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General discussion (archive)Games with a good gameplay change at the end.(58 posts)(58 posts)
(58 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted August 10, 2013
edna and harvey: harvey's new eyes, is quite memorable for being a point&click adventure game, that ends with an epic rpg battle (the only rpg battle in the game).
Posted August 10, 2013
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StingingVelvet: Half-Life 2 was an epic example.

And honestly timppu your puzzle boss ending is exactly the kind of thing that pisses me off. I just played a straight-up shooter for eight hours, I'm ready to move on and play something else, and here's this multi-phase puzzle ending. Fuck that shit.
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timppu: Maybe I misunderstood you. I wasn't sure what was your original complaint, e.g. the end fights that are 10x harder than anything before, ie. making finishing the game very hard, just due to the end fight? I hate those kind of boss fights too, like the ones in XIII. The "puzzle" fights are usually quite easy, albeit potentially time consuming. Like e.g. the pit monster in Half-life (yeah it was not the end boss, but still, I feel it could have been a good one). Once you understand what you are supposed to do, it isn't that hard to achieve it.

Just today I finished GTA: Vice City. Its last story mission ("Keep your friends close...") wasn't hard at all, and also didn't deviate from the rest of the game in gameplay. So is that the kind of ending you prefer? I OTOH found that last mission kind of a letdown. Too simple, too easy, too anything but a memorable ending to a decent game. I just stood there at one spot shooting anything that moved for a minute or two, and poof, end of the game.

Of course, if I am playing e.g. a tactical game, I don't wish the end boss fight to be e.g. a pure action sequence, because I didn't want to play an action game. That used to be quite common complaint with many classic point&click adventure games, when they quite often had some simple but forced arcade action sequence, while rest of the game was pure adventure gaming. I can understand that complaint.
It had hard moments like trying to kill that one guy on the roof top with badguys surrounding you and if you don't act quick they will blow you away. But yeah that mission was not the hardest, the hardest was saving Lance at a construction site, the part where when you try to escape, badguys in sports cars will try to ram you and unless you have a sports car yourself or a durable vehicle, your screwed. Oh and any GTA Vice City mission that makes you drive a boat.
Post edited August 10, 2013 by Elmofongo
Posted August 10, 2013
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Elmofongo: It had hard moments like trying to kill that one guy on the roof top with badguys surrounding you and if you don't act quick they will blow you away.
Now I am perplexed. What "guy on the roof top"? What you describe does not sound anything like the "Keep your friends close..." that I just played earlier today. This is how the mission went for me:

I was at my mansion, and the boss (Sonny?) for which you were sent to jail comes to talk to you. Apparently you are giving him some fake money in a briefcase, 3 million dollars, but he refuses. You learn that the black guy (Lance?) you thought was your friend had sold you out. After that the action starts:

I stand in front of my office on the second floor inside the mansion. A couple of guys run in through the front door, shooting at me. I shoot them with my heavy machine gun. More enemies come through the main door and some from the second floor side doors, I shoot them too.

At some point the traitor (Lance?) comes through the side door I think, spewing some shit. So I shoot him down too. More enemies pour in, I shoot them down effortlessly.

Eventually the main guy (Sonny?) comes through the front door threatening to kill me or worse, and two of his henchmen. Again, I just shoot them down. After that I get a non-interactive part where the lawyer (Ken Rosenberg) keeps asking me what has happened etc., and the end credits roll.

Was I supposed to do something else, or wasn't that the last mission after all? I did get the end credits after that, after which the game still continued and I kept getting funny phone calls from others, but no more missions. As I said, I basically just stood in front of my office door, and shot anything that moved. All the action happened inside the mansion.
Post edited August 10, 2013 by timppu
Posted August 10, 2013
HL2 and Ep 2
Oddworld Strangers Wrath
Alan Wake (the words thing was a great idea but sadly not used much)
Mark of the Ninja because the teleporter was great fun

On the other side of the coin
Deus Ex Human Revolution (seriously human zombies wtf were they thinking)
Half Life (I hated Xen because it seemed to take worst elements and make them primary)
Posted August 10, 2013
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timppu: Just today I finished GTA: Vice City. Its last story mission ("Keep your friends close...") wasn't hard at all, and also didn't deviate from the rest of the game in gameplay. So is that the kind of ending you prefer? I OTOH found that last mission kind of a letdown. Too simple, too easy, too anything but a memorable ending to a decent game. I just stood there at one spot shooting anything that moved for a minute or two, and poof, end of the game.
Yes, that is a great game ending. The gameplay was normal, the story made it feel epic. I guess you and I just disagree.

