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hedwards: They provide PSD import and export as a format, but you're not supposed to be using it for images that you aren't using with PS. And they're there only because PS is such an important program in that regards.
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Sachys: actually not the case with inkscape and artrage as its a "save as" function.
as i dont use gimp anyway...

Edit: and all i wanted t know was an expansion upon http://www.gog.com/forum/general/is_linux_good/post8 anyway... farkinell!
Save as is just another name for export in many programs. I don't believe that it's the native format for those programs so saving using psd is likely to be inconsistent.
Post edited May 06, 2014 by hedwards
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hedwards: Save as is just another name for export in many programs. I don't believe that it's the native format for those programs so saving using psd is likely to be inconsistent.
I REPEAT:

"and all i wanted t know was an expansion upon http://www.gog.com/forum/general/is_linux_good/post8 anyway... farkinell!"
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hedwards: Save as is just another name for export in many programs. I don't believe that it's the native format for those programs so saving using psd is likely to be inconsistent.
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Sachys: I REPEAT:

"and all i wanted t know was an expansion upon http://www.gog.com/forum/general/is_linux_good/post8 anyway... farkinell!"
Your point is? For people that need PS they're going to have to use PS, 3rd party tools are never completely reliable in cases like this. Even different versions of the official application can have issues.
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hedwards: Your point is? For people that need PS they're going to have to use PS, 3rd party tools are never completely reliable in cases like this. Even different versions of the official application can have issues.
My point is youre telling me crap I already know when all I asked for in this thread was some clarification as to another posters comment about photoshop and linux.

YOUR point is?!?!?!

In short: you're just being an annoying git like usual. You've said nothing of use and are blatantly looking to stroke your ego (more likely something else in the meantime) so unless you can be helpfull to my initial query, interesting, funny or generally not a total git...

BUM OFF!

Edit: also read back through the thread you sociopathic loony!
Edit 2: THIS!!! - in case you cannot be bothered to scroll back at all. http://www.gog.com/forum/general/is_linux_good/post35

Fucksake!
Post edited May 06, 2014 by Sachys
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hedwards: Your point is? For people that need PS they're going to have to use PS, 3rd party tools are never completely reliable in cases like this. Even different versions of the official application can have issues.
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Sachys: My point is youre telling me crap I already know when all I asked for in this thread was some clarification as to another posters comment about photoshop and linux.

YOUR point is?!?!?!

In short: you're just being an annoying git like usual. You've said nothing of use and are blatantly looking to stroke your ego (more likely something else in the meantime) so unless you can be helpfull to my initial query, interesting, funny or generally not a total git...

BUM OFF!

Edit: also read back through the thread you sociopathic loony!
Edit 2: THIS!!! - in case you cannot be bothered to scroll back at all. http://www.gog.com/forum/general/is_linux_good/post35

Fucksake!
LOL,Seriously?

I'm going to be the bigger man here and not report your violation to the blue text folks, but you really should apologize for making such an ass of yourself. Nothing that I've posted in this thread is incorrect.

I'm sorry that you're so disturbed, I'd recommend you get services from a qualified mental health expert as your behavior here is way out of line with anything that I've done here.
I'd say it's good. If you are ready to skip games which don't work in Wine - then Linux is great for gaming as well. Unlike others said above, gaming doesn't keep me away from Linux. I'm doing all my gaming on Linux, and besides native games have many games which work in Wine. And note that gaming on Linux continues to improve with more and more developers releasing native games. So it's a good time to start using Linux as your primary desktop system.
Post edited May 07, 2014 by shmerl
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shmerl: I'd say it's good. If you are ready to skip games which don't work in Wine - then Linux is great for gaming as well. Unlike others said above, gaming doesn't keep me away from Linux. I'm doing all my gaming on Linux, and besides native games have many games which work in Wine. And note that gaming on Linux continues to improve with more and more developers releasing native games. So it's a good time to start using Linux as your primary desktop system.
Your only gonna have indie video game developers and indie video game development companies release PC versions of video games natively for sale on Linux.

