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Post edited July 03, 2020 by zordren3742
Nice puff-piece. But from what I've seen, Beamdog PR has less-than-stellar track record:

https://www.gog.com/forum/planescape_torment/regarding_the_removal_of_the_original_ie_games_from_sale_on_gog

As a result of:

https://www.gog.com/forum/general/release_planescape_torment_enhanced_edition_7fa05/post117

and:

https://www.gog.com/forum/general/release_planescape_torment_enhanced_edition_7fa05/post149

As I did with the Infinity Engine, I will continue working to keep the original incarnation narratives for Aurora alive. No commentator has posted as many write-ups as I have based on the authoritative originals - ever. As with Infinity, Beamdog won't gain full traction on Aurora narrative: there are posters on GoG, RPGCodex and elsewhere who don't care one iota for Beamdog's soiling, muddling and blaspheming "enhancements".
Post edited February 15, 2018 by Lilura
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zordren3742: I do not work for beamdog. I am not being paid by beamdog.
That's what everyone says who sounds like an advertising bot. My "English -> Advertising" dictionary says that "I'm not being paid by company xyz" means "I'm being paid by the company that does the marketing for company xyz" :P
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Leroux: Btw, the thread title seems an unfortunate choice to me, since the "Campaign" is the last thing that NWN deserves a revival for. What makes it so good is that you can completely ignore that campaign and still have fun for years with all the topnotch community stuff created for it.
I completely agree. The OC was the worst part of NWN (the expansion ones weren't half bad though). However I think OP mean "(The Revival of Neverwinter Nights) Campaign" instead of "The Revival of (Neverwinter Nights Campaign)". i.e. it's a campaign to revive NWN and not NWN's campaign being revived.
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Leroux: Btw, the thread title seems an unfortunate choice to me, since the "Campaign" is the last thing that NWN deserves a revival for. What makes it so good is that you can completely ignore that campaign and still have fun for years with all the topnotch community stuff created for it.
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ZFR: I completely agree. The OC was the worst part of NWN (the expansion ones weren't half bad though). However I think OP mean "(The Revival of Neverwinter Nights) Campaign" instead of "The Revival of (Neverwinter Nights Campaign)". i.e. it's a campaign to revive NWN and not NWN's campaign being revived.
Oh, ok. I hadn't thought about that.
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Post edited July 03, 2020 by zordren3742
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zordren3742: No idea why so many people that hate beamdog gather here. I did not see this level of hate anywhere else not on any site. I'm supporting a game that I used to play.because it was and still is a one of a kind game, other than nwn 2 which we already went over. One that alot of people still like. Beamdog is there yes.but it's about more than that to the people supporting it. But it's fine that people disagree. No one could expect eveyone to get excited about a 15 year old game, that was never going to happen.
Beamdog hasn't exactly generated a lot of good will here. There are reasons for that, but I won't bother trying to dig up posts or go into a long-winded explanation.

As far as NWN goes though, I think most people here that are still playing or are still interested in the game probably have GBs of mods/haks etc, and don't really see the point of the EE of NWN. As well, there's the concern that Beamdog will decide to do what they did with Planescape Torment, BG, etc. and pull the original games from separate sale, forcing new customers to buy their EE and not giving them the choice of whether or not they want it or the original game.
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zordren3742: No idea why so many people that hate beamdog gather here. [...] But it's fine that people disagree. No one could expect eveyone to get excited about a 15 year old game, that was never going to happen.
The problem is that people here ARE excited about that 15 years old game. We always were - long before any enhanced editions were in the talks.

What you know as "gog.com" was once known as "Good Old Games". A place that was dedicated to make old games run on modern systems. A place where users tended to know a bit more about how to get old games to work. The D&D games were the flagship games of this store (together with Fallout and a couple of other classics) and the Dungeons & Dragons bundle was the highlight of every sale. All these games did cost $9.99 or $5.99 and no one here needed Beamdog to be able to play these games on high resolution 16:9 screens, or to combine Baldur's Gate 1 and 2 into one game. To some people here, Beamdog does a worse job than modders did many many years ago. And Beamdog doesn't only do a bad job... They pull the original games (the ones we love) from the store and want us to pay MORE for their "inferior" versions.

Another exmple: When Gearbox announced the remaster of Homeworld, all that people here cared about was if they'd offer the original games as well. Remaster? Fuck that, give me the unaltered original!

GOG is kind of a special place. You won't find much of a "Great! Finally I can play this classic game!" crowd here. Playing classics is what we always did.
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zordren3742: No idea why so many people that hate beamdog gather here. I did not see this level of hate anywhere else not on any site. I'm supporting a game that I used to play.because it was and still is a one of a kind game, other than nwn 2 which we already went over. One that alot of people still like. Beamdog is there yes.but it's about more than that to the people supporting it. But it's fine that people disagree. No one could expect eveyone to get excited about a 15 year old game, that was never going to happen.
Then do some research. And if you want to promote the game fine, the game is already here, and other stores, works fine. No need to promote the latest Beamdog cash grab - because that is all it is, a method of making more money from a product without doing anything. Promote the existing product by all means, give free copies away so others can get into it, but don't try to present Beamdog as anything more than a cash grab (with additional political motivations in certain cases).
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zordren3742: No idea why so many people that hate beamdog gather here.
I don't hate them because they did a messed up remake of what's personally my favourite game. They redid existing characters because they felt they don't portray their personal views, added some other text which someone else found controversial, and finally did an addon that was even more messed up than their original remake.

