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AgentBirdnest: Pfft... a knee support can't hold a jar of peanut butter :-) (besides, I already use one)

I've bought "complete" or "deluxe" editions of games that come with DLC... Other than that, I only recall buying DLC twice...
One for Deus Ex: Human Revolution, which felt like a nice small expansion. It felt like about one-third the length of the base game, and for about one-third the price. Not bad.
And one for PAYDAY: The Heist. I had already put around 147 hours into the game, and the DLC gave me many more hours to add to that :-)
You'll catch me burning a jar of peanut butter before you catch me buying skins though ;-)
Sure it can, we can get some pouches attached. And does the support still not help? Is it worth getting it looked at by a doctor?

I can understand some DLC being worth it, but a lot these days seems like simple things that used to be included with the game. I guess as long as they are optional DLCs then it doesn't really matter, but some publishers seem to want to cut the game up and sell it as DLC, like Sega and the Total War series.

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Vnlr: Good afternoon everybody!

I've got an appointment with the psychiatrist today, I hope I can cut down on the mind-numbing pills dosage/day again :)

*Many huggs for everybody* And I finally managed to finish the damned choral part of the piece I was working on :D

Here's some happy Khachaturian for you all
Good afternoon! I hope your appointment goes okay and you are able to cut down on the medication.

And glad to hear you finally finished your choral piece. I hope it turned out as nice as you had hoped.

*return hugs*
The Americans have escaped! I can tell because the thread is so quiet.

Of course I've been sleeping in this cage the whole time, so I'm still here :p

*orders some pizza to attract fellow Americans back to the thread*

Good morning folks =)
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BillyMaysFan59: The Americans have escaped! I can tell because the thread is so quiet.

Of course I've been sleeping in this cage the whole time, so I'm still here :p

*orders some pizza to attract fellow Americans back to the thread*

Good morning folks =)
Not American but I would not say no to a slice of pizza :D
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ddickinson: Good day, everyone!

I hope you are all doing great today and are having a lovely day?

*morning hugs and silly waves*

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CarrionCrow: ...
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ddickinson: Awww. Would it have killed you to lie and pretend it was due to me having super powers. :-)

I was going to ask if that was the game I thought it was, but then I Googled it. I am not sure where I have seen it before, but it was the game I thought it was. Are you enjoying it at least, despite it's difficulty?

I wonder why Relic decided to change the format of DOW so much? Probably to cut corners by using the Company of Heroes engine. I know my brother did not like the upgrade feature for each character. He said it was nice at first, but they don't let you unlock enough points to earn all the upgrades, so you have to be careful what you choose. This is despite DOW 2 letting you continue to fight, you just don't get any more upgrade points. I don't like games like that. I prefer to be able to max the character, but that is just my preference.

I remember you telling me about the Terminators just smashing through things, and when I had a quick play on my brothers computer I noticed that myself. He said that the cover became pretty useless anyway, especially on the later games as you make your character stronger. It was a nice idea for WW2, but I don't think it works with 40K. He said a similar thing to you, that there was no real strategy or tactics involved, especially once your team was quite strong.

I was not a fan of Dark Crusade. I it looked nice, but the whole skirmish maps made to look like a single player campaign was horrible, and from what you tell me it got even worse in Soulstorm. I liked the end mission for each faction, where there was a bit of story and the enemy had a prebuilt base. It was more challenging and more like a regular RTS game.

My brother also told me about the cutscenes on Retribution, and how they were horrible short and often not really that good. Tyranids congratulating you? That sounds so silly. Why the hell would the Hive Mind care about you, you are nothing in the grand scheme of things (and by you I mean the player, not you personally :-)). I guess it's like you said, to praise the silly gamer. But it's not very fitting with the lore. But then neither is the way the Exterminatus was handled. From what I hear you are one one planet when it happens, yet you somehow have time to escape, and then you fight on another planet that had previously suffer an Exterminatus yet people are still there and have been for some time. That is not how an Exterminatus works, it's not just a simple ariel bombardment or cleansing, it renders the planet uninhabitable (generally permanently), and not just to humans but to all life, Xenos included. That is why it is an Exterminatus.

