I heard some rumors on various forums and comments that CDPR hired some of the ME: Andromeda former developers? Is it really true? Does anyone know more about it?

I really hope they didn't. We saw what they managed to deliver and totally ruined ME series.

Not sure why you're blaming the devs for Andromeda. It was an EA game, which is never a good starting point, and the devs were forced to use the wrong engine for the job, weren't given much support for said engine, apparently weren't helped much by their management either, and ended up having to rush the game like mad because of said issues.

Could the devs have done better? They probably could, because usually there's always room for improvement. Would it have made any difference? Probably not. Shitty management means shitty project.

If management has dropped the ball and fucked up the planning and the means then there's just not a whole lot individual programmers, art people, gameplay designers, QA can do to unfuck that situation.

EA does have a reputation for fouling things up for the developer, but there are still plenty of good games published by EA.

No, I think the real reason Andromeda ended in a shit show, is that Bioware has been slowly becoming increasingly woke for years now. Just compare their games and arrange them from how centrist to how leftist they are, now check their release dates, notice anything? I bet you've created a (roughly) chronological list.

And this is really unsurprising, if you look at who they laid off and who they hired down the years. They've snatched up all of the absolutely worst people they could find, people like Sam Maggs, Manveer Heir and many more of their accursed ilk, while getting rid of most of the talented and passionate staff (and those that weren't forced out mostly left the sinking ship).

I gather Andromeda actually had pretty good character models and facial animation at some point prior to release, but they purposefully made the women uglier to further some 'body positivity' agenda, and then of course the men had to follow suit (though they are still much less unattractive than the women). EA didn't make them do that, Bioware chose to do that, just like they chose to shove some homo-promo BS down everyone's throat right at the start of Anthem.

The rumor that CDPR has hired Andromeda devs is troubling, to say the least. I would like to hear more details. Let's hope it's the last of the somewhat competent guys who got kicked out or bailed, rather than some SJWs.

Instead of propagating rumours, post your facts.

I have a hypothetical question for you: If there are no solid facts, and all that there is to discuss is rumors, do you think that makes those rumors not worth discussing?

Of course, I would agree it is very important to realize when something has no factual basis and to take any statements surrounding it with a huge grain of salt. But I personally still think rumors can be worth discussing.

Besides which, I have heard this rumor in several places over the last week or two, some of which I know to have frequently reliable inside sources. I can't find the quotes I'm thinking of, right now. But if I do, I will post them here.

Also, and this is starting to feel a little like deja vu at this point, stop telling other people how to live their life. Like, seriously dude, even if you think rumors should not be discussed, who are you to forbid people discussing them?

You really do give off a vibe of "CDPR is untouchable for criticism", though deny saying that. I'm curious, what kind of criticism are they not above, according to you (and I'm talking about real criticism, not speculation about rumors)?

I do not answer for Hickory, but I do for myself: If someone tells me something IRL based on a rumour, I ask for evidence; if they do not have any, I disregard what was told to me.

If talking about something I am much less familiar with (like the development team of a game I might be interested on), the fact that something told about it is based on a rumour makes it even less interesting than in the above IRL situation.

If you want to talk bs about something, go ahead, but do not whine about those telling you it's bs.

This I can get behind: it is your prerogative.
But there is an important difference between asking for evidence (e.g. "Where did you hear these rumors? Can you give citations and references?"), and telling people what they can and can't do (e.g. "Instead of propagating rumours, post your facts"). The former makes you smart, that latter makes you both censorious, dictatorial and incredibly pretentious. This is a little more 'problematical' to borrow an overly used phrase from the opposition. If someone is actually talking BS, it's fine to point out that it is BS, though this requires no less evidence! But if someone is not talking BS, and then you come along and call BS without evidence, then you are in the wrong.
And since we often don't know which side of the story is BS, and sometimes it is a matter of opinion, you can't simply dismiss rumors off-hand.
You don't have to regard them yourself, you don't have to take an interest, but you don't get away with calling BS undisputedly.
Your referral to people 'whining' makes this take even more 'problematic', as it implies a judgement: "People who disagree when I say they're talking BS, are whining". Who are you to decide? You are an interested party, namely the one calling BS: you don't get to be plaintiff, judge, jury and executioner.

If someone does not have any power to enforce someone else doing what they are "telling them to do", and they know it, as Hickory certainly does (I do not have any reason to believe he has any sway over GOG personnel, and he is certainly not delusional), then saying things in that manner is simply a rhetorical resource. There's nothing more to be said about that.

And if something is not backed by evidence, it is bs, even if some or all of it coincides with the truth. That is the whole point of not propagating rumours: you don't know if it is true or not.

From what I've seen of Hickory on this forum so far, I'm afraid he may well be delusional though, and I certainly have no reason to believe he doesn't hold sway over GOG personnel any more than that he does. If it is a rhetorical resource, it is a bad one: it is rude and hence demonstrates either a lack of class and charm, and worse yet, it implies some form of self-perceived superiority. Seems like I found something more to say about that after all.

Things are not simply BS for lack of evidence, things are BS when they are false. Rumors have a time, place and value: for one thing, they help alert you to possible risks/dangers, and thus keep you on your toes. If you heard rumors without evidence that your worst enemy was about to make an attempt on your life or career, I would call you a fool to dismiss them off-hand.
Rumors can save lives as readily as they can end them; the trick is to be aware that something is nothing more than a rumor, while measuring its worth by its expectation value.

