Posted May 25, 2016
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omega64
Something good
Registered: Apr 2012
From Netherlands
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ET3D
Always a noob
Registered: Oct 2008
From Clipperton Island
Posted May 25, 2016
If I lose my job sooner than I think it's probably because I'm browsing at work way more than I should.
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timppu
Favorite race: Formula__One
Registered: Jun 2011
From Finland
Posted May 25, 2016
It would be interesting to see if the Chinese would still be just as happy as today, if their economy plummeted to the pre-WTO times (2003 or so).
Post edited May 25, 2016 by timppu
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LEMON CURRY?
Møøse operator
Registered: Jun 2013
From Denmark
Posted May 25, 2016
Don't worry, the robots are going to want slaves and by then you won't have any need for money.
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KiNgBrAdLeY7
Слава России! ура́
Registered: Apr 2012
From Other
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Nirth
GFN / VR / Switch!
Registered: Oct 2010
From Other
Posted May 25, 2016
Judging by what I read regarding the Chinese-American different situation, they won't. Money is about security but losing what you are used to is much more annoying than how enjoyable it is to acquire it. Compare the ecstasy of a lottery winner realizes from one second to the next he or she is now a millionaire to a very successful stock broker making a mistake, losing so much he gets fired and having to foreclose his house and other properties he has acquired over the years.
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LEMON CURRY?
Møøse operator
Registered: Jun 2013
From Denmark
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ScotchMonkey
60.27% Through!
Registered: Apr 2012
From Denmark
Posted May 25, 2016
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http://thebestpageintheuniverse.net/c.cgi?u=self_checkout_lanes_blow
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I see robot force a bit like slavery (without the moral dilemmas to the objects): were the countries like ancient Rome or south USA doing worse because there was cheap labor who did lots of work for very little money? If it was so bad for them, why did they use slaves?
Let's pretend for a second that all work that we humans do today could be performed by robots and computers, including medical doctors, building houses, creating games etc. etc. etc. Would that be good or bad news to us humans? At least we would have lots of free time to pursue whatever we want in life.
^ WBGhiro basically said the same with less words.
EDIT: Pondering a bit more, there's of course the question of natural resources, so yeah maybe the problem would be that countries with lots of natural resources (oil, metals etc.) would be even more powerful compared to other countries, than what they are today (as the resource-poor countries can't compete with more competent workforce). Dunno...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z7FcJwg6OkA
Post edited May 25, 2016 by ScotchMonkey
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HereForTheBeer
Positive Patty
Registered: Oct 2009
From United States
Posted May 25, 2016
The more machinery, the greater the need for people to service them. And those jobs can pay well.
Spent most of this spring installing a complicated automated production machine, supposed to bump up productivity. It's so complicated it's still not working very well after four months of dinking around. When it is humming along, it's so fast that it takes 3 people to run it. But I think they'd be better off with three smaller, identical machines to do the same job with less automation, and still using one operator on each. Simpler to maintain, redundancy, cheaper to purchase, and leaves more room in the process for the flexibility that human workers provide.
There's a middle ground, a sweet spot if you will, that combines the best of both. Humans can be costly, and can create problems with consistency of quality. Machines don't have the on-the-fly flexibility, and when a critical machine breaks it can have ripple effects along the entire production process.
Human workers are great when you get people who care about the job. Automation is great when designed correctly for the required tasks. Going too far toward automation can create more problems than it's worth, and relying too much on human labor can increase costs to the point of being uncompetitive.
Automation machinery is where I make my bread and butter, but I tell customers not to go too crazy with it, especially if they don't have the technical background to understand, maintain, and repair the equipment.
Edit for autocorrect
Spent most of this spring installing a complicated automated production machine, supposed to bump up productivity. It's so complicated it's still not working very well after four months of dinking around. When it is humming along, it's so fast that it takes 3 people to run it. But I think they'd be better off with three smaller, identical machines to do the same job with less automation, and still using one operator on each. Simpler to maintain, redundancy, cheaper to purchase, and leaves more room in the process for the flexibility that human workers provide.
There's a middle ground, a sweet spot if you will, that combines the best of both. Humans can be costly, and can create problems with consistency of quality. Machines don't have the on-the-fly flexibility, and when a critical machine breaks it can have ripple effects along the entire production process.
Human workers are great when you get people who care about the job. Automation is great when designed correctly for the required tasks. Going too far toward automation can create more problems than it's worth, and relying too much on human labor can increase costs to the point of being uncompetitive.
Automation machinery is where I make my bread and butter, but I tell customers not to go too crazy with it, especially if they don't have the technical background to understand, maintain, and repair the equipment.
Edit for autocorrect
Post edited May 25, 2016 by HereForTheBeer
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Alaric.us
Slava Ukraini
Registered: Feb 2010
From United States
Posted May 25, 2016
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And I'm actually surprised by your bad experience with automation. I've been using ATMs and automated checkout lanes at supermarkets for many years now, and so far have not had a single instance of a mistake having been made. People, on the other hand, screw up all the time. I wish I had a dollar for every time a bank teller or a grocery store cashier messed up somehow.