The strange thing is, I would still play them if they came to GOG. I would not pay full price for them (I have heard more than enough to make me think they are not worth the price), I would only get them on a good sale, but I would play them, just to experience it fully for myself

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Ixamyakxim: I've actually always wanted to give these games a shot. Now that the Warhammer "seal" is broken, I wonder if they'll end up here - you don't happen to recall their publisher do you?
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ddickinson: It would be nice to have them here, especially the first DOW game. It would be even better if it had widescreen support. My disc version does not. The only problem I really had with the very first game was the unit cap, but that can be easily modded to increase the limit. I was about to answer your question about the publisher but I see Crow beat me to it (thank you Crow).
Good afternoon. Hopefully you're continuing to feel better. =)

Well, I guess it depends on how you look at things.
You might not have a literal superpower, but I actually give enough of a crap about you that I responded when you mentioned me. ;)

I have issues with how some things are handled in Orcs Must Die (getting three skill trees but only being able to use one per mission, having to start from the very beginning if an enemy gets through, being on a timer but not getting to see the timer until the mission's complete so you sit there biting your nails hoping you didn't just run around spastically clicking your finger off only to not get a perfect score because you went over the time allotment,
not being able to hear the antagonist deliver exposition because they do so quietly and during gameplay so it's like they're mumbling at you), but overall it's still fun, and it's a nice change of pace from boring standard tower defense.

Your brother ran into the level cap, just like I did. I don't mind not being able to be the absolute master of every single thing, but them expecting a player to want to keep playing what amounts to skirmish levels in the sole hope of picking up loot when your character is already extremely powerful is a bit much to ask.

The ability to keep leveling, even if it's a small increase, is a very good motivator for players to keep putting time in when they'd otherwise quit doing so. Once you hit the level cap, that entire part of the experience is over.

The game could've been balanced for higher difficulty within a single game after you reach a certain level, but that would have taken more work, something it feels like they wanted to avoid as much as possible given how much they copy/pasted out from a preexisting game.

Dark Crusade could have been vastly improved if they'd put the time in to make each map special in its own way.
One of the best experiences is trying to clear out a huge encampment of orks without the ability to reinforce.
Even on normal mode, that level wiped me out more than once because you had to think to get through it.
But they didn't, so the levels definitely start to run together for the most part.

Yes, the cutscenes aren't great by any means. And yes, the escape from Exterminatus is a timed level wherein you're fighting enemies while running and dealing with bombardment that does light damage to your troops if you're caught in it.
Not even including what you're saying about it being a process that goes beyond simply using explosives, the whole thing is ridiculous. When you're on the planet, the artillery is light but it's destroying the planet, and when you're done, it shows a cutscene of some ship firing one massive round that destroys the entire planet's surface.
Why they wouldn't do that to begin with, I don't know.

And yes, the Tyranid thing is blisteringly stupid. I don't know all the lore by a long shot, but when they put it in the story that your Hive Lord is digested, reabsorbed back into the psychic bullshit monster template maker so it can be remade on another planet, you're not going to think that your character is a unique snowflake.

Ran across another problem that ended up being a dealbreaker for me.
The difficulty modes are all screwed up. Normal is way too easy, and hard turns into nothing but an exercise in skull-pounding frustration.
I could beat my head against that hard difficulty brick wall, but with a bad story and gameplay that was done better in other games, other entries in the series, what's the point?
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BillyMaysFan59: The Americans have escaped! I can tell because the thread is so quiet.

Of course I've been sleeping in this cage the whole time, so I'm still here :p

*orders some pizza to attract fellow Americans back to the thread*

Good morning folks =)
Hello, BMF!

It seem your pizza worked and attracted some more Americans. :-)

Is the day treating you well so far?


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CarrionCrow: ...
Good afternoon!

I am feeling a little better, not much, but a little. But I had a lovely start to the day, so generally I am in a happy mood today despite the pain and annoyances.

How are you today? I hope you are doing well?

In that case I will go for the superpower. That way I get to make myself a cute outfit. But it's very sweet that you cared enough to answer.

I am glad you are finding the game (Orcs Must Die) fun, despite it's shortcomings. It definitely does not sound like my kind of game, but at least it is trying something new with the whole tower defence genre.

My brother told me about the endless skirmish missions. He said he played a few thinking it would add to the story or actually matter, but soon realised it was there just for loot, and not very good loot at that. I think they should have let you keep levelling up, so that the extra missions were not just pointless loot missions. Is the level system and loot part of Company of Heroes as well?