I don't hate them for it, because remakes get made all the time. Some I like, some I don't. If I like it I might buy it, if I don't I usually won't buy it. But I don't "hate" the developers for it (and maybe if they did a different remake better I'd buy it.); what I consider "messed up" might be considered a masterpiece by somebody else, and if someone does want to buy Beamdog's remake then good for both of them.

It's not even about how Beamdog made martyrs out of themselves in all the drama that followed. "We're breaking barriers by putting transgender characters in games and are attacked by bigots for it." Despite the fact that lots of criticism had nothing to do with that character.
Again, at that point I couldn't care less what they did.

When I started disliking them was when they pulled the classic games from the store and forced them into a bundle with the remakes. It's their prerogative, but I don't like how they force someone who wants the classics only to have to buy the remakes.

When I started "hating" them, was when in the backlash that followed they blatantly lied about it, putting all the blame on GOG. And when the truth came to light, they admitted it was them, but still pretended it was a "miscommunication" (haha) and (listen to this:) they said that the reason they removed the option of buying the classic game was so that we could enjoy the option of choosing what game to play. You can't make this stuff up.

So yes, at this point I piss on Beamdog and wouldn't trust them further than I could throw them
"Registered: Feb 2018". I'd be more impressed if the accounts behind not-so-subtle "Praise be to NWN only now that Beamdog is cashing in" infomercials were registered years ago and actually talked about playing NWN pre-BeamDog...

Example - "For some people that have never heard of the 2002 Neverwinter, they will watch a video somewhere see the graphics are old and dated, and that will be it"

You make it sound like NWN:EE will have a major graphics overhaul. It won't. All BeamDog have done is kept everything exactly the same except adding ugly overly blurred Depth of Field shader (which doesn't even make any sense in a top-down isometric game). End result - EE screenshots now look WORSE than the original:-

Original (2002)

"Enhanced" (2018)

I think I just urinated myself out of "excitement" of being charged +£15 to buy a blurrier, uglier version of exactly the same game I bought for £2... As others have said, we are excited about re-playing NWN. That's why we're already playing it now. Unlike Baldur's Gate, NWN has had native widescreen & HD resolution support, and a top-notch UI right from the start. Unlike BG's tiny "fog of war" hard-coded for 800x600, NWN's was already optimised for 1080p as far back as 2002. There is no complex "Tutu" equivalent mod or widescreen fix to apply. Even the font in the quickbar and underneath your hireling's name is the exactly the same as what you get now by enabling Options -> Video Options -> Advanced -> High Res Font.

All Beamdog have done is make the UI slightly more scalable for the 1% of gamers using 4K monitors, then add bug fixes a lot of which are free anyway in the v1.70-1.71 community patches, then after realising how incredibly weak an "upgrade" that sounds, started adding ugly DoF to try and find something, anything else to try and justify a +200-400% increase in price (just like the "cell shading" effect in BG for which everyone responded "How do I turn this nonsense off as it doesn't fit the game at all?".

Literally the only two "enhancements" of note (bug fixes and UI scaling for 4K) are stuff that by themselves are weak enough they should have been issued as a free official v1.80 final patch, just as Blizzard did with issuing Diablo 2 patch v1.14 in 2016 (exactly the same +16 years after release that NWN is in 2018). The rest is a pure unadulterated cash-grab which is why a lot of people who aren't totally gullible are not that excited over BeamDog's "enhancements".
Post edited February 16, 2018 by AB2012
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Post edited July 03, 2020 by zordren3742
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zordren3742: I'll leave it at that then, that is fine by me. I'm moving on, to the future. Keep holding that hate real close to your heart guys, see where it get's you, good luck. And remember a wise man once said "good, good, let the hate flow through you!"
Ironically, you're making exactly the same mistake that BeamDog did with their notorious amateurish PR fail that generated that huge backlash by erecting a strawman based on "I'll ask your opinion but unless you offer only gushing praise, I'll simply sneer down at you and call you a hater without even attempting to counter your points or argue why I believe you're wrong". Times have changed and that "Deflection Troll" stuff doesn't work anymore.

As for "Enhanced Editions" in general, some are done well, have obvious graphical / gameplay improvements and receive very little criticism (eg, Day of The Tentacle, Divinity Original Sin, etc). But others are a very obvious cash grab (Bioshock 1-2 Remastered, and yes, NWN:EE). Calling the latter group out for not adding much over the originals that comes anywhere near to justifying a magical tripling in price (and even making them worse in some areas) is not "hate", just observable reality.
Post edited February 16, 2018 by AB2012
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zordren3742: I did not see this level of hate anywhere else not on any site.
Dismiss criticism as "hate" all you like, no one cares because the links in this thread prove that it's warranted. Check out the RPGCodex and my blog (1 mil views in 2017) for more criticism of EEs. It's not just GoG.
I'm supporting a game that I used to play.
Whoop-dee-doo. I have supported NWN on and off since it came out. I have commentated on the original incarnation for the last 4 years, in-depth, more than anyone in its history. Same goes for Infinity and Electron.

All you've done is create a thread that shows your ignorance.

I'm supporting a game that I used to play.
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Lilura: Whoop-dee-doo. I have supported NWN on and off since it came out. I have commentated on the original incarnation for the last 4 years, in-depth, more than anyone in its history. Same goes for Infinity and Electron.

All you've done is create a thread that shows your ignorance.
You could say we are supporting a game we still play. And we do not want it to become a "game we used to play (until Beamdog had it removed)".
Post edited February 16, 2018 by ZFR