It seems that you're using an outdated browser. Some things may not work as they should (or don't work at all).
We suggest you upgrade newer and better browser like: Chrome, Firefox, Internet Explorer or Opera

×
EDIT: There is lots of noise in the thread, so I'll remove mine. My first post is all I have to say!
Post edited June 05, 2016 by onarliog
avatar
mistermumbles: So, I've gained a considerable amount of weight

Now I'm actually facing to have to do real exercise should I want to lose some of those pounds.
I simply want to be in a bit better shape.
Like erpy was pointing out, weight loss is about creating a calorie deficit. 3500 calories is one pound. They say bullshit like "a cookie is 100 calories you have to burn off!" but the reality of it is that as long as that cookie is within your maintenance calorie weight, it's fine.

You need to find how much calories you need to keep your weight, subtract the amount you want to lose each week (-500 calories a day probably), keep your metabolism up by eating 5x or more across the day with lots of water, and include extra calories depending on what physical activities you'll be doing. You can't cut 1,000 calories as an obese person and then start weight lifting + cardio and expect results. Calories are fuel, you are the car, and you can't go 100 miles on half a tank. So you need to track your eating and your activity to come up with how many you need exactly. You can consult a professional for more exact figures and advice.

And that's it. You're not going to have any trouble finding exercises to do and you're not going to really benefit from "targeting my upper body to get rid of my moobs", you'll benefit more from full body plans that will keep your skin tight as you lose the weight. That's just how our physics/(physiques) work so don't neglect the other parts for your chest/biceps. The lower back is actually more important to maintain when your obesity has been straining it for a while. Consider yoga, ddp yoga, etc. for that type of stuff. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-x8EZrm3Nik
EDIT: There is lots of noise in the thread, so I'll remove mine. My first post is all I have to say!
Post edited June 05, 2016 by onarliog
avatar
onarliog: Sorry, but I don't agree with this. There is absolutely no reputable scientific evidence to the statement that "quality of food affects weight gain/loss". A bunch of hypotheses, yes, but nothing proven. The state of the art accepts that "calories in = calories out" and you are at maintenance. Shift the equation and you change weight. This, including the seemingly magic number -500 calories, has also finally been accepted and recommended by the American Heart Association. Finally some diet guidance with solid scientific backing. There is also some stunts performed by academics to this end, see the twinkie diet, but it's just for fun, not a scientific point, so don't hold that against me.
Of course there are: (1) (2)

avatar
onarliog: The composition does affect the rate of muscle synthesis and fat burn, to some degree. But it is meaningless in the grand scheme of things. Especially if you are not competing in powerlifting or olympic lifting, but just training for general strength gains and aesthetics.
Blood sugar levels, insulin levels, cardiac and endocrine reaction to different food?

There is some reasonable impact, but it tends to be less if person is in form and active training. Those tend not to suffer from overeating syndrome, caused primary by intoxicated slow-moving blood.

That said, if you consume your daily requirement in calories as a "pure sugar", you'll get diabetes. Consume it as "salad, cooked meat and brown bread" - and you are fine.

avatar
onarliog: I do have some professional credentials to maybe make my words more convincing, but that's no fun, I'll instead say that living on pizza, ice cream, and whiskey (I have the best collection of the rarest stuff in town, but no likeminded friends to share with :( ), I have maintained 5-8% body fat all my life. Of course there was also smart, no-nonsense well-planned workouts.
Reminds me of something...

avatar
onarliog: Also check your facts on brown rice, it is a modern day health-craze gimmick, as it is nearly identical to white rice, and worse in some aspects too.
Its not identical, the refined rice and non-refined brown rice are very different. But on the scale of things, unless rice makes the majority of diet on the daily plate, its negligible. It was used in example to contrast white refined rice, so it stands. I don't eat rice en masse, so rice does not play big role for me.
The gimmick would be ... differences between white and brown sugar. They are as close as super and super plus gas.
EDIT: There is lots of noise in the thread, so I'll remove mine. My first post is all I have to say!
Post edited June 05, 2016 by onarliog
avatar
mistermumbles: I started riding my bicycle to work, and, while that does seem to help some with its 9 mile stretch each day, it only really accomplished staving off me putting on any extra weight.
Let me guess: you are in your thirties.
;)
My only advice is always to eat less and form a habit of partitioning food. 6-7 years ago I had reached 95 kilograms (1.88 height) and it was feeling weird so I decided to go back to my normal 70s (that's how I was when I was very young). Today even if someone would put in front of me tons of delicious foods I would eat only as much as I need.
avatar
Fairfox: Come to the US and LEARN THE RULEZ. And tip, dammit.
Nope.
avatar
mistermumbles: Mainly I'm looking for upper body exercises - my legs are in fairly good shape to due all that bike-riding
Ha! That's what they all claim! "I don't have to do any leg exercises because I walk every day blaa blaa blaa...". It is just laziness, and because ladies don't look at your legs!

