I'd answer this, but I'M LATE! I'M LATE! *checks watch*

No you can never make any assumptions of anyone you have never meet. The only assumption you can make is that there is a unique human being with a unique set of values, beliefs and experiences and should therefore be treated as unique before I know what they are. Anything else leads to stereotyping and all that leads from there...

Just because it is logical for you that knowing how to use a forum would entail learning how to download via a browser do not mean that it is the same for everyone else.

I might ask if you have read my post? I have never said they all are like this, and also said some have given good advice. However does this justify does that did not? let move on to your allegory.

What if the man was blind and did not see the carriages and they are placed, as you say next to him. behind a Plexiglas wall? Would you assume it is OK for all the customers that happen to walk by shouting at him and make him feel small and stupid because he did not find them by himself? is it ever OK to make someone feel like that?

And by the way, it is never an excuse to not be civil because the other person is not. It will only lead to a downwards spiral.
mad...mad...MAD.. they called me mad, all of them. but I WILL show them, I will show them all...

In the real world, dealing with real people, there are certain expectations both for behavior and knowledge that are completely justified. It is unreasonable and just as bad for you you to expect everyone to be completely ignorant of even the most basic of skills as it would be for me to expect that everyone knows how to program a game from scratch. I am not going to lower my expectations just because there actually are some idiots out there, if we all did that, none of us would have any reason to be anything other than an idiot.
Okay, now your getting into "straw man" territory. I put up a strictly analogous argument, now you are trying to apply conditions to it that have nothing to do with what we are discussing here. I am not going to get into that "downwards spiral" with you.

However, I will address one thing: yes, it is perfectly OK to make someone feel small and stupid when they do something small and stupid, how else are they ever to learn to not be so small and stupid?
EDIT - Just to clarify, I am in no way saying the OP was small or stupid, nor that he deserved to be treated that way.

I trhink your analogy is way off the mark, Cogadh. It's more like this:

A customer goes into a shop, buys some products and they're packed in a large plastic bag. On his way out of the shop, the bag breaks and some of his purchases end up broken on the floor. Is he justified in complaining to - perhaps even yelling at - the merchant that they packed his purchases in a weak bag? I think so. Especially since it's known to the merchant that the bags are prone to breaking if packed with goods over a certain weight.

That aside, I agree that most responses here have been at least helpful to the OP. But he does have a legitimate complaint, IMO.

You're right, that's a much better analogy.

Of course he is justified in complaining to, possibly even yelling at, the merchant, but that's not what happened here. The OP complained and yelled to the other customers (the forums), not the merchant. If he wanted to file his complaint with GOG, they have a support form for that, just like the store has a customer service desk or at least a store supervisor to deal with those situations.

This I agree with - there are certain expectations when you meet someone for the first time. For example trying to be civil and polite and threat each other with respect, while trying to figure out how the other person work. However both knowledge and behavior is both cultural and ethical constructs which change according to your social situation (time, place and so on) and while it is responsible to assume a certain, what shall we say... civil?... understanding in a first meeting it is up to both parts to establish this. If the first participant get off on the wrong foot it should be easy for the second one to guide him back again on the right tracks, if it is not the best option is to just walk away and deal with someone else...


I was just trying to say that it is dangerous to make assumptions without knowing the other person first.

Thats is very we have very different value perceptive. In my opinion no one has ever learned anything from been made small and stupid, except learned the feeling of shame. What they then learn is not how to deal with a situation, but how to avoid it (in this case never to post on GoG forums again...). And to put up another straw man - is right to hit someone to teach them not to hit anyone?

Coelecanth's example happened to me. I bought a Nintendo DSLite and a game for it, the GameStop employee put it in one of those miniature tissue-thin plastic bags they gave me, and handed it to me. The handles tore right off, and the thing cracked against the floor. Both employees and another customer started laughing at me. I saw red, and forced the guy to take a return (since the box was unopened) and stood over him while he got a brand new DS in the sealed box from their storeroom and sold it to me for the same price. I didn't go back in there again.

...and I realized just now this is irrelevant, but I found it horrifying.

Well, that also depends. On many sites the forums are linked with customer service. Is it possible to think that he thought he was not only complaining to the costumers but also to the staff? If you as a new member to GoG have an issue to raise - what would seem like the first point of contact? not to sat anything about the fact that the forum is monitored and post are answered by GoG staff?
no - this is extremely relevant. good point. and poor you....

