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Deus Ex seriesGame is claiming I killed people in Castle Clinton(14 posts)(14 posts)
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Posted May 14, 2014
I am using the Deus Ex v2 mod, which I thought was supposed to only cause the NPCs to treat JC as a killer if he killed anyone as opposed to looking to Navarre's and the troops' bodycounts. I either knocked out or left alive everyone inside the base itself, and tried knocking out everyone in the castle courtyard and retreating through the tunnels, but Navarre keeps telling me how impressed she is that I am not afraid to kill. I know it's a minor detail, but it's buggin me that the mod doesn't seem to be doing its job. Can anyone help me?
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Posted May 14, 2014
Edit: Sorry! I thought you were talking of another mod and I gave you a wrong answer! Never used that, sorry! :(
Please, ignore my useless post!
Post edited May 14, 2014 by Enebias
Posted May 14, 2014
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Jonesy89: *snip*
I have not used Deus Ex v2 myself, but I would suggest bringing this up to the folks at Off Topic Productions, in the thread for Deus Ex v2 there. http://offtopicproductions.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=10132
Posted May 16, 2014
Does the mod you're using only take Navarre and her goons into account, what about weapons that have a blast radius? I'm a little rusty on what happened exactly but in my first playthrough of Deus Ex, I had the same issue. Navarre praised me for not being afraid to kill even though I only used the tranquilizer darts to take down enemies. What I think happened is in the sewer area, theres a guy with a heavy weapon (flamer i think) and I think some guy I knocked out got caught in the blast when he fired at me.

Also, in my second playthrough, I played through it the same way, Navarre and her goons of course tore up whoever got in their way but after the mission, she complained to Manderly that our tactics are incompatible. It seemed that the game didn't recognize Naverres kills as mine anyways so no mod was necessary to fix that.

In both of these incidents I wasn't using any mods. Just wondering if it was possible a stray shot from that flamer guy got you the kill like it did for me. Other than that (or another stray shot from an enemy killing another enemy), the only thing I can think of is the mod having a bug.
Post edited May 16, 2014 by IwubCheeze
Posted May 16, 2014
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Jonesy89: I am using the Deus Ex v2 mod, which I thought was supposed to only cause the NPCs to treat JC as a killer if he killed anyone as opposed to looking to Navarre's and the troops' bodycounts. I either knocked out or left alive everyone inside the base itself, and tried knocking out everyone in the castle courtyard and retreating through the tunnels, but Navarre keeps telling me how impressed she is that I am not afraid to kill. I know it's a minor detail, but it's buggin me that the mod doesn't seem to be doing its job. Can anyone help me?
The original game did that too I think. It counts a knockout as a kill for the purposes of the Navarre dialog.
Posted May 16, 2014
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doctorfrog: The original game did that too I think. It counts a knockout as a kill for the purposes of the Navarre dialog.
Strange... I could have sworn on my first playthrough (unmodded), I knocked people out and didn't trigger that dialogue.
Post edited May 16, 2014 by Jonesy89
Posted May 16, 2014
I can attest that KOing people does not count as killing them for that check.

Does Deus Ex v2.0 include the "fix" from Shifter where unconscious NPCs can be killed? If so, perhaps that's what happened.
Posted May 16, 2014
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boct1584: I can attest that KOing people does not count as killing them for that check.

Does Deus Ex v2.0 include the "fix" from Shifter where unconscious NPCs can be killed? If so, perhaps that's what happened.
I'm not familiar with Shifter; what is this "fix", and how does it work?
Posted May 16, 2014
Shifter is a mod by Yukichigai, which includes a lot of bug fixes and some new content. I don't know how it was implemented, but when using Shifter, if you damage an unconscious NPC with a weapon that inflicts non-KO damage (basically anything but the baton, prod, and tranquilizer darts) they can die.