AAA video game publishing companies and AAA video game development companies will never release their PC versions of video games for sale on Linux only on Windows from AAA video game publishing companies like Activision, Bethesda Softworks, CapCom, Eidos interactive, Electronic Arts (EA), SQUARE-ENIX, Ubisoft, etc.

Crytek with CryEngine and Epic Games with Unreal Engine 4 don't count because as I said they are indie.

DICE worked with AMD to develop a brand new graphics API instead of using OpenGL for Frostbite 3 and AMD's Mantle API translates DirectX 11's HLSL instead of OpenGL's GLSL.

Linux will not have 10% of the PC video games market by the end of 2014 or even 2015.

Linux is not for everyone.

I am getting sick and tired of people like hedwards and you who keep telling people how good Linux is and that everyone needs to switch from the claws of Microsoft's Windows to Linux.

I don't have a problem with PC gamers who play their PC versions of video games on Linux or want to play exclusively on Linux I don't give a damn what Operating System (OS) PC gamers purchase and play their PC versions of video games on. It is starting to get annoying seeing how much Linux gamers just because they hate Linux are trying to force PC gamers away from Windows to go to Linux.

You should be happy Microsoft even lets OpenGL work on Windows and that the video game development companies that Microsoft owns Microsoft lets them develop the PC versions of their video games for Linux and Mac as well as use OpenGL if they want to.
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Johnathanamz: Your only gonna have indie video game developers and indie video game development companies release PC versions of video games natively for sale on Linux.
Often people mean different things when saying "indie" or "AAA" So let's clarify what it can mean.

Normally, "indie" stands for independent. I.e. a studio which can release games without getting money from external publishers which would dictate them what and how to release. For example CD Projekt Red are an independent studio so their games can be called indie. AAA in this context means a game funded by external publisher (let's say some kind of Ubisoft or whatever) which placed demands on development studio (such as "don't release games for Linux" or whatever).

Another common way of understanding these terms is orthogonal. By "indie" people simply mean low budget games, and by AAA big budget (regardless of where the funds come from). In these terms for example CD Projekt Red make AAA games, since their budgets are quite big.

So let's go back to your statement. You mixed up both of these definitions in one sentence I think. You mentioned publishers which fund games (one way of meaning AAA) as well as big budget games (another way of meaning AAA). And you made a sweeping statement that neither will release games for Linux.

You may be right that EA or Ubisoft are not interested in Linux. Their backwards thinking as well causes them to use DRM for example. So who cares about what they are interested in. Independent studios which release big budget games however is another matter. Studios like CD Projekt Red or inXile or Larian already showed interest in Linux games. And they release big budget games, they aren't some amateurs like some people usually think of independent studios.

However that's not stopping on such independent studios as well. Publisher funded games also start appearing on Linux (such as funded by Deep Silver for example). This will snowball to the point that even backwards thinking publishers like EA will get interested. But again, I personally don't care, since most of their games are sick with DRM anyway.

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Johnathanamz: Linux will not have 10% of the PC video games market by the end of 2014 or even 2015.
And you base numbers on what? On pure speculation? Real numbers show that percentage of Linux sales is pretty high (around 10% or more for some games). Humble Bundle already demonstrated that. So potential is there, and it's there already now, not in 2015 or later. It can of course grow and it will grow.

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Johnathanamz: Linux is not for everyone.
Not according to developers who see it as an opportunity. And not according to companies like Valve which even are working on consumer market products using Linux like their gaming console.

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Johnathanamz: I am getting sick and tired of people like hedwards and you who keep telling people how good Linux is and that everyone needs to switch from the claws of Microsoft's Windows to Linux.
It's your own problem that your expectations don't match the reality. Just sit and relax and see events unfold. Linux will even overtake Windows as a gaming platform at some point.

