Quite frankly, your logic is just faulty. Most people will agree with me that a rough level of quality can be determined. Arguing that many factors may be involved does not change this. Then how do people claim the games on GoG are higher quality than Steam? Maybe you think they are all full of it too. I believe that a judgement of "compares favorably to similar games" is a value which does not vary as wildly as you seem to believe.

mhh... Sorry, but:

-> Crap!
-> Good game!

Can't see the difference? Sorry to hear that :(

If GOG doesn't sell Hatred, they are supporting censorship whether that is their intention or not. Why? Because in real life, there are consequences to every action. A simple business decision could still support censorship. Those indie games that were denied, have nothing to do with censorship. I see no point in bringing them into this discussion. THIS IS ABOUT CENSORSHIP.

Can you see the future? No. So all you are doing is guessing. I highly doubt GOG won't be able to stay in business after selling a game like Hatred. Who will crusade against them? Last time I checked, the only "crusaders" with real power are the feminists and how will selling a game like Hatred, piss off the feminists? And just because you think $$$ is more important than everything else, doesn't make it so. Money is not everything. People need to stand up for what is right...not stand up for what makes them the most money. And it seems you forgot that by not selling Hatred, there will be a backlash too.

" It's why they have regional pricing now despite the backlash from it, because principles don't always pay the bills."
Yeah, principles don't always pay the bills. So what do you suggest? Every business and every person on this Earth should just flush all their principles down the toilet and become nothing but whores? What I like about GOG is they do not practice the fucked up shit other stores do(DRM, no refund policy etc). They sell DRM free games, they offer fair prices and they allow refunds. What separates GOG from the rest is the moral high ground they occupy. If GOG decides to become some whore out of greed or a cowardly whore out of fear of some crusade, then they are no different than any other store. This would make GOG look like those Christians who follow the bible on Sundays but live like the devil every other day. And if a store like Steam sells Hatred and GOG does not... How would that look?

There was also a Montreal shooting game, but the guy took it down. It was simplistic, but it worked.

Because the game is controversial, by refusing to sell it, they are making a statement against violent video games whether they like it or not. Imagine that feminists are working on a game. And it becomes controversial. How would feminists react if GOG doesn't sell the game because "It's not interesting enough" or because "It's too niche"? We all know, they would launch 100000 crusades against GOG(due to their past). When a game is controversial, it becomes more than a game...it becomes a symbol. It becomes banner. And at this point, you are either with it or against it... That's life. If you are big store like GOG, it's impossible to avoid politics.

Dammit, man! I seriously laughed out loud after reading your last two comments.

"It's more than just a game. It's a symbol... A banner... The Hatred."

Good stuff, keep up the good work!

I always thought the truth hurts. I guess it can make people laugh too. :)





Are the devs of Hatred open to suggestions? Because what they need to do is make the game more friendly to females by letting people also play as a female. This way, more people will be interested in the game and feminists will leave the game alone. I'm sure a lot of females would love to play such a game if they could create a customized female character. Females need to relieve stress as much as males do and a lot of women have a taste for violence too.

Mr monkeydelarge, you really want this game, we get it. But I think you are really getting carried away here. GOG has controversial games like Postal/2 and Harvester. They don't need to prove anything.

If I made a game "against leucemia" and got enough attention for it (Kickstarter, speeches at universities) and the game would be turned down by GOG for being pretty crappy it could also create an uproar and controversy with that army of supporters behind me. "GOG hinders the good cause!"

The same with your hypothetical SWJ game. It's either good (as a game) and then GOG would probably put it up, or it plainly sucks - then GOG has to choose between selling crap or facing the wrath of the self-entitled furies.

But Hatred doesn't even claim it's good for anything. It's not even a game yet. If it ever becomes a working game I would like GOG to have it, but in the end it's their own decision. Just like with my "all for the poor sick children"-game or the SWJ game.

I was going to respond earlier, but you've provided an excellent case study for me to talk about. Ride to Hell is, by all accounts, a shit game. It's buggy as all hell and the basic gameplay is awful, and it is also one of the more idiotic examples of sexual content being used poorly to the point of being sexist. Had the game been functional on a gameplay level, however, things would doubtlessly get very gray; some people might not have minded the sexist crap and found it entertaining, while others would have stayed away from it by sheer virtue of the writing. Here, we know nothing about the game beyond the base objective, the tone, and general content of the game, as well as the authorial intent for it to have no artistic meaning. Even if the gameplay is functional for what it is, that surrounding context is likely to enter into the evaluation for some people on the review board.

tl;dr:

Bad game: shitty controls and gameplay, offensive writing; clear example of poor quality

Good game: functional controls that enable core gameplay to work as intended, good writing; clear example of fairly good quality

Divisive game: functional controls and gameplay, offensive writing; evaluations of quality will vary wildly depending on whether one prioritizes the game's functionality or if the writing is so monumentally offensive that it makes the game not fell fun.

