see how the key system is not DRM, but it's still better than Steam's DRM so I'd go for it. I could try and make another account, but I don't know if GOG has anything in place to try and stop that. I could have my friend create a GOG account for this, but GOG is supposed to save us from that Steam-like foolishness.

This whole encounter has made me skeptical of GOG. I guess this has been going on for a while now, but playing most all of my games from here in SP I guess I didn't notice.
Some games you just can't remove it ... it is too implemented in the game. Yes it is a form of DRM,but yet you can have your full time expirience with the singleplayer game :)
Posted May 26, 2012
CD-Keys are not DRM. They've also been around forever, why is it so surprising?
Posted May 26, 2012
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spinefarm: They are there maybe cause many of those games that have it are mainly single player games. Or they are very old that they can't remove it.
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vrmlbasic: They said that there's only one key given out per GOG account. That makes me think that GOG endorses this wonky DRM. They'll give out the single player version of a game, a game which is all about single player, with no restrictions, but they'll put the kibosh on the included coop mode? I just can't see the logic in it. It's like they'll give us complete freedom with 95% of the game, but then go all totalitarian regime on us with the last 5%.

I mean, I'd buy another copy of the game to do try out this coop mode. I wouldn't be smiling, but I'd do it. GOG doesn't provide for this, which seems like an oversight. I don't see how the key system is not DRM, but it's still better than Steam's DRM so I'd go for it. I could try and make another account, but I don't know if GOG has anything in place to try and stop that. I could have my friend create a GOG account for this, but GOG is supposed to save us from that Steam-like foolishness.

This whole encounter has made me skeptical of GOG. I guess this has been going on for a while now, but playing most all of my games from here in SP I guess I didn't notice.
They keys are there so that you can play online multiplayer. They can't remove that from the version you buy because the server is the one that does the validation. Removing it from the client would just mean that you couldn't play online.

That's one of the reasons why publishers love online gaming, it gives them an excuse to require a unique ID for people using the game.
Posted May 26, 2012
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vrmlbasic: They said that there's only one key given out per GOG account. That makes me think that GOG endorses this wonky DRM. They'll give out the single player version of a game, a game which is all about single player, with no restrictions, but they'll put the kibosh on the included coop mode? I just can't see the logic in it. It's like they'll give us complete freedom with 95% of the game, but then go all totalitarian regime on us with the last 5%.

I mean, I'd buy another copy of the game to do try out this coop mode. I wouldn't be smiling, but I'd do it. GOG doesn't provide for this, which seems like an oversight. I don't see how the key system is not DRM, but it's still better than Steam's DRM so I'd go for it. I could try and make another account, but I don't know if GOG has anything in place to try and stop that. I could have my friend create a GOG account for this, but GOG is supposed to save us from that Steam-like foolishness.

This whole encounter has made me skeptical of GOG. I guess this has been going on for a while now, but playing most all of my games from here in SP I guess I didn't notice.
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spinefarm: Some games you just can't remove it ... it is too implemented in the game. Yes it is a form of DRM,but yet you can have your full time expirience with the singleplayer game :)
I could, but not now that I know that the game has unattainable coop play. They're tantalizing me now. I could have 2 single player experiences running simultaneously on my 2 PCs, but yet they can't combine? Fail.
CD-Keys are not DRM. They've also been around forever, why is it so surprising?
As spinefarm also said, these keys ARE DRM. In this case, they're just pointless and illogical DRM. With a smattering of irony, but I suppose I'll find via searching that this has already been said (though it is worth saying again, and again).
They keys are there so that you can play online multiplayer. They can't remove that from the version you buy because the server is the one that does the validation. Removing it from the client would just mean that you couldn't play online.
I have no interest in playing online. I want to play this game on 2 computers that are sitting right next to each other. Nothing more. I'd understand a key for online play. It would go against what GOG set out to do, but to link to what Fuzzyfireball said, that time-honored system has been around "forever".

Another time-honored system that has been around "forever" is the idea of unrestricted LAN play. This game effectively has NO LAN play as GOG has no setup for providing it.

I don't see the current situation as tenable. This key setup was not advertised on the main page for the game, so I bought it without knowing this, and GOG has no way provided for me to purchase a second key. They barely have a way provided for obtaining the first key, if I hadn't searched the forums in shocked desperation I wouldn't have known the less-than-apparent method for contacting them.
Posted May 26, 2012
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adambiser: The gogwiki has a category for these games, but I'm not sure how complete it is.

[url=http://www.gogwiki.com/wiki/Category:Games_with_multiplayer_keys]http://www.gogwiki.com/wiki/Category:Games_with_multiplayer_keys[/url]
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spinefarm: It is missing the recent releases ... at least I don't see Heroes 5
I don't think any of us 'Wiki regulars' have a copy of Heroes 5.

If you know that a game requires a key and it's not in that list, please go to the game's article and add \{\{MultiplayerKey\}\} (without the backslashes, GOG didn't like the curly brackets thing) at the very top. That will add a message to the page and it to the category list.

Remember that the Wiki is a collaborative effort. It is never "missing" something, the information just hasn't been added yet. If you know something that's not on the Wiki, then put it there.
Post edited May 26, 2012 by TheJoe
Posted May 26, 2012
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spinefarm: It is missing the recent releases ... at least I don't see Heroes 5
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TheJoe: I don't think any of us 'Wiki regulars' have a copy of Heroes 5.

