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General discussionHelp me find a new RPG(54 posts)solved(54 posts)solved
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This is my favourite topic
Posted December 23, 2020
Thank you everyone! A lot of great suggestions. I'll be looking into a bunch of games today to make my decision.

The SaGa series looks awesome. I don't know how I missed it throughout my life.
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morolf: I comment on some of the games you mentioned:
Thanks for reviewing them all. And thanks for your suggestions. I had been leaning towards getting Age of Decadence.

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kaboro: Looking for the meaning of life, hope someone can help me find it
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TerriblePurpose: 42
Excellent response! I'm glad you could provide the answer for this person!
Post edited December 23, 2020 by IfYouHave2Ask
Posted December 23, 2020
Fallout 1 and 2 are excellent games, but combat is probably one of the worst designed aspects of the games. You have no real party (only indirect control over your party - and much of the time you are trying to make them avoid doing stupid things like blowing you up - or you're just unsing them as mules anyway as I did most of the time) and combat is rather shallow. The games do fit your criteria though and are worth playing, but maybe not exactly what you're looking for.

PS:T is an excellent game as well but combat is not a priority, but rather Bioware just had not the balls to make a non-combat rpg so somehow some combat had to be thrown in. It's more like reading a (very good) book overall. It has basically no replay value and is extremely linear.

I'd avoid BG1 nowadays. It has just aged very badly. BG2 is still worth playing today. Combat is real time with pause and has some depth, focus is however on (excellent!) side quests and lots of party interaction and banter, which I personally didn't like. So it is not very high on my list, but if you can deal with that or even like it is a must-play basically. It's quite linear as well, but certainly has some replay value. If you want a similar experience with less focus on story/questing and more on combat you can also check out the (imho always a bit underrated) Icewind Dale series.

I don't know why it's not on your list - maybe you already know it or have rejected it for some reason - but if someone asks me for games with party and deep turn based fights I always like to answer "Wizardry 8". It's one of my favorite games of all time and has fantastic turn-based combat, in-depth character creation (6 self created characters and up to 2 rpc's) and some replayability too. It's not exactly open world (but does give you limited freedom) and while it has different endings it does not have much story/side quests as the focus is clearly on combat.
Posted December 23, 2020
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Kerebron: Arcanum: of Steamworks and Magick Obscura
Severely underrated title.
Also love the soundtrack in that game, too; it's quite unique.
Posted December 23, 2020
Dragon Age Origins is a great entry into the "older" style of RPGs, IMO. It's like a mix between more modern stuff and the classic PC stuff many of us grew up on. It also has great encounter design a lot of the time, barring some enemy spam in the deep roads. The story is also very solid, mature and self contained. You could ignore the sequels forever if you wanted to.

Fallout 1 and 2 are among my favorite games of all time, and like Arcanum they have a modern sensibility despite being in very old packaging. What I mean by that is story-driven side quests, lots of open options for when and why to do things, etc. If you can get past the clunky old interfaces and graphics, I think you'd find a lot to like there. It's more the interface that I think turns people off with old games, but give 'em a go if you feel up to it.

I would actually recommend AGAINST Baldur's Gate and Icewind Dale games. They're very bland in a lot of ways, have very pen and paper inspired D&D rules that can throw off people not used to that and they're not as story and choice driven as modern RPGs are. I am NOT saying these are bad games, but if you're getting into older Western RPGs for the first time I think the above choices are much better for you.
Posted December 23, 2020
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Looger23: PS:T is an excellent game as well but combat is not a priority, but rather Bioware just had not the balls to make a non-combat rpg so somehow some combat had to be thrown in. It's more like reading a (very good) book overall. It has basically no replay value and is extremely linear.
If you took out the combat from Planescape: Torment, what's left would really be an adventure game or visual novel rather than an RPG. From what I here, it would probably still be a good example of such a game, but it wouldn't be an RPG.