Between the good and the bad, general consensus may be reached, but in between there is an area where consensus is no so easily reached.


But that's not even touching on the larger problem of what adding the game to the catalog could mean for GOG as a business. Setting aside the fact that quality is nowhere as easy to come to a consensus on in all cases, adding the game would likely invite all sorts of publicity, some of which GOG might not want. GOG might face a backlash in the news and be forever branded 'that store that sells that sick game that everyone outraged over'; right or wrong, that sort of thing can have all kinds of unfortunate impacts on the brand name, and could impair the company's future business dealings. Furthermore, given how the devs have been comporting themselves with all the composure of a howler monkey flinging their poo through the bars, it would not surprise me if they made yet another comment that paints them in a crap light if GOG does accept the game (possibly about how they are proud about how GOG isn't bowing to 'political correctness' or some such nonsense) that GOG might get unjustly associated with to their detriment.

In short, GOG has more than enough reasons to go either way on whether or not to sell it here. If they deny it, the game will be available elsewhere, even if it is only on the dev's site. Trying to argue that a company exercising its freedom to decide whether or not to sell something is somehow infringing on your freedom is nonsensical, unless you are trying to argue that you have not merely a freedom to buy the game, but the freedom for GOG to provide it so that you can buy it from them; if that is the case, then I would like to point out that under that definition of 'freedom', I do not merely have the freedom to respond to posts demanding GOG not stock the game but that I in fact have the freedom to require that other people make such comments in order for me to respond to them.

No, it's not that I really want this game. Why are you accusing me of being a petty Narcissistic person? This is not about me. Most of the people in this thread, debating against me are petty and Narcissistic. Not me. I don't even think my weak laptop can run Hatred and I won't be able to buy a new laptop until some years from now. So that means, I probably won't be able to enjoy Hatred until 2 or 3 years from now. I'm starting to fall in love with Steam too so if GOG doesn't sell this game and Steam does, that is no problem for me. I just hate censorship and I fear if people don't take a stand with this game...we will be going down a dark road with thought police check points and worse... There are a lot people out there who hate freedom and if we give them an inch, they will take more and more.

I agree that Hatred could end up to be a bad game and then GOG doesn't want to sell it because they find it wrong to sell bad games to people but like I said, it has become more than a game at this point in time. There is no avoiding the politics in this case. The only way out for GOG is if the game is so broken on the technical side that GOG refuses to sell it because it's garbage. OR if Hatred's publisher is extremely unreasonable with GOG and both parties can't come to an agreement. Then the world will see, no statement being made against violent video games(aka supporting censorship). And you are wrong about Hatred. Hatred stands for freedom. It's a middle finger to political correctness. I don't understand why you failed to see this.

O_o I didn't follow this trainwreck of a conversation ('cause I have exactly zero interest in that thing), but way to make an argument. "Everyone who does not agree with me is an asshole". Doesn't really paint the rest of the post in a positive light. Just sayin'

Well it may try to be if it's ever finished. Postal 2 is "a middle finger to political correctness" and that's what I love about it and I'm glad it's here. Even GTA (any) is "a middle finger to political correctness" and those games made boatloads of money (and where blamed for violent behaviour of young people).

Hatred is surely an interesting project. I curious how it will turn out as a game. Maybe it becomes the "messiah of free speech". It's just crazy to get wound up like this just now.

Nope. It's purely hypothetical based on the condition that they choose not to.

I said "most" not "everyone". Yes, it makes a huge difference. I will assume you made this mistake due to not being a native English speaker and let this go.
Yes, Postal 2 is a middle finger to political correctness but Postal 2 came out around 12 years ago. It is time for another middle finger. And unlike Postal 2, Hatred doesn't try to sugar coat itself with jokes or anything like that. So it's the ultimate middle finger.

As much as I admire what they're aiming for in giving a big "Fuck You" to the fart-smelling San Francisco hipster generation, I'm still not interested in playing any FPS where I can't run as fast as Doom Guy with enough enemies onscreen to put Robotron to shame.