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Johnathanamz: You should be happy Microsoft even lets OpenGL work on Windows and that the video game development companies that Microsoft owns Microsoft lets them develop the PC versions of their video games for Linux and Mac as well as use OpenGL if they want to..
DirectX domination is coming to an end. It was at its peak not long ago, but it will go only down the slope onwards together with decline of Windows usage itself. And it seems that Valve is that straw which broke their back. It won't happen overnight, but it will happen pretty gradually. You can revisit this matter in a year or two from now to see how it will progress.

It's good to point out that GOG joining the list of gaming distributors helps this process as well, since GOG will be able to provide additional feedback for developers and potential publishers about Linux sales which will help increasing their interest in releasing games for Linux.
Post edited May 07, 2014 by shmerl
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Johnathanamz: Your only gonna have indie video game developers and indie video game development companies release PC versions of video games natively for sale on Linux.
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shmerl: Often people mean different things when saying "indie" or "AAA" So let's clarify what it can mean.

Normally, "indie" stands for independent. I.e. a studio which can release games without getting money from external publishers which would dictate them what and how to release. For example CD Projekt Red are an independent studio so their games can be called indie. AAA in this context means a game funded by external publisher (let's say some kind of Ubisoft or whatever) which placed demands on development studio (such as "don't release games for Linux" or whatever).

Another common way of understanding these terms is orthogonal. By "indie" people simply mean low budget games, and by AAA big budget (regardless of where the funds come from). In these terms for example CD Projekt Red make AAA games, since their budgets are quite big.

So let's go back to your statement. You mixed up both of these definitions in one sentence I think. You mentioned publishers which fund games (one way of meaning AAA) as well as big budget games (another way of meaning AAA). And you made a sweeping statement that neither will release games for Linux.

You may be right that EA or Ubisoft are not interested in Linux. Their backwards thinking as well causes them to use DRM for example. So who cares about what they are interested in. Independent studios which release big budget games however is another matter. Studios like CD Projekt Red or inXile or Larian already showed interest in Linux games. And they release big budget games, they aren't some amateurs like some people usually think of independent studios.

However that's not stopping on such independent studios as well. Publisher funded games also start appearing on Linux (such as funded by Deep Silver for example). This will snowball to the point that even backwards thinking publishers like EA will get interested. But again, I personally don't care, since most of their games are sick with DRM anyway.

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Johnathanamz: Linux will not have 10% of the PC video games market by the end of 2014 or even 2015.
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shmerl: And you base numbers on what? On pure speculation? Real numbers show that percentage of Linux sales is pretty high (around 10% or more for some games). Humble Bundle already demonstrated that. So potential is there, and it's there already now, not in 2015 or later. It can of course grow and it will grow.

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Johnathanamz: Linux is not for everyone.
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shmerl: Not according to developers who see it as an opportunity. And not according to companies like Valve which even are working on consumer market products using Linux like their gaming console.

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Johnathanamz: I am getting sick and tired of people like hedwards and you who keep telling people how good Linux is and that everyone needs to switch from the claws of Microsoft's Windows to Linux.
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shmerl: It's your own problem that your expectations don't match the reality. Just sit and relax and see events unfold. Linux will even overtake Windows as a gaming platform at some point.

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Johnathanamz: You should be happy Microsoft even lets OpenGL work on Windows and that the video game development companies that Microsoft owns Microsoft lets them develop the PC versions of their video games for Linux and Mac as well as use OpenGL if they want to..
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shmerl: DirectX domination is coming to an end. It was at its peak not long ago, but it will go only down the slope onwards together with decline of Windows usage itself. And it seems that Valve is that straw which broke their back. It won't happen overnight, but it will happen pretty gradually. You can revisit this matter in a year or two from now to see how it will progress.

It's good to point out that GOG joining the list of gaming distributors helps this process as well, since GOG will be able to provide additional feedback for developers and potential publishers about Linux sales which will help increasing their interest in releasing games for Linux.
Ok I know what AAA and indie means I use AAA for big budget video game publishing companies and video game development companies.

That's why I didn't mention 2K Games and Deep Silver because they are releasing the PC versions of their video games for Linux as well.

