I haven't said that at all. I didn't state anywhere that you want to go after a "confirmed" Townie. And by the way that is impossible, since RW's list is supposed to have only scum or heavily suspected people in it, not "confirmed" Townies, so this clarification doesn't make any sense.

What I was talking about was that in #1237 and #1239 you seem to focus more on the disproving element which calls for mis-lynches (at least 2 of them, too) rather than actually going with the theory. I just don't like this. Especially since it can be used as an excuse afterwards.

JMich did a similar thing in the TOWN Arsonist game where he specifically voted with Yogsloth even though he said he believes that's will result in a mis-lynch just disprove his logic. Ironically Yog was scum back then, but JMich was also under his personal agenda (Arsonist Keeper or something like that).

well, I'm reasonably sure that from the wagons currently having more than one vote, the one on flubbucket has the best chance of hitting scum. That's my own thought process and if it turns out a mislynch and you want somebody responsible lynched tomorrow, you can go after me if you like. Of course I can't be sure flubs is scum, noone besides himself and (the rest of?) scum can be sure of that. But it's two weeks and 1200 posts into day one and this is who I'm going for with clean conscience. If I'm right or wrong helps put rwarehalls list into perspective but it's not the only reason I'm voting for flubbucket. it's because I don't want a mislynch and with flubs I am thinking the chance of avoiding one is highest.

Arsonist Fanboy ....IIRC

Your insults aside, what have you brought? You sit here and criticize...
I gave my reasons, you may buy them or not, whatever...but for you to dismiss them out of hand because "the Great HijacK" finds them faulty somehow...

Yes, my list is based differently than most. The result leaves a handful of players who have contributed nothing, like you HijacK.

I explained why I'm not on Drealmer's wagon, because I just don't believe that a new player, with a scum PM and the OP role example, would be the first to claim and come up with a role of Health & Safety Administrator. And while involved in some scuff-ups, I find the lack of knowledge and potentially scummy behavior to be generally consistent which a new player. That any bad vibes I feel are outweighed by the unlikelihood of that claim.

While I refuse to go into exactly why, I feel the larger list of players acted according to how they compared PM's. Especially the earliest ones to react.

As to the list, I feel its more a living list. It's certainly not set in stone. If those "confirmed" start taking scummy actions, it can be reassessed. The term "confirmed" is always a misnomer in these games anywhere. One always has to compare actions and make judgments. For now, those players apparently saw through the unfortunately verbose claim.

But, I'll say one last thing about Flub's wagon, the fact it has stalled so quickly is really making me believe we might be onto something. That its very possible that his scum buddies are dragging their feet hoping for a no-lynch. Especially with how people were throwing votes around willy-nilly earlier in the game. Funny how people can vote on thin air, but all of a sudden can't vote for an uncontributing lurker because he hasn't "done anything scummy".

Don't get me wrong. I'm joining that wagon if that mean s no-lynch. I was referring to the overall approach in the situation rather than that specific wagon. It's just something that I didn't like so I pointed it out. Small things are more often than not key when we don't have anything solid to go on. I'm still hoping for that last minute development we seem to get minutes before the deadline that makes the game interesting again :)


As much as I would like this to be true, don't get your hopes too high, since that seems to happen quite a lot lately. That or every single person who got a somewhat decent wagon so far is actually scum. That would be hilarious.

It's such a bizarre generational divide. I wonder what it is about the savvy veteran players that makes them all such fans of not playing? What is it that is so experienced and sophisticated that it's best manifested by not caring, not posting, not trying, not playing?

And why take such a firm pro-noplay stance that you permanently let players know that the only thing they have to do as Scum to win is to not play, because you won't vote lurkers on some kind of bass-ackwards principle?

My thoughts on lurkers can be found here. I possibly would soften the language a bit, but the basic thoughts are the same.

It was my opinion then; it is my opinion now; it will be my opinion forever.

It will be my holy mission forever to eradicate this line of thought - that not playing the game is just fine, welcomed, and means you are immune from lynch. Not playing sucks. It should be annihilated as a "valid" play style.

If this ends up being the case I will laugh so hard that it makes me do a crying laugh because I can't breath....

I am trying not to have a meltdown.

Do not be a dick. Do not be a dick.

Breathe deeply. Go to your happy place.

_____

Say, chaps, I don't suppose we might want to get together and at least attempt a consensus? We have about 4½ hours to go. Shall we give it a go?

Note I do say "chaps" as crewdroog has now silently abandoned the game in Day 1 for the 2nd time. She's 0-for-2 in that regard.

I've got an hour left before I go to work. At that point, no more contribution from me...
Personally, I'm not looking forward to starting Day 2 exactly as Day 1 ends, with no consensus and one less townie.
If you thought Day 1 dragged, just wait for Day 2 if we get no result...