I get the impression they wanted to do as little work as possible, so adding more balance for higher difficulty would be beyond them. It seems many games now just like to re-skin their engines and pretend they are new games. I have heard people say that about the new Star Wars battlefield game.

I was gifted the Space Marine game, and although I only played a few minutes of that so far, it did look interesting. I am not a big fan of the Ultramarines, but with any luck when I do get around to playing it the game will at least be better than DOW 2.

It seems the smaller explosives were done just for effect and to add the sense of dangers for the mission. As you said, if they had a planet busting bomb they would have just used it. The Inquisition are not the type of people to waste explosives just for show, especially when it would serve no purpose.

The Hive Lord, just like most of the Hive is expendable. There are more where they came from, so the idea that the Hive Mind would really care is a bit silly. Don't get me wrong, the Hive Lord is very important and the Hive Mind would not want to lose one, but they would hardly get upset or feel the need to praise it to keep it happy. The Hive Lord lives to serve the Hive, so there is no need for human praise. There are quire a few problems with the lore on the games, but then they are only games I guess, they can't be expected to follow it, especially if that would require them to actually put some work into things. I heard that there maybe a Dawn of War 3 in the works. I wonder if that will continue the downwards spiral of the franchise?

I always think it's such a shame that 40K games are not better. Even if you are not really into it all, you can't deny that the lore is incredible, the amount of detail and back story is wonderful - that is what attracts so many people to it, despite how Games Workshop tries its best to destroy it all and drive customers away. It seems that the developers just wnat to make the same game over and over with a different skin. I would have preferred the original base building type DOW game over the squad action based DOW games that the second ones where.
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ddickinson: Good afternoon!

I am feeling a little better, not much, but a little. But I had a lovely start to the day, so generally I am in a happy mood today despite the pain and annoyances.

How are you today? I hope you are doing well?

In that case I will go for the superpower. That way I get to make myself a cute outfit. But it's very sweet that you cared enough to answer.

I am glad you are finding the game (Orcs Must Die) fun, despite it's shortcomings. It definitely does not sound like my kind of game, but at least it is trying something new with the whole tower defence genre.

My brother told me about the endless skirmish missions. He said he played a few thinking it would add to the story or actually matter, but soon realised it was there just for loot, and not very good loot at that. I think they should have let you keep levelling up, so that the extra missions were not just pointless loot missions. Is the level system and loot part of Company of Heroes as well?

I get the impression they wanted to do as little work as possible, so adding more balance for higher difficulty would be beyond them. It seems many games now just like to re-skin their engines and pretend they are new games. I have heard people say that about the new Star Wars battlefield game.

I was gifted the Space Marine game, and although I only played a few minutes of that so far, it did look interesting. I am not a big fan of the Ultramarines, but with any luck when I do get around to playing it the game will at least be better than DOW 2.

It seems the smaller explosives were done just for effect and to add the sense of dangers for the mission. As you said, if they had a planet busting bomb they would have just used it. The Inquisition are not the type of people to waste explosives just for show, especially when it would serve no purpose.

The Hive Lord, just like most of the Hive is expendable. There are more where they came from, so the idea that the Hive Mind would really care is a bit silly. Don't get me wrong, the Hive Lord is very important and the Hive Mind would not want to lose one, but they would hardly get upset or feel the need to praise it to keep it happy. The Hive Lord lives to serve the Hive, so there is no need for human praise. There are quire a few problems with the lore on the games, but then they are only games I guess, they can't be expected to follow it, especially if that would require them to actually put some work into things. I heard that there maybe a Dawn of War 3 in the works. I wonder if that will continue the downwards spiral of the franchise?

I always think it's such a shame that 40K games are not better. Even if you are not really into it all, you can't deny that the lore is incredible, the amount of detail and back story is wonderful - that is what attracts so many people to it, despite how Games Workshop tries its best to destroy it all and drive customers away. It seems that the developers just wnat to make the same game over and over with a different skin. I would have preferred the original base building type DOW game over the squad action based DOW games that the second ones where.
Glad to hear that, at least. Will continue hoping that your recovery is speedy. =)

Doing all right here. Had to go to the store to get dog food, and Walmart is not a place any sane person (or even semi-sane like myself) wants to be at 6 in the morning. But the animals are happy, so it works out.