Hmm... firstly, this comes from the same person that said, and I quote:

"This person comes along and have an experience which leads to a personal view and a particular perception. He then tells about this experience and ten fan-boys jump out of the woodwork barking 'you horrible person you, how dare you come here and tell us whats what. Your perception is not valid and meaningless. Not only that, you are quite stupid - off course you should not have used the downloader(?) everybody knows that. This is all your own fault and we are brilliant and exceptionally clever and GoG is perfect as it is'."

You made yourself out to know our precise mindset with your comment, without knowing anything about us.

Secondly, what personal attacks?

Pfft. Do you show compassion at all times yourself? You're expecting much from us. And yes, I think most were constructive, even if they were not in a "good-mannered spirit". But you know, I made my first post at this forum when I was very annoyed (for a similar reason, even if I had only wasted 1/4 of the money he had). I asked for help rather than complaining about the site (which spawned neutral replies, much like those here actually), like this guy should have done if he was to expect everyone to treat him really, really nicely, like...

"I'm really, really sorry for you bro, you have my most sincere condolences. A lot of us have had trouble with the GOG Downloader in the past, and we were annoyed just like you. We feel your pain, and we'll do our best to help. Do you have a steady internet connection? Maybe you could try using your browser? I hope it works out for you, and if it doesn't, come right back and we will guide you through this!

Love,
Moarthanhooman."


Seriously though, re-read the first damn page. You'll find that the majority of posts are apologetical to him for this. Most negativity is in the arguements between other people, not aimed at the OP at all. There has to be some reason you start to act like you're the kindest person on Earth (and therefore bitch about how we act). There looks to be two people your whining could be aimed at, and that's not enough to act like everyone was like that.

Let it go.

No, i was not portraying a mindset, but an attitude. This was the feeling I had left after reading some of the replays. I never said this was how someone actually thought. However, just as I am making my values quite clear from the way I speak, so are yours coming out from how you do too. I have also never singled out a single user, nor a single post.

ummm... this:
This is an attack on me as an person, you are trying to ridicule my opinions by not attacking the ideas but the person. what relevance had this to the argument? (I would also like you to know that i have had a issues with weight problems (which I have control over now) all my life which has led to some medical problems today. So, yes, it also hurt more than it should.)

I am not perfect, nor have I ever said I am ever going to be so. However I think it is important to have a set of values and not compromise on them. I try to show compassion as much as possible, but I know that I fail. When I do I do not try to blame it on others, or how they have treated me, but I try to take responsibility for my own actions and fess up. I know that I often fail at this, but that do not mean I am going to completely give up on my values each time. I think the important thing is to acknowledge that I made a mistake and try to improve until the next time. Am I a bleeding heart idealist? yes, I think so and am quite proud of it. I think i would have problems living with myself if I was not.

The reason I did this was that i felt very sorry for the OP and I felt I needed to say something. Judging by the reaction, I am now glad i did.

You were portraying us as complete morons. It was insulting.

Duuuuuuuuuude. That was not meant as an attack whatsoever. I certainly wasn't ridiculing you. It was a hypothetical situation in which one can easily be pushed over the edge and "snap", in turn coming off as very irrational to the guy who receives all that blame (for past actions of others). Something that is all too human, and if anything, I was trying to see which angle you were approaching this from, to learn why you got so easily defensive. For Christ's sake, it was something I thought took your side (had my assumption been true), in that it portrayed your words here as completely understandable given the circumstances. You couldn't misunderstand me more.

It's all good, but I apologize for coming off as harsh. I do get very defensive myself, though.

Stand by your ideals, but please, try not to tell people how to act if they aren't being as positive as you'd like (with only a few being below neutral here). It's sure to cause some trouble... like it did here. It's better to set an example, I think, than to tell people to act in a different way. To show them a hero they would like to be, rather than telling them to be that hero.

This forum is a sad, sad place.

Too many rabid fanboys and just angry people in general that obviously have little interaction outside this forum and decide to take that rage on one another.

I won't be visiting here any more.

And to prove my point... watch as people "attack" me for saying the truth. You're really pathetic.

Not that I know you in the slightest, but goodbye and take care!

The site was launched in 2008, how excatly is that "Very new" in any way?

And are you serious about the size? so if a game is large it shouldn't be here?

you aren't making any sense