If anyone seems to be living in a fantasy world, it's certainly you, not Hickory. Being rude on the Internet... unheard of.

If you can assess the possibility of something you are told to be true or not, then it has evidence that makes it more or less possible. Hence, it is not rumour.

I repeat, If you choose to spend time and effort discussing bs, do not complain about people telling you it is.

Bye.

I can assure you that I am not living in a fantasy world, but would that I were, especially if it was my own fantasy, for my interlocuters would be so much more pleasant and sophisticated, you see: less quick to dismiss counter-arguments without considering their merit, more interested in a true dialog and open to empathetic consideration. Not to mention, they would not be rude, not even on the internet, which is no excuse whatsoever for bad manners, for "the manners maketh the man"...

Dear Hickory on the other hand... has been known for his curtness and surliness, and is wont to bouts of fancy... such as believing he can read someone else's mind and tell them what they mean or think, and imagining himself in positions of such enviable authority, as to lay some legitimate claim to that power to command others as to the living of their very own lives... Perhaps this is not a sign of fantasy or insanity, and yet, one cannot deny as to its delusional nature.

I did not mean to imply that you can quantitatively assess such a possibility -- you can't -- even with the evidence, you still cannot truly quantify. Rather I meant that you always have some sense/feeling of the likelihood that a rumor is true (how ridiculous is it? is it in keeping with the pattern of events surrounding this topic that I do have evidence for?), and that this likelihood can be used to make some estimate of the expectation value, i.e. the sum of the products of the rationalized likelihood without evidence for each possible outcome (most simplistically, there will be only two: the rumor is true or it is false) and the perceived personal result if this outcome happens to be correct.

For instance, on this topic I would calculate:
Expectation value =
= Likelihood that no (Ex-)Bioware staff are working on Cyberpunk 2077 * Result if this is the case + Likelihood that (Ex-)Bioware staff are working with CDPR as freelance or consultants but were not hired * Result if this is the case + Likelyhood that (Ex-)Bioware staff from before Andromeda (and Inquisition) were hired by CDPR * Result if this is the case + Likelyhood that (Ex-)Bioware staff who worked on Andromeda were hired by CDPR * Result if this is the case =
= 0 (because it doesn't do the game any good in my opinion if no (Ex-)Bioware staff are involved, just a lack of harm) + Small possibility of consultants/freelancers fouling Cyberpunk 2077 up + Possibility that (Ex-Bioware) now CDPR staff from before Andromeda will be one of their token jackasses and screw up Cyberpunk 2077 + Nigh on certainty that any Andromeda veterans involved in Cyberpunk 2077 will manage to make a real pig's breakfast one way or another =
= Significant risk of this turning out to be a negative influence of Cyberpunk 2077
So therefore the rumor is worth pursuing.

There you go again with the supposition that it is BS, but you provide no counter-evidence. In addition, you are assuming some sort of objective judgmental power that allows you to tell people when they are complaining and when they are not. Now such power would be a great boon, and a feather in you cap to be sure, but call me a skeptic for asking: what evidence can you provide that you have this power of objective judgment, oh putative wise one? Or -- bear with me here -- might it just be possible that you suffer from similar delusions as our dear Hickory? Are you related perhaps? Or the self same person even? Or perchance you have spent so much time together as to catch that which he hath -- a contagious delusion of grandure, then?

Ooohhw! Are you going on a magical adventure? Can I join you on your quest? Where will our journey take us? In any case, farewell thee well, I suppose.

Hypothetical questions are as unsafe as rumours. "BLAH, BLAH, BLAH!" I was not, so request denied.

Or as safe ;) They are nothing more than an arena for thought experiments, philosophical reflection and free dialog.

So you were not telling people to not propagate rumors, but to post facts? If such is the case, I have done you an unjust disservice, and my conditional apology is profuse!

Okay, wise guy, instead of bashing people you don't even know, let's steer this discussion back on topic.

We know that CDPR contracted Digital Scapes to help them with multiplayer, and we know that Digital Scapes have employed a bunch of Ex-Bioware staff. I think these were (mostly) pre-Andromeda guys, which still doesn't guarantee they're not bad ones, though.

Does anybody have an idea of who exactly moved from Bioware to Digital Scapes?

Oh, really, your lordship?
So we alredy denied to discuss rumors because... a certain person said so?
Your lordship, you are too full of yourself.

These steam threads all got shut down for discussing this same topic:
https://steamcommunity.com/app/1091500/discussions/0/1633040337760678604//
https://steamcommunity.com/app/1091500/discussions/0/1635291505039175109/
https://steamcommunity.com/app/1091500/discussions/0/2564160288799219794/

The older two are phrased in terms of accusations, so there you could argue closed for spreading misinformation, but the latest one is purely in terms of a question.

The last one only just got locked down a few minutes ago, and I was there to see what happened:
The last two posts that were removed, were a plea from OP to stay on topic and collect evidence rather than speculating wildly, and someone who actually posted links to possible evidence (e.g. the CDPR statement on Digital Scapes, and the DS website, etc.). They removed both the evidence and the request to remain unbiased and factual, and banned the OP, citing "Witchhunt".

I think this is about the strongest proof we're likely to obtain, that there is in fact more to this rumor than they are letting on; otherwise what are they hiding behind such illegitimate censorship?