See there you go you proved my point 10% for some video games I am talking about the whole Linux market it's not at 10% and it will never grow to 90+% of the Windows market or even 50% I have been hearing Linux is the future of video games since like 2001 or 2002.

VALVe is working on developing a video game console that runs on Linux sure but most people who will purchase a Steambox will just install Windows. I already read comments from a lot of people on a lot of websites on the internet who will do this like. I even talked to quite a few friends of my real life friends who are going to do this around 10+ people I talked to. I have 100 real life friends who all purchase and play their video games on PC on Windows only out of those 100 real life friend about 12+ of my real life friends do not want to purchase PC versions of video games that support OpenGL only DirectX.

Your funny everything I said is more realistic Linux will never overtake Windows as a video game platform. End of discussion.

DirectX is still dominating look at AMD's Mantle API it translates DirectX 11's HLSA not OpenGL's GLSL. The rest of 2014, 2015, and beyond hundreds of PC versions of video games will be using DirectX 11 and DirectX 12.

You just love Linux so much that it's clouding up your vision of what the future is.

Quite a lot of fortune 500 companies have a partnership with Microsoft to use Windows in their offices like Intel. Intel strictly forbids using Linux. Intel only uses Linux for server and Research and Development (R&D) that's it.

NASA and a lot of government agencies use Windows and won't switch to Linux. The U.S. Government pays Microsoft a lot of money to use Windows.
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Johnathanamz: See there you go you proved my point 10% for some video games I am talking about the whole Linux market
There is no such thing as "whole market" for developers who consider making a Linux version of their game. They have a straightforward question - how many sales can they expect form their game and can it return their investments in development and marketing. Total Linux usage (let's say global market share) is irrelevant. Developers are interested in how many Linux users would buy their game, how many Windows users and etc. If they expect that this amount is big enough, they can justify spending time on development (if we are talking about cases when engines don't support Linux already. In increasing number of cases they already do). So, HB is a good test case for them to see what actual percentage of sales happened with Linux versions.

GOG can provide more of such information when they'll start selling Linux games (that is, if GOG will be willing to share such statistics with developers or the public).

You might like speculating rather than analyzing statistics, but development studios prefer analysis, and it shows them that Linux market is growing and has a potential for them. If you care about realistic analysis - do your research. If not, I see no point in arguing with your speculations.

About NASA - total miss. ISS switched their computers to Linux not long ago and ditched Windows. And good for them.
Post edited May 07, 2014 by shmerl
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Johnathanamz: See there you go you proved my point 10% for some video games I am talking about the whole Linux market
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shmerl: There is no such thing as "whole market" for developers who consider making a Linux version of their game. They have a straightforward question - how many sales can they expect form their game and can it return their investments in development and marketing. Total Linux usage (let's say global market share) is irrelevant. Developers are interested in how many Linux users would buy their game, how many Windows users and etc. If they expect that this amount is big enough, they can justify spending time on development (if we are talking about cases when engines don't support Linux already. In increasing number of cases they already do). So, HB is a good test case for them to see what actual percentage of sales happened with Linux versions.

GOG can provide more of such information when they'll start selling Linux games (that is, if GOG will be willing to share such statistics with developers or the public).

You might like speculating rather than analyzing statistics, but development studios prefer analysis, and it shows them that Linux market is growing and has a potential for them.

About NASA - total miss. ISS switched their computer to Linux not long ago. And good for them.
I know all of that already.

The video game developers selling Linux versions of the PC versions of their video games and earning their money back from the sales yes I know this but it is not growing as fast as Windows Windows will always outsell Linux. Just in the past year alone I got like 30+ of my real life friends to join gog.com they never heard about it and I told them gog.com is so much better than Steam they all purchase their video games on Windows and as I said all my 100 real life friends purchase their video games on Windows. Out of those 100 real life friends of mine about 5+ got some of their friends to switch from playing on consoles to switch to playing on PC for good a few of them even sold all of their consoles and console video games. When they saw what higher FPS, higher resolutions, and what mods can do to the PC versions of video games now they cannot go back to playing on the consoles ever again.

