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Lets hope for a System Shock 1 release on GoG!
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JudasIscariot: A lot of ire has been directed at us via the "you are selling abandonware!" argument because of the mistaken impression that we somehow make all of the abandonware sites take down the games they were offering for download.
I think some people are just angry that things they got for free once suddenly have a price tag. I can understand this in a way. You took away their sweets.
I wouldn't have a bad conscience to download a truly abandoned game, since there is no harm done. I think I still have some in a remote corner of my HD.
Other than that I fully agree with your post. And I'm glad GOG doesn't send C&D letters. I would be useless anyways - all popular GOG games are available in the torrent networks.
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F4LL0UT: Actually I think Judas was referring to the ignorant people who accuse GOG of illegally selling old games. I don't know how it's by now but I've already seen a bunch of posts on the interwebz a while ago where people seemed convinced that GOG must be charging for abandonware (apparently some people simply can't grasp the fact that you can still license such old games).

And I think occasionally people still post a question concerning GOG's legal status on the forums right here before making a purchase.
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JudasIscariot: Once you have someone who holds the rights and they wish to sell their games, the games actually are no longer abandoned since, you know, someone is actively enforcing their rights to the IP and the game(s) is(are) available for legitimate purchase once again :)

A lot of ire has been directed at us via the "you are selling abandonware!" argument because of the mistaken impression that we somehow make all of the abandonware sites take down the games they were offering for download. Frankly speaking, we don't have the time or the inclination to go around sending C&D letters to those sites because, really, it kind of makes you look like a git and most of the honorable abandonware sites take the games down of their own accord. The reason? Because they are actively trying to preserve video game history in their own way since no one else is doing it, the legality of doing so notwithstanding (let's not discuss that as I am not a lawyer :P )
Well said, my friend, well said! :)
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JudasIscariot: A lot of ire has been directed at us via the "you are selling abandonware!" argument because of the mistaken impression that we somehow make all of the abandonware sites take down the games they were offering for download.
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toxicTom: I think some people are just angry that things they got for free once suddenly have a price tag. I can understand this in a way. You took away their sweets.
I wouldn't have a bad conscience to download a truly abandoned game, since there is no harm done. I think I still have some in a remote corner of my HD.
Other than that I fully agree with your post. And I'm glad GOG doesn't send C&D letters. I would be useless anyways - all popular GOG games are available in the torrent networks.
I understand the frustration with something that seemed free with no strings attached all of a sudden having a price tag but I think the trade off (preservation, support, no need to pirate and worry about catching some sort of malware etc.) is worth the price when it comes to the older games. Granted, I am biased since I work here :)
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JudasIscariot: I understand the frustration with something that seemed free with no strings attached all of a sudden having a price tag but I think the trade off (preservation, support, no need to pirate and worry about catching some sort of malware etc.) is worth the price when it comes to the older games. Granted, I am biased since I work here :)
I wouldn't be here if I thought otherwise. I even bought some games that I already legally owned. The service getting them running "out of the box" is just worth it.
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JudasIscariot: ...
Well the reality is people can still pirate a lot of GOG's "abandonware". I've tried to make a commitment never to pirate GOG's games (I believe I slipped up once), but I have done searches on TPB to see what's up, and your games are actively being seeded (which is why I thought it might be good to advertise on pirate sites, but in a discussion most people frowned on that idea)

This is both good and bad imo. Good in that it shows GOG is still willing to accept that some people will steal and instead GOG pursues the honest folks, but of course bad for obvious reasons, perhaps a main one being publishers may see this as DRM-free being a bad thing.

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JudasIscariot: preservation
Thanks for being willing to mention that as a good factor. Some people don't want to view GOG as a safekeeper/museum of classics, but I think that can and should be at least part of GOG's job, which is why I'm hoping it's legal issues holding back release of these highly-desired freeware classics and not, "Well, we won't make any money off these..." - http://www.gog.com/forum/general/the_mostvoted_freeware_games_on_the_wishlist.
Post edited May 22, 2014 by tfishell
System Shock 1 and GOG must be together... :\
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tfishell: This is both good and bad imo. Good in that it shows GOG is still willing to accept that some people will steal and instead GOG pursues the honest folks, but of course bad for obvious reasons, perhaps a main one being publishers may see this as DRM-free being a bad thing.
If they really think this, they're stupid. Their DRM-infested games are pirated also.
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tfishell: This is both good and bad imo. Good in that it shows GOG is still willing to accept that some people will steal and instead GOG pursues the honest folks, but of course bad for obvious reasons, perhaps a main one being publishers may see this as DRM-free being a bad thing.
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toxicTom: If they really think this, they're stupid. Their DRM-infested games are pirated also.
Well people here indeed make them out to be stupid.
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tfishell: some people will steal and instead GOG pursues the honest folks
(emphasis mine)
wat
Do I need to post that piglet cartoon?

Legally, there's no difference between downloading software that's currently sold and that's currently not being sold. You know you don't have permission, you're making copies, it's not 70 years old -> illegal.

Morally, rightsholders of abandonware and ex-abandonware deserve dick. Copyright allegedly exists to benefit the creation of new art. You might make a convincing case for paying for indie games that are currently being sold (and that you like) so that the proceeds can fund the creation of a new game by the same people. If it's not the case, there's nothing morally wrong whatsoever with making an illegal copy, no matter if the game is sold or not and by whom.