Add to that a HUGE amount of automation we all use when we do just about anything over the web (banking, purchasing, etc.) and it would seem to me that machines are overwhelmingly better than humans when doing their job. Which is why I prefer to deal with them. Do you really miss the phone operators? The only need the machines don't fulfill is the need to socialize, but let's be honest, I don't go to a store to socialize with cashiers. I have people in my life who I actually want to hang out with.
One last thing. Buy stocks in the companies providing the automation. You'll be able to retire on those in a few decades. Remember, you heard it here first! =)
P.S. — On the topic of fast food, since that stuff is not really food, it's perfectly fine and even appropriate that it be made by machines. Flipping a burger or removing a basket of fries from an oil vat is something that should have been automated a LONG time ago. Now real chefs will not be replaced by machines anytime soon. So food will be cooked by humans and non-food will be cooked by robots. Just as it should be.
Post edited May 25, 2016 by Alaric.us
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mechmouse
gog n' cogs
Registered: Mar 2013
From United Kingdom
Posted May 25, 2016
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Previous waves of automation have always been accompanied by emerging markets to take the displaced work force.
I fear this current wave may be more than traditional economics can handle.
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tfishell
Remorse: The List, if you like FPS psych horror
Registered: Oct 2010
From United States
Posted May 25, 2016
Forced sterilization for all so that there's less humanity to need jobs! :D
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Alaric.us
Slava Ukraini
Registered: Feb 2010
From United States
Posted May 25, 2016
low rated
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Previous waves of automation have always been accompanied by emerging markets to take the displaced work force.
I fear this current wave may be more than traditional economics can handle.
Industries appear and disappear all the time. The ice-cutters (and a gigantic shipping industry) disappeared with the invention of the refrigerator. They didn't all get jobs in the fridge-making companies, but there was no disaster. The phone operators got phases out very quickly by automated relays, and they didn't all get jobs at relay-producing companies, yet there was no disaster. This happens all the time.
Now, what WILL hurt people is the minimum wage laws. If I need someone to vacuum the floors in my building, I am content with paying them $7 per hour. I will hire them. However, if I'm not allowed to hired them for anything less than $15 per hour, I'm not gonna break the law. I just won't hire them. Instead I'll buy a fleet of Roombas. The law designed to protect people just put them out of a job.
Post edited May 25, 2016 by Alaric.us
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mechmouse
gog n' cogs
Registered: Mar 2013
From United Kingdom
Posted May 25, 2016
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Previous waves of automation have always been accompanied by emerging markets to take the displaced work force.
I fear this current wave may be more than traditional economics can handle.
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Industries appear and disappear all the time. The ice-cutters (and a gigantic shipping industry) disappeared with the invention of the refrigerator. They didn't all get jobs in the fridge-making companies, but there was no disaster. The phone operators got phases out very quickly by automated relays, and they didn't all get jobs at relay-producing companies, yet there was no disaster. This happens all the time.
Now, what WILL hurt people is the minimum wage laws. If I need someone to vacuum the floors in my building, I am content with paying them $7 per hour. I will hire them. However, if I'm not allowed to hired them for anything less than $15 per hour, I'm not gonna break the law. I just won't hire them. Instead I'll buy a fleet of Roombas. The law designed to protect people just put them out of a job.
Historically its been the service industries that have take the influx of jobless, since machines could not do those jobs. However now, not only is skilled labour now automated but also various levels of an already saturated service industry.
The next growth market in creative and content production, but there is a limit to the number of people that can sustain and a much higher level of skill to enter.
I agree with you on the outcome of minimum wage increase, but counter with this.
$7 an hour is, for most, an unlivable wage. Minimum wage jobs are rarely full time, and often come with conditions that the amount time "working" is not equal to the hours paid (think unpaid travel time, time quoted jobs that take longer than job card and other such tricks). Unless you are fortunate to live in a country like the UK where the state supplements your income to ensure you have enough to live on, then you are subject to constant poverty.
Hence my belief that traditional economic may not be able to adapt to this new level of automation.
Its also worth noting during the automation boost in the 1970's, people believed that 3-4 day working weeks would become the norm due to reduction in man hours needed. It turned out that those at the top of the companies saw grater profit in reducing the number of people, rather than keep the same number of people and reducing their hours.
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OldOldGamer
It's me!
Registered: Sep 2009
From United Kingdom
Posted May 25, 2016
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http://www.dw.com/en/adidas-to-sell-robot-made-shoes-in-germany/a-19280669
It just followed the recent news of Wendy's in USA replacing their cashiers by touch-screen kiosks due to rising wages:
http://www.fox32chicago.com/money/142139984-story
And naturally in Belgium, I already saw how fast this kind of thing can go as a lot of train stations were closed down to be replaced by a single touch-screen kiosk within two years.
So if you're a student or have a job which don't necessarly require human input, it's time to foresee the upcoming wave of robotization and train yourself in other areas if needed.
An idiot CEO with some idiots managers is enough to close a very successful company and leave hundreds of family stranded.