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I don't get it...
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Fenixp: So, they're using Steam, SecuRom AND GFWL DRM? Wow, that's ... What DO they have instead of brains, really?
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sheepdragon: Heh, imagine what it was like when I bought GTA IV on Steam... SecuRom, Steam, GFWL and Rockstar Social Club. A horrendous visage of regurgitated DRM code splattered like the wet intestines blown out through a codemonkey's ear.

Love the metaphors :D
Well, that makes it an easy decision for me: pass on BioShock2. I was locked out of my BioShock 1 game for a couple months because I changed video cards and added a hard drive (this was before they upped the install limit). That was my introduction to DRM. Never again will I deal with bullshit DRM like that.
I'll be skipping it.
I'd hope enough people would avoid it to send them a message, but I'd only be deluding myself.
Every time a company treats paying customers with such little respect, I get more angry. You can imagine I'm quite angry by now, but thankfully it can be reduced by enjoying some drm-free goodness...
There's only a few ways they'll get me to buy games like this:
- if it's dirt cheap ($5 or so)
- if they guarantee the DRM gets patched out in the near future.
- if a crack is available that does not cripple part of the game (i.e. like multi player in Spore's case)
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Andy_Panthro: I'll be skipping it.
I'd hope enough people would avoid it to send them a message, but I'd only be deluding myself.
Every time a company treats paying customers with such little respect, I get more angry. You can imagine I'm quite angry by now, but thankfully it can be reduced by enjoying some drm-free goodness...

That's a good attitude to have. I was annoyed earlier, but the publishers don't want my money so the game isn't worth it; and as you say there are a lot of other riches to enjoy.
I won't be skipping it, and I have a good reason.
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Andy_Panthro: I'll be skipping it.
I'd hope enough people would avoid it to send them a message, but I'd only be deluding myself.
Every time a company treats paying customers with such little respect, I get more angry. You can imagine I'm quite angry by now, but thankfully it can be reduced by enjoying some drm-free goodness...

I used to have this attitude, but it changed drastically. When I tried to introduce GOG to others, most (but fortunately not all) told me. "I don't need that crap. I can get it for free on Bittorrent (or whatever)." Each time I'm told this, I feel like that we kinda deserved that DRM (or at the very least, that the publisher fears are more and more justified).
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POLE7645: I used to have this attitude, but it changed drastically. When I tried to introduce GOG to others, most (but fortunately not all) told me. "I don't need that crap. I can get it for free on Bittorrent (or whatever)." Each time I'm told this, I feel like that we kinda deserved that DRM (or at the very least, that the publisher fears are more and more justified).

The problem arises that even with such restrictive DRM measures, games like Bioshock 2 will be pirated. What's more, the pirated copies will allow you to install them without an internet connection and will also allow you to install as many times as you like. The pirate in some ways gets a superior product...
Until gamers stop buying games with DRM it will only get worse. When a company cannot state what they are doing and change their statements, they seem to be hiding something from their users (i.e. paying customers).
If gamers did not buy the game you would see the DRM gone in a matter of days (if not hours).
Personally, I would say, let it rot and walk away until companies lean that selling to gamers is their livelihood.
Post edited January 25, 2010 by Faithful
One thought struck me...as a business, 2K seems to care little about the community of gamers it established 2 years ago with Bioshock - it doesn't really matter. Our generation of gamers are always replaced by younger generations who are less knowledgeable about what they're buying into. By the time they kick up a fuss they've already bought the game, so financially their opinion really won't matter.
Until DRM becomes more imprinted into PC gamers' consciousnesses, companies like 2K seem to be willing to make a bet that there will always be a majority of uninformed new gamers who will buy their product.
Think that's what I'm trying to say.
I'm somewhat interested in Bioshock 2. I'd be more interested in it, if Irrational Games Boston was developing this.
But, really - Bioshock 2 looks a lot more of the same and I don't think the MP will be anything special. I could be wrong here, but I just have this bad feeling.
Plus, the way Bioshock 1 ended, regardless of each ending - do we really need another in a destroyed Rapture? It felt pretty complete, by the end. If we're gonna see another Bioshock, I'd like to see Rapture in its full glory w/ people when people were around (when the problems starting creeping up w/ Fontaine and whomever else) OR the next Bioshock 1 take place above water (given the Evil Ending of Bioshock 1).
I was already planning NOT to buy this upon release at full price in the first place, but the DRM made it even more so a NO WAY. When it gets mad cheaper and/or the DRM is loosened-up, maybe I'll bite..
Post edited January 25, 2010 by MysterD
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Faithful: Until gamers stop buying games with DRM it will only get worse. When a company cannot state what they are doing and change their statements, they seem to be hiding something from their users (i.e. paying customers).
If gamers did not buy the game you would see the DRM gone in a matter of days (if not hours).
Personally, I would say, let it rot and walk away until companies lean that selling to gamers is their livelihood.

Yeah but didn't Spore get pirated a ton and lost huge sales? It didn't seem to do much.
I'm just renting Bioshock 2. Honestly, the only thing I liked about the first one was the storyline. The gameplay was pretty much Condemned with magic. It was really tedious just dying and running back to that spot and repeating that over and over again. I played on hard so your mileage may differ.
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Faithful: Until gamers stop buying games with DRM it will only get worse. When a company cannot state what they are doing and change their statements, they seem to be hiding something from their users (i.e. paying customers).
If gamers did not buy the game you would see the DRM gone in a matter of days (if not hours).
Personally, I would say, let it rot and walk away until companies lean that selling to gamers is their livelihood.
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phrequencyviii: Yeah but didn't Spore get pirated a ton and lost huge sales? It didn't seem to do much.
I'm just renting Bioshock 2. Honestly, the only thing I liked about the first one was the storyline. The gameplay was pretty much Condemned with magic. It was really tedious just dying and running back to that spot and repeating that over and over again. I played on hard so your mileage may differ.

Spore also just finished in the top ten retail sales for the year for the second year in a row. Therefore, there isn't a lot of incentive for the DRM to be changed due to lost sales.
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Crassmaster: Spore also just finished in the top ten retail sales for the year for the second year in a row. Therefore, there isn't a lot of incentive for the DRM to be changed due to lost sales.

Really? I just remember reading it tanked on release, or did that even qualify as tanked...lol.
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phrequencyviii: Really? I just remember reading it tanked on release, or did that even qualify as tanked...lol.

You must be confusing the gaming community's reaction to it ("meh"), as sales were strong.