Now, I buy games on GOG, and I haven't played a pirated game in like 7 years. Why?

Because GOG provides a service: they curate my game collection. They host the files, provide fast downloads on demand whenever and wherever, they package installers, fix bugs, host the community, provide metadata, additional recommendations on improving my gaming experience, and thoughtful advice on expanding my collection. That's a valuable service that I'm willing to pay for. The fact that some of my money goes to the assorted cultural squatters and leeches is unfortunate, but it's the only way GOG can actually have a legal business providing the service.

And I will never understand people who complain about GOG and ex-abandonware. They used to be able to illegally download amateur-made game packages that weren't guaranteed to work. Now they can illegally download shiny polished installers that have much better chances of working OR legally download the same installers and receive lifetime hosting and tech support service for a small one-time fee, OR download the same old amateur-made packages but from another site, and regardless of the option they choose, they also have a bonus in the form of a more or less active community generating all sorts of metadata. That's an all-around win regardless of your opinion on copyright. Are they luddite hipsters, sad because their precious secret favorites that only they knew how to run and to appreciate are being fished out of the collective memory hole and distributed to the philistines who might have never seen a dos prompt?
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tfishell: some people will steal and instead GOG pursues the honest folks
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Starmaker: (emphasis mine)
wat
Do I need to post that piglet cartoon?

Legally, there's no difference between downloading software that's currently sold and that's currently not being sold. You know you don't have permission, you're making copies, it's not 70 years old -> illegal.
...
I think I worded that poorly. What I meant was GOG doesn't worry about the pirates; they pursue honest folks in a good way, giving them rewards for buying games, money-back guarantee, etc.
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herecomethe2000: You do realize that before GOG started distributing Freespace 2. SCP included all the game files as part of it's universal installer, because the game was so difficult to come by. As soon as GoG started selling it, they stopped and pointed people to Gog. Even people who had the pirated copy before bought it on Gog, and as far as I can tell, it sells well. So this really doesn't mean anything and should not be an excuse to not making an official release. There are loads of people who buy games on Gog without ever having heard of the game back in the day just because it was on Gog.
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toxicTom: SCP does not include all the files required to play anymore? That's new for me. I installed (re-)SCP last year and only copied the movies and the needed FS1 files over from my GOG version - just like I did several years ago from my disk version.

Also I won't speak against releasing SS1 here, I would probably buy although I already have the "Enhanced CD" version and SSP. I just don't know how much money there is to make with it.
I think you are probably mistaken, the fs2 installer you speak of has been down for a couplel years, and only just now came back and it certainly hasn't included any volition files since GoG released FS2. The community made a huge point of it.
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herecomethe2000: I think you are probably mistaken, the fs2 installer you speak of has been down for a couplel years, and only just now came back and it certainly hasn't included any volition files since GoG released FS2. The community made a huge point of it.
Could be. My memory is kinda blurry. I only know that I always copied over some files from the game install. But I also always used FSPort.
If SCP forces people to actually buy the game - I'm totally fine with this now that it's officially available again.

Just like when SS1 makes it to GOG, I'll probably buy it (again) but still use the SSP version.
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tfishell: some people will steal and instead GOG pursues the honest folks
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Starmaker: (emphasis mine)
wat
Do I need to post that piglet cartoon?

Legally, there's no difference between downloading software that's currently sold and that's currently not being sold. You know you don't have permission, you're making copies, it's not 70 years old -> illegal.

Morally, rightsholders of abandonware and ex-abandonware deserve dick. Copyright allegedly exists to benefit the creation of new art. You might make a convincing case for paying for indie games that are currently being sold (and that you like) so that the proceeds can fund the creation of a new game by the same people. If it's not the case, there's nothing morally wrong whatsoever with making an illegal copy, no matter if the game is sold or not and by whom.

Now, I buy games on GOG, and I haven't played a pirated game in like 7 years. Why?

Because GOG provides a service: they curate my game collection. They host the files, provide fast downloads on demand whenever and wherever, they package installers, fix bugs, host the community, provide metadata, additional recommendations on improving my gaming experience, and thoughtful advice on expanding my collection. That's a valuable service that I'm willing to pay for. The fact that some of my money goes to the assorted cultural squatters and leeches is unfortunate, but it's the only way GOG can actually have a legal business providing the service.

And I will never understand people who complain about GOG and ex-abandonware. They used to be able to illegally download amateur-made game packages that weren't guaranteed to work. Now they can illegally download shiny polished installers that have much better chances of working OR legally download the same installers and receive lifetime hosting and tech support service for a small one-time fee, OR download the same old amateur-made packages but from another site, and regardless of the option they choose, they also have a bonus in the form of a more or less active community generating all sorts of metadata. That's an all-around win regardless of your opinion on copyright. Are they luddite hipsters, sad because their precious secret favorites that only they knew how to run and to appreciate are being fished out of the collective memory hole and distributed to the philistines who might have never seen a dos prompt?
^This. Oh so much this.
Nope, never going to happen. Maybe a year ago when Night Dive still had some credibility, but not in this post-"we're going to waste three days of your time hyping up a new release, and then reveal that it's actually just us putting Harvester on Steam" world.