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Looger23: I don't know why it's not on your list - maybe you already know it or have rejected it for some reason - but if someone asks me for games with party and deep turn based fights I always like to answer "Wizardry 8". It's one of my favorite games of all time and has fantastic turn-based combat, in-depth character creation (6 self created characters and up to 2 rpc's) and some replayability too. It's not exactly open world (but does give you limited freedom) and while it has different endings it does not have much story/side quests as the focus is clearly on combat.
Wizardry 8 does thing that is not as common as it should be; you can improve your skills by using them, in addition to the small level-up skill points you get. In particular, this means that you can improve your characters even between levels.

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StingingVelvet: I would actually recommend AGAINST Baldur's Gate and Icewind Dale games. They're very bland in a lot of ways, have very pen and paper inspired D&D rules that can throw off people not used to that and they're not as story and choice driven as modern RPGs are. I am NOT saying these are bad games, but if you're getting into older Western RPGs for the first time I think the above choices are much better for you.
Don't forget the fact that attacks miss way too often in these games, particularly at lower levels (but not at really high levels). This is due to the game revolving around accuracy bonuses rather than damage bonuses, and having armor that boosts evasion instead of reducing damage.
Post edited December 23, 2020 by dtgreene
Posted December 23, 2020
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StingingVelvet: Dragon Age Origins is a great entry into the "older" style of RPGs, IMO. It's like a mix between more modern stuff and the classic PC stuff many of us grew up on. It also has great encounter design a lot of the time, barring some enemy spam in the deep roads. The story is also very solid, mature and self contained. You could ignore the sequels forever if you wanted to.
I'll have to disagree with you on the encounter design in DA:O, I think that's one of the games big weaknesses. There are good encounters, but so many of them feel repetitive, and that's in large due to how many enemies are functionally very similar. There's not a big difference between a darkspawn or a human.

I agree about ignoring the sequels though :P DA 2 had some good ideas, I like that they tried to make a more contained and personal story, rather than a save the world story, but the rushed development is visible in almost every part of it, and ultimately it's a mediocre game. Inquisition... well, that game bored me to tears. Got about 7-8h into it and then dropped it. The developers said that Assassins Creed was a major source of inspiration, and it feels like they were mostly just inspired by the boring parts of AC.

When it comes to being an introduction to that general style if RPGs, I think Pillars of Eternity is more inspired. There's more variety between the enemies and the encounters, and the balance is better. Pillars is not as friendly to newcomers as DA:O, but ultimately I think it's a better game.
Posted December 23, 2020
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IfYouHave2Ask: I'm currently looking for a new RPG to play. Hopefully someone can help me find the right one.

Here's a list of what I'm looking for in a game:
1. High replay value.
2. Different side quests or a branching main quest line. Possibly different endings or New Game Plus.
3. Open world or at least a game that is not completely linear.
4. Different party members and/or an extensive character creation mode. (Adds to replay value)
5. I'd prefer turn-based combat. If not turn-based then pausing during combat. I'd prefer the game not be real-time combat.
Also, I want the combat to have depth. Not just you encounter an enemy and your character does all the work as you watch and wait for it to end.

The setting doesn't matter. It could be fantasy or sci-fi or steampunk or whatever.

I grew up playing the Final Fantasy and Chrono Trigger/Cross games. I'm looking for something that will bring back some of that nostalgia. Although it doesn't have to be an older game. I'm currently playing Divinity: Original Sin and I think it's great.

The games I've been looking into include;
1. Dragon Age: Origins - seems similar to D:OS. Also high on many RPG lists.
2. Fallout 1 or 2 - I've played 3, 4 and NV. I know the original 2 are very different but I do like the setting and humor of the later games.
3. Expeditions: Conquistador
4. The Age of Decadence
5. Planescape: Torment
6. Baldur's Gate 1 or 2
7. Wasteland 2

Those are just a few. I haven't decided on one or any of them yet.

I'll take any and all suggestions. The only thing I'm not looking for are games like Witcher and Elder Scrolls. I enjoy those games but it's not what I'm trying to play right now.

Thank you anyone and everyone for your input.
Mass Efffect, you are thinking about Mass Effect Trilogy due to release somewhere next year

Keep that one in mind
Posted December 23, 2020
-"Expeditions: Viking" If you like history, you're going to love this game. Story, music, everything at the top for such small budget. I recommend!

-"Atom RPG". Fallout like, russian style. Wonderful game.