I assume developers think more people are like you than me.
Posted August 10, 2013
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pigdog: I can see why. Taking LSD, putting on a dressing gown and picking up a glowy stick (the LSD's kicked in) is no fit way to return to a game
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Spinorial: Don't knock it till you've tried it XD
Good comeback!

Another game that I enjoyed and thought had a good ending is Nox. It often falls under the radar but it's pure, simple fun.
Posted August 10, 2013
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timppu: At some point the traitor (Lance?) comes through the side door I think, spewing some shit. So I shoot him down too. More enemies pour in, I shoot them down effortlessly.

Eventually the main guy (Sonny?) comes through the front door threatening to kill me or worse, and two of his henchmen. Again, I just shoot them down. After that I get a non-interactive part where the lawyer (Ken Rosenberg) keeps asking me what has happened etc., and the end credits roll.
It is some time I played it but I think Lance is supposed to run and you are forced to follow him to heliport and there is he and bunch of bad guys and you need to kill him there.

I think you were too fast there and managed to avoid part of the mission.

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timppu: Besides Heretic 2, I disliked the boss fights in e.g. XIII. They could be killed the same way as any the other enemies in the game, ie. just shooting at them, but they were just made much more powerful than ordinary enemies. The challenge merely came from your shots making very little damage to them, and their shots (like mere surgeon knives the mad doc throws at you) making massive damage to you, even though you have a helmet and a bullet-proof vest on you and the doc has nothing.
Oh god, this is my "favourite" boss. Old withered guy with scalpel but because he is boss he is much stronger than you or soldiers and des much more damage with his thrown scalpel than assault rifles do to you.



I understand Stinging Velvet and think that Vice City last mission is well in line with the rest if game and that's why it's quite good. There is no sudden change of gameplay, games doesn't try to cheat you by some new tricky stuff and it is harder than most of game. This Scarface ending also fits to Vice City very well and it works better than some tricky and not fitting stuff they could come up with. When I play the game to end, it is probably because I like the gameplay, so I don't want it to suddenly change and come with something completely different.
Post edited August 10, 2013 by Vitek
Posted August 10, 2013
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Wishbone: I hate those with a passion.
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timppu: So did you hate e.g. the mid-level pit monster boss in Half-life, since you couldn't just shoot it down with your weapons like you could all the ordinary monsters before it? Instead, you had to traverse around to be able to launch a rocket, which would finally scorch it.
No, as keeveek said, that wasn't a boss fight, that was simply very impressive level design. The game made it very clear that you would not be able to hurt the monster on your own, so you had to navigate around it.
Posted August 10, 2013
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Elmofongo: It had hard moments like trying to kill that one guy on the roof top with badguys surrounding you and if you don't act quick they will blow you away.
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timppu: Now I am perplexed. What "guy on the roof top"? What you describe does not sound anything like the "Keep your friends close..." that I just played earlier today. This is how the mission went for me:

I was at my mansion, and the boss (Sonny?) for which you were sent to jail comes to talk to you. Apparently you are giving him some fake money in a briefcase, 3 million dollars, but he refuses. You learn that the black guy (Lance?) you thought was your friend had sold you out. After that the action starts:

I stand in front of my office on the second floor inside the mansion. A couple of guys run in through the front door, shooting at me. I shoot them with my heavy machine gun. More enemies come through the main door and some from the second floor side doors, I shoot them too.

At some point the traitor (Lance?) comes through the side door I think, spewing some shit. So I shoot him down too. More enemies pour in, I shoot them down effortlessly.

Eventually the main guy (Sonny?) comes through the front door threatening to kill me or worse, and two of his henchmen. Again, I just shoot them down. After that I get a non-interactive part where the lawyer (Ken Rosenberg) keeps asking me what has happened etc., and the end credits roll.