Sorry I haven't yet read other replies, but if losing weight (fat) is the main target, your eating habits are much much MUCH more important than physical exercise, even though the latter can help there too. So halve your current portions and eat more vegetables, skip desserts. Oh and no alcohol except when you get married or in funerals.

Do aerobic exercise (you can even start by simply stop using lifts, walk the stairs from now on every day! That's what I've done. Ok and you suggested you ride a bicycle already...), and for strength training, do big exercises that affect big parts of your body. No arm curls or such, those are for ladies. Do:

- pull-ups
- push-ups
- bench presses (uses partly the same muscles as push-ups, but push-ups are also e.g. for abdominals)
- squats
- deadlift
- crunches
- maybe still something for your inner abdominals like merely squeezing your navel towards your spine and keeping it there for 30-60 seconds at a time while you are standing; push-ups also help with these somewhat as long as you squeeze and keep your whole body rigid when doing the push-ups.
- maybe some additional free weight training for your shoulders if you want to impress ladies with them, but these have no other purpose. Or alternative use some shoulder-padded jackets, like Michael Jackson.
Post edited June 05, 2016 by timppu
To loose weight, begin with food. Cut for at least 1 month straight, SUGAR, SALT, anything made of FLOUR and most importantly, red-meat and animal-source fat. No sweet things unless they are natural (honey for example), avoid deep frozen and fried foods, strictly no junk food, eat fruit and vegetables, ideally when you can, raw. Lower progressively your quantity of food intake too, but not to the point of "starvation". 3 meals per day is good.

For workout, doing sets of abs, the reverse thing with backside and the full set of "Swedish gymnastics", especially the muscle stretches and joint rotations, will do. No less than half an hour daily. You can also go get athletic gear especially designed for upper body, hands and arms training, but i don't know the name of those organs in English. The metal rod from which you hang over by your hands and are on air is an excellent tool, too; when i was at the gym, my shihan ordered punches to stomach while someone was hanging and doing repeats. The ultimate exercise for upper body, though, is SWIMMING. get those arms moving, son!

Have a nice workout!
Post edited June 05, 2016 by KiNgBrAdLeY7
BTW guys, I would really appreciate any form of feedback on the guide I wrote.

Thanks and have a good weekend :)
avatar
onarliog: GI is not a "scientific study", it is a number. The question is "Do low-GI foods help with weight loss?". The scientific answer is "NO". See reference [23] in the first article you linked for a study explaining exactly this.
It is a scientifically backed up study.

" Raatz, Susan K., et al. "Reduced glycemic index and glycemic load diets do not increase the effects of energy restriction on weight loss and insulin sensitivity in obese men and women." The Journal of Nutrition 135.10 (2005): 2387-2391."
>>"Obese subjects (n = 29) were randomly assigned to 1 of 3 diets providing 3138 kJ less than estimated energy needs: high glycemic index (HGI), low glycemic index (LGI), or high fat (HF)."
Which means, they were locked to the diets and were not allowed to consume more if they desired. Thus this study is not realistic, because in reality the quickly absorbed spoon of sugar causes quick hunger that makes to grab something else to eat; where a plate of soup of the equivalent in calories will not cause any such effect because insulin wave will be very shallow and will overlap/synchronous with the time nutrients enter blood vessels.

avatar
onarliog: We are talking about weight loss and gain. You seem to be associating blood sugar levels with weight gain/loss, which is unrelated.
Of course they are related! High GI foods cause insulin shock, which:
a) rises appetite and easily makes one take more
b) causes additional absorption (calories) in digestion system if high GI food is consumed first
c) may easily cause diabetes if repeated, because of insulin wave effect

avatar
onarliog: Please read my previous post on spiking blood sugar. That's what a GI discussion is good for. GI or blood sugar level has nothing to do with weight gain or loss. High GI food will get you hungry faster, yes. But it will not get you fatter. Eat 1000 calories of sugar a day, you'll be hungry, and you'll be losing weight.(1) Eat 1000 calories of proteins(2), you'll not be as hungry, and you'll lose weight. Caloric deficit is the name of the game.
(1) You will not make it, because you'll end up in clinic:
Dinicolantonio, J. J.; O'Keefe, J. H.; Lucan, S. C. (2015). "Added fructose: A principal driver of type 2 diabetes mellitus and its consequences". Mayo Clinic Proceedings 90 (3): 372–81. doi:10.1016/j.mayocp.2014.12.019. PMID 25639270.