Company of Heroes has an experience system for soldiers in that they get better the more they fight and survive, but there aren't any RPG elements or loot drops. It's a straight RTS.

I don't know what's happening as far as Dawn of War 3 goes. It's a well-known franchise, so I'd be surprised if Sega didn't capitalize on it.

Relic is known for two things - Dawn of War, and Company of Heroes. And since they're running Company of Heroes 2 into the ground with piles of garbage DLC, they've only got one thing left.

Will they improve things, try to get past the urge to use their old games as a quick and easy way to deal with the guts of the game? If they're smart they will, but I'm not getting my hopes up.
There's no way that will be a day-one rental. They pissed away that level of customer goodwill after fucking Soulstorm.

Would say the best shots a company has for 40K right now would either be a high quality RTS, or an in-depth RPG based around the Fantasy Flight pen and paper books, which allow for everything from space scoundrel unsavory trader types to inquisitors to actual Chaos soldiers.
Also, Games Workshop needs to get some pride back and stop giving out their license to every two-bit company with a design document. It's devaluing their brand, and they don't even seem to care.

Pretty much, the immediate future of Games Workshop-related titles will depend on Mordheim (which I'm hoping will be good when it's done), the new Blood Bowl that's coming out (also hoping that will be good) and the Warhammer Fantasy RTS that the Total War people are putting out (which I'm thinking will probably be bug-riddled on release).
Post edited July 23, 2015 by CarrionCrow
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ddickinson: Sure it can, we can get some pouches attached. And does the support still not help? Is it worth getting it looked at by a doctor?

I can understand some DLC being worth it, but a lot these days seems like simple things that used to be included with the game. I guess as long as they are optional DLCs then it doesn't really matter, but some publishers seem to want to cut the game up and sell it as DLC, like Sega and the Total War series.
I'm actually starting to miss the chainsword/bionic leg idea :-p
The support helps. I saw my doctor about it, she said I just need to take it easy for a while, try not to run too much (and when I do, run on dirt or grass), and get better shoes... Basically all the exact same stuff that my supervisor already told me, so seeing the doctor was a waste of $20 :-|

I hate when publishers cut the game and sell the missing pieces. DLC at launch is the worst. I want to politely burn the person's house to the ground who came up with that. I recall when Metro Last Light (the original, not the redux) was released, there was a huge controversy about "Ranger Mode" DLC. You had to pay just to unlock a difficulty mode that actually removed features from the game (like the HUD)... It looks like that is included with the redux version here.
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CarrionCrow: ...
I am glad to hear you are doing all right. I saw a documentary once about Walmart. It did not put the place or the unions that work there in a good light.

It makes sense that Sega will milk it to death, big publishers seem to do that with most franchises. I wonder if the next DOW game will be loaded with DLC like the Company of Heroes does. I don't think they will care about making it better, they know that enough people will buy it based on the name. Most big brands have fans that will follow it no matter how bad it gets. I think you are smart to not get it day one, if you get it at all.

That is another thing about the lore, there are so many possibility for games. You could make a game in almost any genre and it could be suited for 40K in some way. An adventure game playing an Inquisitor, a FPS as an Imperial Guard or a Space Marine, strategy games, space battle simulators, just about anything. But I think they will just keep making weak games and milking the franchise until it is dead. Then they will milk it some more just to make sure the corpse is good and dead.

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AgentBirdnest: I'm actually starting to miss the chainsword/bionic leg idea :-p
The support helps. I saw my doctor about it, she said I just need to take it easy for a while, try not to run too much (and when I do, run on dirt or grass), and get better shoes... Basically all the exact same stuff that my supervisor already told me, so seeing the doctor was a waste of $20 :-|

I hate when publishers cut the game and sell the missing pieces. DLC at launch is the worst. I want to politely burn the person's house to the ground who came up with that. I recall when Metro Last Light (the original, not the redux) was released, there was a huge controversy about "Ranger Mode" DLC. You had to pay just to unlock a difficulty mode that actually removed features from the game (like the HUD)... It looks like that is included with the redux version here.
There is a reason Owls are called wise. Plus she is a mother, and mothers know everything. :-)