Was I supposed to do something else, or wasn't that the last mission after all? I did get the end credits after that, after which the game still continued and I kept getting funny phone calls from others, but no more missions. As I said, I basically just stood in front of my office door, and shot anything that moved. All the action happened inside the mansion.
I meant Lance (I did not want to spoil it to people that Lance ends up betraying Tommy)
Posted August 10, 2013
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Wishbone: I hate those with a passion. "Every enemy we've thrown at you until now have taken damage in the ordinary way. Now kill this guy. Oh, what is that? He doesn't take any damage when you attack him, and you think that's completely illogical given the rest of the game? Well, then you'll have to try something else, won't you? No, we won't tell you what it is, you'll have to go look at a YouTube video to find out. And once you've done that a few times, we'll change it, so you'll have to do something completely different and unrelated to hurt him. And we'll do that to you 3 or 4 times before you can finally take him down for good."
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Aver: You are taking it to extreme and every soultion taken to extreme is bad.
Of course I'm taking it to an extreme, I'm trying to prove a point. But I really have experienced boss fights which took the concept to those extremes, and they sucked. As I recall, one of them were responsible for me quitting Painkiller for good, which is why I never completed that game.
Posted August 10, 2013
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timppu: Just today I finished GTA: Vice City. Its last story mission ("Keep your friends close...") wasn't hard at all, and also didn't deviate from the rest of the game in gameplay. So is that the kind of ending you prefer? I OTOH found that last mission kind of a letdown. Too simple, too easy, too anything but a memorable ending to a decent game. I just stood there at one spot shooting anything that moved for a minute or two, and poof, end of the game.
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StingingVelvet: Yes, that is a great game ending. The gameplay was normal, the story made it feel epic. I guess you and I just disagree.

I assume developers think more people are like you than me.
What I would give for a new GTA game in 1980s Vice City with the gameplay of GTA 5.

Oh and I would definately love to hear a new V-Rock radio music.
Posted August 10, 2013
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Elmofongo: Oh and I would definately love to hear a new V-Rock radio music.
Only sissies cry. Real men stand in the rain and listen to this!

V-V-V-v-v-v-v-Rock!
Posted August 10, 2013
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timppu: Just today I finished GTA: Vice City. Its last story mission ("Keep your friends close...") wasn't hard at all, and also didn't deviate from the rest of the game in gameplay. So is that the kind of ending you prefer? I OTOH found that last mission kind of a letdown. Too simple, too easy, too anything but a memorable ending to a decent game. I just stood there at one spot shooting anything that moved for a minute or two, and poof, end of the game.
Well that's just a bad example then. Great example of a well done boss fight would be that in Devil May Cry - when you get to him, you get the most adrenaline-packed fight in the game, while using - and this is important - only the skills obtained while playing the game.You have to time your jumps, dodges, parries and attacks perfectly to beat him.
Posted August 10, 2013
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Elmofongo: Oh and I would definately love to hear a new V-Rock radio music.
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Shaolin_sKunk: Only sissies cry. Real men stand in the rain and listen to this!

V-V-V-v-v-v-v-Rock!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_pk1kPD3Gsw

You know when I first heard this song on V-rock I legitimately thought it was band from the 80s in real life, only to find out the song was actually made from the GTA team Rockstar North.

Man they really made a song that feels 80s.
Posted August 10, 2013
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Fenixp: Well that's just a bad example then. Great example of a well done boss fight would be that in Devil May Cry - when you get to him, you get the most adrenaline-packed fight in the game, while using - and this is important - only the skills obtained while playing the game.You have to time your jumps, dodges, parries and attacks perfectly to beat him.
I haven't played Devil May Cry to the end (if we are talking about the PS2 original), but I guess the same could be said about the XIII boss fights. They were similar to fighting other enemies, only that they were much harder.

I felt those boss fights sucked hard. It is easy to make such boss fights: just give them 100x the hitpoints of normal enemies, and make their weapons 10x as powerful as well. There, same gameplay, only much harder this time.
Post edited August 10, 2013 by timppu
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This is my favourite topic
Community
General discussion (archive)Games with a good gameplay change at the end.(58 posts)(58 posts)
(58 posts)