-"DOS" and "DOSII", best rpg games of today.

-"Stygian: Reign of the Old Ones". Not bad at all. Not without bugs. Not the best combat system. Still, there's something to it. Just don't lose your mind while playing the game!!




In the end of the day, nothing is better than the old "Fallout 1" and 2, and the magical "Arcanum".
Posted December 23, 2020
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Kerebron: Arcanum: of Steamworks and Magick Obscura
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MysterD: Severely underrated title.
Oh, yes. Even though RPG lovers always bring it up in discussions such as this, and despite the fact that it's currently sitting at #14 on GOG's list of "all-time" bestsellers, right between those other obscure gems, Diablo and Dungeon Keeper. Totally underrated. =)
Posted December 23, 2020
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AFnord: I'll have to disagree with you on the encounter design in DA:O, I think that's one of the games big weaknesses. There are good encounters, but so many of them feel repetitive, and that's in large due to how many enemies are functionally very similar. There's not a big difference between a darkspawn or a human.

When it comes to being an introduction to that general style if RPGs, I think Pillars of Eternity is more inspired. There's more variety between the enemies and the encounters, and the balance is better. Pillars is not as friendly to newcomers as DA:O, but ultimately I think it's a better game.
I think all RPGs of this type are filled with trash encounters to some degree, and I find a lot of DA:O's encounters to be much better than average. Like you'll go through a mini-dungeon and fight a few trash mobs before arriving at a final fight that is very well thought out and structured. There's a lot of youtube videos of people doing these fights in interesting ways. I think it stands out among RtwP games, which usually are 99% trash mobs, but agree to disagree.

Pillars of Eternity is a weird one. I loved it, it took that Baldur's Gate style and mixed it with the storytelling and quest design focus of a Fallout or whatever, but so many consider it boring and bland. I'd guess those are people looking for more tactical or character design depth, considering they're the same people who tend to praise Pathfinder Kingmaker. I side more with Pillars.

Which gets to a good question for the OP: what is your RPG priority? Story and quest design, combat and character building, or exploration? It's rare a game excels at all these things, you usually have to say something like "I'm in the mood for exploration, so I'll play X" to get the right game for your current mood.
Posted December 23, 2020
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IfYouHave2Ask: I'm currently looking for a new RPG to play. Hopefully someone can help me find the right one.

Here's a list of what I'm looking for in a game:
1. High replay value.
2. Different side quests or a branching main quest line. Possibly different endings or New Game Plus.
3. Open world or at least a game that is not completely linear.
4. Different party members and/or an extensive character creation mode. (Adds to replay value)
5. I'd prefer turn-based combat. If not turn-based then pausing during combat. I'd prefer the game not be real-time combat.
Also, I want the combat to have depth. Not just you encounter an enemy and your character does all the work as you watch and wait for it to end.

The setting doesn't matter. It could be fantasy or sci-fi or steampunk or whatever.

I grew up playing the Final Fantasy and Chrono Trigger/Cross games. I'm looking for something that will bring back some of that nostalgia. Although it doesn't have to be an older game. I'm currently playing Divinity: Original Sin and I think it's great.

The games I've been looking into include;
1. Dragon Age: Origins - seems similar to D:OS. Also high on many RPG lists.
2. Fallout 1 or 2 - I've played 3, 4 and NV. I know the original 2 are very different but I do like the setting and humor of the later games.
3. Expeditions: Conquistador
4. The Age of Decadence
5. Planescape: Torment
6. Baldur's Gate 1 or 2
7. Wasteland 2

Those are just a few. I haven't decided on one or any of them yet.

I'll take any and all suggestions. The only thing I'm not looking for are games like Witcher and Elder Scrolls. I enjoy those games but it's not what I'm trying to play right now.

Thank you anyone and everyone for your input.
Have you played Betrayal at Krondor? It's a game everyone should own.
Graphics are dated but it has a design style I really enjoy, especially the mechanics.

1. I find myself playing it repeatedly over the years because it is just fun.
2. There are side quests and a main storyline.
3. It is open world but encounters are limited to it's size, which there are many, no regenerating NPC's per chapter.
4. Five different playable characters in your group which varies chapter to chapter, your group moves as one,
characters have skills that can be focused on and increased.
5. Turned based combat, depth is based on whether you choose to focus on melee or archery for tanks, spells or melee
for caster, and strategize to prevent foes from escaping, thus losing any of their loot and the opportunity to raise
skills.