(2) I strongly oppose protein diet, because for prolonged run it will cause very dangerous health condition (protein poisoning)!

avatar
onarliog: Caloric deficit is the name of the game.
Caloric deficit AND absence of high glycemic food AND cardio+muscle mass building exercises is the name of the game.
Caloric reduction alone brings you no where as it will trigger body into conserving energy, with increased weight(!) and low motivation as outcome.

avatar
onarliog: And different food doesn't "burn different". They digest slower or faster, which affect blood sugar levels, and the feeling of hunger.
"It does not burn different. It burns different."
The effects stretch far outside of "feeling of hunger", the whole endocrine system goes crazy. The effect is very similar to artificial sweeteners (except for allergic reactions to sweeteners chemicals), it causes a variety of problems - because body expects food, but food is already consumed.

avatar
onarliog: Plus high GI food also has other advantages. Especially for a post-workout meal. That's why you'll see athletes eat spoonfuls of dextrose after resistance training. But that's a different discussion.

On diabetes: If you have a medical condition, this whole discussion should be ignored, that's something completely different. This is for healthy individuals, and I'm not a medical doctor.
Yes, its different discussion, because that is done to compensate for low sugar level after training, which is only relevant for individuals in top form. ;)

avatar
onarliog: BTW. GI is only meaningful when the food in question is eaten in isolation, and on a completely empty stomach, which never happens in practice. For instance, you eat rice with other food, and there will be other stuff you had during the day already in your system, which completely changes the speed of digestion. That's why GI is highly disputed for practical use.

I don't know what else to say, if I still couldn't make my point, then shame on me :) Anyway, I'll be away for a few days, so this is the end of the discussion for me. Cheers.
Of course this happens in practice! Basically - a regular menu in fast food: a burger with fries and coke! Or eating a salad and drinking just one beer afterwards already spoils (boosts) the dietary value. Its not disputed, its very well known... Its like pumping a truck with super plus gasoline. Of course you can ignore all that, if you work out like crazy and your endocrine system (engine) survives. ;)
avatar
Lin545: Snap
Oh crap, I removed my comments without noticing your last minute post, but since you inlined the relevant parts I guess it doesn't hurt the conversation much. Sorry about that. Anyway, like I said, I'm backing out now, cheers!
avatar
onarliog: Oh crap, I removed my comments without noticing your last minute post, but since you inlined the relevant parts I guess it doesn't hurt the conversation much. Sorry about that. Anyway, like I said, I'm backing out now, cheers!
It was just a discussion, thank you for your input. I was not trying to win an argument with you, just showing what I know. I agree that top priorities should be exercise and calorie balance, just getting slower digestion food gets one nowhere. If your method works for you, than its correct one. Cheers!
Post edited June 06, 2016 by Lin545
When I was in the army, my soldiers were 20-24 year group so i cant give proper advice without knowing your age. Every age era has different training type for a soldier. However, I can tell you what you should avoid.

1. Always drink water "while" doing your exercise. Not after, not before, during.
2. Avoid all kinds of heavy lifting exercises. You dont want to turn your fat into muscle, you DONT want to build muscle. Doing heavy body building exercises will return as more fat (hence becoming fat) in the long run. My rule is use half weight of whatever you can do a set. (A set is 7 of the same action). Forexample I can do a set on benchpress with 80 Kgs so I do my usual training with 40.
3. Never, ever keep doing exercise until you are too tired. Biggest mistake of people who start training is that they tire their body in the first day. This causes Lactic acid fermentation which kills or deforms the cells in the long run. That basically means cells start LAF if they cant receive enough oxygen to produce energy. Oxygen reserves are very limited in a person who does not have an active life but it grows stronger with practice. Also it is thought that this makes you get older faster which is why fast living animals in nature lives much shorter. Ofcourse that is still in theory but one that i support greatly.

So whatever you do, do it EVERYDAY but in small and easy amounts. Dont eat sugar. You can eat as much meat as you want (ofcourse unless you are not a vegetarian) but stay away from sugar. No more doughnuts for breakfast. No cakes.

My experience is rusty since i have been actively doing this 15 years ago but i hope i can help.