If you know that a game requires a key and it's not in that list, please go to the game's article and add \{\{MultiplayerKey\}\} (without the backslashes, GOG didn't like the curly brackets thing) at the very top. That will add a message to the page and it to the category list.

Remember that the Wiki is a collaborative effort. It is never "missing" something, the information just hasn't been added yet. If you know something that's not on the Wiki, then put it there.
Will have a look for something else missing and will add it ;)
Posted May 26, 2012
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vrmlbasic: It says that it is a-ok to play 2 separate instances of a single player game on 2 separate computers,
Who said that was ok? o.0

Pretty sure GOG says please don't do this. They're ok with you installing it on multiple computers in your house, but I'm pretty sure they're not cool with both those copies being played by different people at the same time.
Post edited May 26, 2012 by SirPrimalform
Posted May 26, 2012
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vrmlbasic: I don't see how the key system is not DRM, but it's still better than Steam's DRM so I'd go for it. I could try and make another account, but I don't know if GOG has anything in place to try and stop that.
The key isn't DRM, actually. It's used by the games to differentiate between two different clients. It's how the game knows who's giving what commands via network. While it's possible to architect a game in a different fashion than this (and, indeed, many older games do use a different system for it), it is how the games that require serial keys work, and short of getting access to the source code and rewriting the entire way the multiplayer code functions, there's no addressing this.

As for why we don't give you more than one key, well, technically you shouldn't be playing co-op with a friend if you only have one license for the game anyway. Of course, we don't use DRM so we can't exactly enforce this, but the general analogy we use is "treat your download like a CD". If you loaned the CD to your friend to play, you wouldn't be able to play it until he gave it back. Treating GOG.com downloads the same way seems fair to us, so that you can still share your games with your friends--but only if you're not using them while you do.

EDIT: NInja'ed by Sir PrimalForm. :: shakes fist ::
Post edited May 26, 2012 by TheEnigmaticT
Posted May 26, 2012
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SirPrimalform: Pretty sure GOG says please don't do this.
I'm quite sure the only thing the explicitly ask us not to do is install copies on friends computers. On the other hand, you're right, the only thing they explicitly tell us is a-okay, is installing on every single computer you own. They don't say anything whatsoever about playing multiplayer with others on your own computers.

EDIT: Meh, apparently not, see T just above me.
Post edited May 26, 2012 by Miaghstir
Posted May 26, 2012
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vrmlbasic: I could, but not now that I know that the game has unattainable coop play. They're tantalizing me now. I could have 2 single player experiences running simultaneously on my 2 PCs, but yet they can't combine? Fail.
You need two licenses of the game for co-op play. That's how it works.

You seem to think that "DRM-free" means "give the game to your friends".
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TheEnigmaticT: EDIT: NInja'ed by Sir PrimalForm. :: shakes fist ::
Mbwahahahahahahahahahaha!
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Miaghstir: EDIT: Meh, apparently not, see T just above me.
Also mbwahahahahahahahahahaha.
Post edited May 26, 2012 by SirPrimalform
Posted May 26, 2012
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SirPrimalform: You seem to think that "DRM-free" means "give the game to your friends".
I interpret it to mean "I trust that you don't, but won't stop you, so please don't do it, okay?".
Post edited May 26, 2012 by Miaghstir
Posted May 26, 2012
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gameon: But if its a friend in your house via Lan, then surely thats ok. As it does say in the GOG terms and conditions that a game may be installed on any number of pcs in your own household...
I would say that's for convenience though, not for the purposes of running two copies at the same time...
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SirPrimalform: You seem to think that "DRM-free" means "give the game to your friends".
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Miaghstir: I interpret it to mean "I trust that you don't, but won't stop you, so please don't do it, okay?".
Yeah, that's a better way of putting it. Just because it doesn't stop you from giving it to all your friends, it doesn't mean that it's allowed.
Post edited May 26, 2012 by SirPrimalform
Posted May 26, 2012
To my knowledge, LAN gaming with a single copy usually involved cracks.
Posted May 26, 2012
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TheEnigmaticT: As for why we don't give you more than one key, well, technically you shouldn't be playing co-op with a friend if you only have one license for the game anyway
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gameon: But if its a friend in your house via Lan, then surely thats ok. As it does say in the GOG terms and conditions that a game may be installed on any number of pcs in your own household...
In our T&C, you are correct. But if you ever read any of the EULA's for any game you download ever, you'll see you're actually purchasing a single-use license. If you install the game on eleven computers that you own, that's fine, as long as you're the one playing it. After all, a game installed on eleven computers doesn't matter, since you can only physically play one computer at a time.

Okay, it's probably possible to play more than one computer at once, but it's hardly practical.
Posted May 26, 2012
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gameon: I see, so its a bit of a grey area. For the record i dont usually play multiplayer games anyway. I'll abide by any rules given.
It's not really a gray area unless you manage to clone yourself. Only one person should be using one particular software license at any given time.
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This is my favourite topic
Community
General discussion (archive)Games with Keys?(76 posts)(76 posts)
(76 posts)