Although now that I'm thinking about it some more, I think that might actually have been introduced by Lork in Biomod, which is a fork of Shifter.
Posted May 17, 2014
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IwubCheeze: Does the mod you're using only take Navarre and her goons into account, what about weapons that have a blast radius? I'm a little rusty on what happened exactly but in my first playthrough of Deus Ex, I had the same issue. Navarre praised me for not being afraid to kill even though I only used the tranquilizer darts to take down enemies. What I think happened is in the sewer area, theres a guy with a heavy weapon (flamer i think) and I think some guy I knocked out got caught in the blast when he fired at me.

Also, in my second playthrough, I played through it the same way, Navarre and her goons of course tore up whoever got in their way but after the mission, she complained to Manderly that our tactics are incompatible. It seemed that the game didn't recognize Naverres kills as mine anyways so no mod was necessary to fix that.

In both of these incidents I wasn't using any mods. Just wondering if it was possible a stray shot from that flamer guy got you the kill like it did for me. Other than that (or another stray shot from an enemy killing another enemy), the only thing I can think of is the mod having a bug.
In the unmodded game, simply entering the open air court of Castle Clinton or going near the enterance where Navarre and the troopers are waiting for you makes the game assume you have assaulted together with Navarre. Anything that triggers Navarre to assault the castle means you're a killer, even if you're only hiding behind a crate the whole time. That is unless you have already recovered the ambrosia in the tunnels. Navarre's complaint then is that you have completed your objective without assaulting the open air court. If you trigger the assault before recovering the ambrosia, it's high fives all around for having nerves of steel.

I think the underground tunnels are so deep below the castle that nothing that happens here can alert or affect the guards in the castle.
Posted May 18, 2014
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Sufyan: In the unmodded game, simply entering the open air court of Castle Clinton or going near the enterance where Navarre and the troopers are waiting for you makes the game assume you have assaulted together with Navarre.
+1 right there, that's exactly what happens. All you need to do for the 'no kills' consequences is (besides not killing anyone, of course) not come anywhere near the castle's main entrance, from the outside nor the inside, before every NSF is down.

Even if you shoot tranq darts to a guy and they run towards the entrance after their health lowers, and gets killed by Navarre or the troopers, it will still not count as a kill of yours.

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Sufyan: That is unless you have already recovered the ambrosia in the tunnels. Navarre's complaint then is that you have completed your objective without assaulting the open air court. If you trigger the assault before recovering the ambrosia, it's high fives all around for having nerves of steel.
Not sure if that is correct (locating the Ambrosia disabling the assault trigger), I'll check it as soon as I can.
Post edited May 18, 2014 by Links
Posted May 20, 2014
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Sufyan: *snip*
Now that you mention it, I did meet up with Navarre at the front entrance which explains why the game thought I was going gung ho. Thanks for clearing that up. All this time, I thought it was an uncounsious dude getting caught in some crossfire.
Posted June 01, 2014
I was just able to test it, and finding the Ambrosia before going up to the castle does not deactivate the trigger. Just stay away from the castle's entrance until every NSF is out or they'll pin it on you.
Posted June 02, 2014
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Links: I was just able to test it, and finding the Ambrosia before going up to the castle does not deactivate the trigger. Just stay away from the castle's entrance until every NSF is out or they'll pin it on you.
Well, yes and no. Normally if you approach Navarre before finding the ambrosia she will launch the assault at the end of your brief conversation. If you find the ambrosia before talking to her she won't launch the assault at the end of the conversation. You can still cause the assault to happen by agitating the guards, even after having already discovered the ambrosia stealthily.

It is a bit contrived. Navarre is waiting around near the enterence waiting for JC to join her in assaulting the castle, and she will wait all day if she has to. In hindsight I think it would feel a bit more believable if she assaults the castle around the same time you recover the ambrosia via the hidden enterance, as if she grew impatient waiting for the soft-touched JC to join her, then she finds that he has already completed the objective. Just a minor change to make it feel less like time stands still..
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Deus Ex seriesGame is claiming I killed people in Castle Clinton(14 posts)(14 posts)
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