It would be hard to find who started the whole DLC phase, but I bet it was an American. Probably EA. :-)
Post edited July 23, 2015 by ddickinson
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ddickinson: There is a reason Owls are called wise. Plus she is a mother, and mothers know everything. :-)

It would be hard to find who started the whole DLC phase, but I bet it was an American. Probably EA. :-)
Excellent point :-)

I think it was Microsoft that started it (and a quick look at Wikipedia confirms it)... Plenty of companies did free DLC, but apparently Microsoft titles on X-Box were the first paid DLCs. Sounds about right :-\
Post edited July 23, 2015 by AgentBirdnest
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CarrionCrow: ...
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ddickinson: I am glad to hear you are doing all right. I saw a documentary once about Walmart. It did not put the place or the unions that work there in a good light.

It makes sense that Sega will milk it to death, big publishers seem to do that with most franchises. I wonder if the next DOW game will be loaded with DLC like the Company of Heroes does. I don't think they will care about making it better, they know that enough people will buy it based on the name. Most big brands have fans that will follow it no matter how bad it gets. I think you are smart to not get it day one, if you get it at all.

That is another thing about the lore, there are so many possibility for games. You could make a game in almost any genre and it could be suited for 40K in some way. An adventure game playing an Inquisitor, a FPS as an Imperial Guard or a Space Marine, strategy games, space battle simulators, just about anything. But I think they will just keep making weak games and milking the franchise until it is dead. Then they will milk it some more just to make sure the corpse is good and dead.
Well, DOW 2 Retribution has 18 pieces of DLC listed for it.
Annoyingly, those aren't even for the core game, but for a multiplayer section that you need two other people to play.

-laughs- I think I'll pass. If I'm going to spend 60 dollars on a full retail purchase, it will be to support a company whose products I feel good about.
Last time I did that was for Pillars of Eternity, and it was 45.

Read recently that there are a number of other games in the works in a variety of genres.
The most interesting of the bunch is an action-RPG where you're an inquisitor. It might turn out well.
But yeah, the vast majority of it will probably be more of the shovelware crap they're allowing now.
Post edited July 23, 2015 by CarrionCrow
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AgentBirdnest: Excellent point :-)

I think it was Microsoft that started it (and a quick look at Wikipedia confirms it)... Plenty of companies did free DLC, but apparently Microsoft titles on X-Box were the first paid DLCs. Sounds about right :-\
*big thank you hug for you know what* ;-)

So I was right. It was you Americans who started DLC? You really are an evil nation. :-)
Post edited July 23, 2015 by ddickinson
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AgentBirdnest: Excellent point :-)

I think it was Microsoft that started it (and a quick look at Wikipedia confirms it)... Plenty of companies did free DLC, but apparently Microsoft titles on X-Box were the first paid DLCs. Sounds about right :-\
And don't forget the Horse Armor DLC for Oblivion....
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CarrionCrow: Well, DOW 2 Retribution has 18 pieces of DLC listed for it.
Annoyingly, those aren't even for the core game, but for a multiplayer section that you need two other people to play.

-laughs- I think I'll pass. If I'm going to spend 60 dollars on a full retail purchase, it will be to support a company whose products I feel good about.
Last time I did that was for Pillars of Eternity, and it was 45.

Read recently that there are a number of other games in the works in a variety of genres.
The most interesting of the bunch is an action-RPG where you're an inquisitor. It might turn out well.
But yeah, the vast majority of it will probably be more of the shovelware crap they're allowing now.
I did not know that. It seems a bit unfair for those playing multiplayer who can't afford those DLCs.

That makes sense. Most of the AAA games these days are over prices anyway, especially when you can get much cheaper games that are great games. Even the Witcher 3 comes with lots of extras for the money.

To be honest, I never hold out much hope for games these days. Too many are just big let downs, especially those by big companies and based on big brand names and franchises.
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ddickinson: So I was right. It was you Americans who started DLC? You really are an evil nation. :-)
Indeed... but at least we get to blame ElT for Uwe Boll :-)
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ElTerprise: And don't forget the Horse Armor DLC for Oblivion....
There is a game on Steam that has 200+ DLCs which cost a total of £3,130.68. I don't think there is horse armour in there though. :-)

store.steampowered.com/app/24010
Post edited July 23, 2015 by ddickinson