Sorry but Windows is here to stay for another 20 years. Linux will be here as well but it will grow extremely slow.
In the recent few years it clearly grew from practically nothing to all major distributors starting selling Linux games. It's growth. How competition with Windows will go? Time will tell. But that's not the point. The main point is that Linux is already establishing as a gaming platform and it will only snowball going forward. Windows can stay all it wants. But it will be forced to compete on technical merits and not on lock-in and network effect tactics.
Post edited May 07, 2014 by shmerl
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Rinu: If you are Photoshop user, there is no solid Linux equivalent (speaking from personal experience).
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Sachys: This intrigues me as I've heard it before - is it due to the OS use of resources (such as RAM perhaps?) or something else? - I paint digitally using a wacom tablet, so getting the most fluid realtime painting experience possible is a must (even on a budget limiting my hardware choices).
I used to edit manga for English translator group. Due to layered structure (QC, translator, proofing), multiple adjustments were required. It would take ages without layers, an ability to choose 2 days old version and modify typesetting, leterring or visual aspect (adjust toning from original, etc.).

Gimp doesn't have it. Gimp's layers work like a single uneditable object. If you want to work with fonts somehow more intensely than adding fluffy Happy wedding under a wedding picture, you need more than Inskcape. I have tried, I have asked around on web.
Post edited May 07, 2014 by Rinu
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shmerl: In the recent few years it clearly grew from practically nothing to all major distributors starting selling Linux games. It's growth. How competition with Windows will go? Time will tell. But that's not the point. The main point is that Linux is already establishing as a gaming platform and it will only snowball going forward.
Yes it's growing but it;s growing slowly in the past year it grew only like 1% or 2% according to Steam's Hardware survey.

Microsoft has billions of dollars they can obliterate Linux at any time and the fact that they earn billions of dollars a year from government agencies all over the world that use Windows.

It will never reach 50% of the market. End of discussion. We are just gonna keep arguing over this over and over and over.

I have 1 simple answer for you.

#1. I will believe it when I see it. Lets stop talking now I am getting exhausted by arguing over this.
Post edited May 07, 2014 by Johnathanamz
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shmerl: I'd say it's good. If you are ready to skip games which don't work in Wine - then Linux is great for gaming as well. Unlike others said above, gaming doesn't keep me away from Linux. I'm doing all my gaming on Linux, and besides native games have many games which work in Wine. And note that gaming on Linux continues to improve with more and more developers releasing native games. So it's a good time to start using Linux as your primary desktop system.
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Johnathanamz: Your only gonna have indie video game developers and indie video game development companies release PC versions of video games natively for sale on Linux.

AAA video game publishing companies and AAA video game development companies will never release their PC versions of video games for sale on Linux only on Windows from AAA video game publishing companies like Activision, Bethesda Softworks, CapCom, Eidos interactive, Electronic Arts (EA), SQUARE-ENIX, Ubisoft, etc.

Crytek with CryEngine and Epic Games with Unreal Engine 4 don't count because as I said they are indie.

DICE worked with AMD to develop a brand new graphics API instead of using OpenGL for Frostbite 3 and AMD's Mantle API translates DirectX 11's HLSL instead of OpenGL's GLSL.

Linux will not have 10% of the PC video games market by the end of 2014 or even 2015.

Linux is not for everyone.

I am getting sick and tired of people like hedwards and you who keep telling people how good Linux is and that everyone needs to switch from the claws of Microsoft's Windows to Linux.

I don't have a problem with PC gamers who play their PC versions of video games on Linux or want to play exclusively on Linux I don't give a damn what Operating System (OS) PC gamers purchase and play their PC versions of video games on. It is starting to get annoying seeing how much Linux gamers just because they hate Linux are trying to force PC gamers away from Windows to go to Linux.

You should be happy Microsoft even lets OpenGL work on Windows and that the video game development companies that Microsoft owns Microsoft lets them develop the PC versions of their video games for Linux and Mac as well as use OpenGL if they want to.
That's because you're a troll that has never actually used Linux.