Really? I'm not forcing anybody to use Steam, every system has it's pros or cons. I'm just pointing out which arguments aren't 100% valid. Really, I'm just not the type of person who quickly jumps on the extreme hate or extreme support bandwagon.

You are only joking right ?

Not doing anything to prevent competition... let's see if competition want to sell a steamwork using games they have to accept that their customers will have to :

- install client application of one of their competitor
- Register an account at one of their competitor.
- Logon to one of their competitor everytime they want to install,update or event sometime play the game.
- And best of all, when they start the client application their customer will be greeted by advertisement for said competitor.

Microsoft were trying to do only one thousanth of what Steam is doing here they would be vaporized to sub atomic particles by the antitrust comission in no time.

None of that violates antitrust in any way.

Valve isn't forcing anyone to use Steam. Games with a Steamworks requirement do not equal being forced to use it. You get to choose whether or not you want the game. And the majority of software released does not use it, meaning the vast majority of the market doesn't use Steamworks at all.

Valve isn't forcing any other distributors to sell Steamworks games. It's up to them if they want to. Gamersgate doesn't, and they hardly seem to be suffering. Were Valve in a position to strongarm other retailers to sell their products, THAT would count. They aren't.

Valve doesn't have the ability to single-handedly price fix due to market control. This is the big part when it comes to anti-trust...price control. Valve doesn't have the ability to do it at all on games from other companies that they sell.

Sorry for the wall of text, I didn't have time to reply to your first comment earlier.

How exactly? I can do whatever I want with my games at any time, like installing mods. Having some control over an account, like the ability to ban an account for pirating, isn't the same as having absolute control over everyone.

First of all, there's no individual TOS for each game. Some games have a separate EULA, but the terms in it are up to the developer, not Steam. Even if a hypothetical drastic change was made that had a negative impact, I would probably cancel my account. Also, if GoG or any other DD service made a drastic change like adding more DRM, the only options would probably be canceling or accepting the changes. The subscriber agreement is just detailing every possible situation.

Sure but plenty of other DD services have exclusive games or preorder bonuses. Even though a lot of the games on GoG were sold at retail at one point, some of them are older games, where the only way to obtain a copy that is guaranteed to work on your computer is on GoG. For example, Planescape Torment isn't being sold at any other DD service besides GoG.

The thing is, the Steam subscriber agreement isn't really that different from any other EULA. Every EULA gives the developer some control over how you use the software. Even if it was enforceable, the user was never supposed to violate it in the first place.

First of all, Steamworks isn't Valve paying developers a ton of cash to put their games on Steam. Steamworks is just a bunch of tools for developers to use for free in exchange for putting their games on Steam, such as a matchmaking system, cloud saves, achievements, stat tracking and quick updating. Steamworks isn't preventing similar systems, like Impulse Reactor, from being developed. Also, none of the store features are mandatory. The sale popups can be disabled, and you can set the client to dislplay the game view every time it opens, or remove all of the other tabs and just display a simple games list. And thanks to a little thing called a "Remember me" check box, I've only had to login twice since I installed the client. Additionally, GFWL does all of these things, in a way many people find more annoying, but most DD services sell games by them.

Hummnn, no clue what you are talking about, image was just posted for fun with nobody intended as the recipient . . . chill

Incorrect. My post contains 100% verified facts. The term DRM refers to any modification of an *.exe which restricts its use. Steam et al do NOT offer *.EXE's, since the programs only work through the steam client, which must be online in order to install a game.

No DRM = completely open to piracy, bottom line. Anything which restricts piracy in any way, and/or prevents a game from being installed infinite amount of times on an infinite amount of offline PC's is a DRM.

That is indisputable fact.

Um, what are you talking about? DRM doesn't have to involve EXEs. And Steam games do use modified (encrypted?) EXEs as a part of the Steam DRM. Take a look at the game install folders - all of them have EXEs.

This is true, I know Assassin's Creed works this way. I'm pretty sure it's rare though.

No, you are utterly wrong.

Digital Rights Management by definition simply refers to any and all means of controlling the usage of digital media. That means can take any number of forms, including a modification of the .exe itself, which it very often does. For example, I bought the Witcher via digital download through Atari. All I got was an .exe file to run to install the game, but that .exe included encryption and an online "unlock key" to access the content in it. After the game was installed, running the game's .exe launched an additional online activation. There is no additional client software, the game simply runs from a seemingly normal .exe, just like GOG's games. So you see, simply having a straight .exe does not mean you are DRM free in the slightest.

Additionally, disk checks are not DRM, they are copy protection, there is a difference. Copy protection simply prevents you from making unauthorized copies of physical media, but it does not do anything to control your usage of the digital content on that media, like DRM does.

I haven't gone through my entire steam library but I think all the old games that use dosbox it works with.

Good post, well explained. A lot of people don't seem to realize that DRM has a precise meaning and that Steam, factually, is DRM. There is no other way to look at it, it's like debating whether water is wet. DRM means, as you said, managing the media after you sell it. Steam certainly does this.

Absolute bollocks. I can pretty much guarantee you've logged in hundreds of times if you've had your account for at least a year and play the games on it frequently.

Just because you didn't have to type your username and password each time doesn't mean you weren't logging in. You obviously don't understand what the 'remember me' box does at all.

Sorry, I just had to comment on that because apparently no one else picked up on it.

That's necessary, but not sufficient. DRM isn't restricted to copying and may include things like self protection and anti-cheat. Needing a key (even if it's verified offline, just a check) during install is also DRM.

Even just tagging a file is technically DRM, but a passive form that uses the courts as it's enforcement mechanism.
Copy protection is DRM, not all DRM is copy protection. That's the difference in a nutshell.

Copying IS a usage.

Steam won't even sell to you if you can't provide a credit card registered in the country where you happen to be; when I first moved to Canada Steam refused to sell me any games using my UK credit card even though it was a perfectly valid card. I also missed out on the Christmas sale last year because I was in the UK and by that point I'd moved all my credit cards to Canada. From what I understand, they may also block your account if you travel a lot and log in from different countries.

The region crap is one of the worst aspects of Steam.