Živý or naživu.

Oh which one was that? I'd like to check that game. :-p


My opinion is and always was that people shouldn't be voted just because they lurk but they should be shot and investigated (not both on same player). It is hard to form opinion on them through posting to amke lynch so power roles should sort them out.
So no free pass from me, but not fan of lynching them.

Then do change it. Question the lurkers, post questions to them, cross examine them, and force them to participate. If they don't, vote for them, and explain to others why they should vote for them as well.
But if your reasoning is "They don't post enough", do accept that other's reaction may be this.

See what you did there (again)?

Yes, it was a very early vote, but he did give a reason. I understand that you were not familiar with trentonlf's stance on the matter and the arguments it causes between him and yogsloth, but why not question him? I to make sure I don't get it wrong, and he elaborated/clarified in [url=https://www.gog.com/forum/general/forum_mafia_31_crisis_at_space_station_epsilon/post108]his reply.

Am I to assume that his explanation still wasn't good enough for you? Or did you perhaps miss the later posts on the matter? If the latter, would that have made any difference?



Do you consider the OP Role Example to be an example of a Town PM?



I almost missed this - you were stating your intention to not wait for the deadline to vote for me, while I took it as a reaffirmation of your initial position on the matter, hence why I asked you, and thought that you missed a "not". So yes, we are clear now, thanks.



Using a favourite method, no doubt, eh?



I'm not sure I follow:
- Shot? What do you mean?
- What purpose does posting serve in your opinion?



You mean like how you go about it?



OK, I think I'm all caught up. Have to run now, but will get on later before the deadline.

My sarcasm detector appears to be broken, apologies.

Is Alive subjektivní nebo je to neměnný stav bytí ??


So you'd be willing to "vig" me out of my misery??

Thank you old friend.

Yes, I should have questioned him directly instead of played with flavor hoping I'd provoke a response. He could have taken the opportunity to explain to me regardless of being prompted with a question, I know I would have wanted to do that if my actions were drawn into question. So, thank you for doing so. I didn't mean to make you assume my position. With his reply, I find it very likely to be BS. Yes, that may be his official stance and known for playing that way, but I feel like it's more likely that he is just using all of that as cover in this instance, lucky him being able to do so if he is an intruder, I would think. I know I could be wrong, but, to me, his play has seemed antagonistic and noncontributory from the beginning and because of that, he remains higher on my suspect list than most.
That's what I was thinking, without the sarcasm (which I see upon a refresh before posting that he has dodged the question rather non-deftly IMO. Half a mark + for JMich suspicion.)

So, JMich, why don't you do more question-posing, cross-examining, etc., like you suggest yogsloth to do? Why make a comment about your sarcasm detector instead of just address the issue presented to you by HSL?

I find the accumulation on flubbucket suspect and odd. I also think it could be a play by the intruders to really confuse things. If flubbucket is scum, I find it rather possible that the contention is staged and possibly 1 or 2 on the wagon are also scum. Yogsloth and mchack have increased suspicion in my eyes, but they were both rather low to begin with so it's nothing serious yet.

Trentonlf has stayed about even the entire day for me and might be my #2 candidate still. RWarehall is very hard to read, dedoporno's suspicion has gone down, Ix's down, HSL's down, HijacK I think is just frustrated but I can't be sure.

JMich seems fine for now though I'm curious if you still really think I'm most likely to be an intruder? And if so, is there anything I can do to try and alleviate your suspicion? I really suppose it's just a matter of time, or that you are scum and are trying to keep some heat on me for validation of a future attack. I do question why you haven't contributed more to the other goings-on D1 and seem to have mostly contributed when it comes to me, is it because you are sure I'm town but want to keep doubt in others so I remain a viable candidate? *rhetorical* I only keep it in mind as a slight possibility, as any aware player should do.

Crewdroog I wonder if/hope she is okay and that the absence isn't serious. If everything is fine with her I am thinking it is possible that everything going on now is to try and raise suspicion for a D2 lynch candidate besides crewdroog via the flip of N1 lynch after all that is going on here, making us lose focus and move her down the priority suspicion list.

Really, all tons of speculation going on, and, we'll see where we're at come tomorrow, I suppose.

Since my argument for Vitek has not garnered any more voters for him, I am fine with that and willing to move my vote to 1 of my next 3 possible candidates if I'm convinced enough/find it a viable enough choice and can feel okay about voting that way and the vote has any weight.

I understand how doing lists could possibly help scum with their tactics, but I also think it is healthy to discuss more openly who we find suspect, otherwise we're all playing in fear and I believe that gives the intruders more power than if we were more open with our thoughts.

I hope I make sense and got all my quoting right (not that there's much and I'm usually good at it.) I'm running low on energy here/cat kept waking me up and I didn't sleep well.