It is fantasy and no autosave so you need to save often or risk permadeath. There are scenarios where your group can die.
Expeditions, as you mentioned, is another one you may like which is a group turn based combat system.
Posted December 24, 2020
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AFnord: I'll have to disagree with you on the encounter design in DA:O, I think that's one of the games big weaknesses. There are good encounters, but so many of them feel repetitive, and that's in large due to how many enemies are functionally very similar. There's not a big difference between a darkspawn or a human.

When it comes to being an introduction to that general style if RPGs, I think Pillars of Eternity is more inspired. There's more variety between the enemies and the encounters, and the balance is better. Pillars is not as friendly to newcomers as DA:O, but ultimately I think it's a better game.
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StingingVelvet: I think all RPGs of this type are filled with trash encounters to some degree, and I find a lot of DA:O's encounters to be much better than average. Like you'll go through a mini-dungeon and fight a few trash mobs before arriving at a final fight that is very well thought out and structured. There's a lot of youtube videos of people doing these fights in interesting ways. I think it stands out among RtwP games, which usually are 99% trash mobs, but agree to disagree.
I think that DA:O does handle its trash fights a bit worse than many other games though, simply because they have a smaller pool of different enemy types to chose from. There's not really a meaningful difference between similar "classes" of enemies between the different enemy types. I do suspect that part of the problem is the structure of the game itself, they needed to make sure that you can beat the areas in any order, so they need to keep the scaling manageable Though I agree that it's not a problem unique to DA:O, games like the KOTOR series also suffer from the same problem (I like KOTOR as a whole, but it's not flawless).

But the fights against the games bosses and a few other major encounters, those are generally quite good in DA:O. There they could allow the fights to feel a bit more unique and mechanically complex.

And yeah, at the of the day it's still a matter of taste.

(Oh, and thanks for reminding me about Pathfinder Kingmaker, I really should make some time for that one)
Posted December 24, 2020
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Jorev: It is fantasy and no autosave so you need to save often or risk permadeath.
Doesn't that mean you can just reload if someone dies? (This is unlike Wizardry, where it's not as simple to do so. (But note that I always use save states or similar when playing Wizardry, unless I'm just playing around with the identify glitch.))


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AFnord: I think that DA:O does handle its trash fights a bit worse than many other games though, simply because they have a smaller pool of different enemy types to chose from.
I've seen examples that might be worse:
* In Dungeon Hack, there are only 3 monster types per level, and one of them is a boss monster that there's only one of on the level. (This can make some levels boring, while others can be obnoxiously filled with enemies that drain levels or instant kell, and there's no option to remove the instant killing enemies.)
* In Final Fantasy 6, there's one particular cave that's filled with undead. It starts with some smaller floors, but then there is a huge floor, and there are only 2 distinct random enemy types on the entire floor. (There are some scripted Ninja fights, but by far most of your fights are random encounters.) It doesn't help that this dungeon will disappear later, and there is a unique treasure that remains useful even late in the game that you can miss.
Post edited December 24, 2020 by dtgreene
Posted December 24, 2020
Although it wouldn't fit neatly into some of your criteria, I'd advise looking at Darklands. The quests are little more than errands (although it varies how you get them), but the mechanics of the game are so complex (or detailed) that you need extensive extra documentation to navigate everything. Replay value is high, you are free to wander as you see fit, character creation is quite detailed and profession oriented, and combat is real time with a pause.
Posted December 24, 2020
Besides the already mentioned Fallout 1 and 2 I‘d like to recommend Wizardry 8, which fits to all your points that you named. This is the only RPG I played more than once. You will need a lot of time to go through the really interesting story and have a lot of characters to choose from. If you have specific chars in your group they will start to get annoyed and tell you so.
I really like Wizardry 8, even with its faults. For me, it is the best RPG I have played.
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General discussionHelp me find a new RPG(54 posts)solved(54 posts)solved
(54 posts)solved