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General discussionGOG Mafia #73 - Soleanna's Supreme Guardians(1243 posts)(1243 posts)
(1243 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted August 20, 2021
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JoeSapphire: It looks to me like zfr's saying

"why didn't u claim when you thought you might have blocked a kill?"

and dedo's saying

"why would I claim when I thought you were mafia trying to get me to claim?"


which, if it were so, seems as though dedo really should have been telling us about how zfr was mafia and should die.

is that sense? I'm tired and reading is bread
No, that's not the sense.


The sense is "Why would I claim if I'm not certain I was the one who blocked the kill which would in turn mean that ZFR wasn't the one who made it which might mean he's innocent and if I claim and call him out for both of these things and he turns out to be Town I'm outing myself, him and letting the scum know there is yet another PR which is capable of thwarting their agenda".

That's the sense.


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Cadaver747: Dedo, you believe only dead Cops it seems. If only you could have considered the option of Town Bulletproof soaking the NK, super lucky Doctor or anything else besides your lucky hit on ZFR on N1 (for instance someone else's lucky hit besides the Doctor).
It's precisely because I considered there are a bunch of other possibilities I kept quiet back then but kept acting upon it from my own side.

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Cadaver747: And if you didn't believe the living Cop claiming ZFR is Town on D2, how would it change the possibility that you blocked Mafia 1 (ZFR) on N1, that Mafia 2 player did NK on N2 instead of Mafia 1 (it would make no sense for Mafia to do the NK with the same exact player if he reported to his buddies - Someone has blocked me!) and that ZFR is NOT an actual Godfather? I mean according to your logic blocking ZFR on N3 would be only reasonable, targeting Flub because he is less likely to be a Doctor (among your two scum candidates Catte and Flub).
I worked against what I would have done. If I'm Godfather and cleared I'd expect I'm in the clear now and can act freely. That's why I repeated the block. When that didn't happen my own logic wasn't working anymore and the Cop flip came up which meant Godfather or Town. I'd play it differently as Godfather so I decided against it. So Town from then on.

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Cadaver747: I mean according to your logic blocking ZFR on N3 would be only reasonable, targeting Flub because he is less likely to be a Doctor (among your two scum candidates Catte and Flub). Why did you think that Flub if he is your Mafia suspect could be a Town Doctor?
I targeted one of the three players I considered scum on N3. And I thought Catte might be the Doctor, not Flub but that wasn't based on anything other than gut feeling.

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Cadaver747: Why did you think that Flub if he is your Mafia suspect could be a Town Doctor?
Sorry, what? When did I say I thought Flub could be the Town Doctor so I'd go ahead and block him? My whole selection was deliberately trying to avoid people I'm not sure are not the Town Doctor. My choice was to block one of the three players I thought are the scum team. I skipped Wyrm as I thought he may pass the kill on someone else because he's afraid of another prevention or investigation that targets him as he was a good suspect from the Day. So it was between Catte and Flub. It was basically a coin flip and I went with Flub.


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ZFR: You're being obtuse on purpose now.
OK, discussion is over.


I'm not sure why we are still doing this. Get it over with. If there are 3 scum we lose. If there are 2 maybe the game can still be saved Tomorrow.
Posted August 20, 2021
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JoeSapphire: has it been explained why townzfr calls for blocker to claim when he knows he got blocked so blocker isn't going to have hit mafia?
Honestly? RB is usually a Mafia role, I didn't think there is a Town RB so I was mostly baiting what I thought might be a newbie Mafia Roleblocker. No one caught the bait. And also trying to see if I can get more info on why I was blocked. So yes, fishing in a way I guess.

Worst case I catch a Town RB in which case... ooops.



Incidentally:

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ZFR: A successful roleblocker should speak up now.
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GymHenson: Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat?!?

My response to this sort suggestion

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ZFR: Vote NL

Come at me, pussies.
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GymHenson: If I didn't know any better, I would say it's almost like you WANT to be suspected.
At this stage I got really scared that GH is the RB (I know he softclaimed Vanilla, but this is GH who might think it a good idea to lie to hide his PR).

------------------------------

And I stand by what I wrote. A Town RB should claim after no NK. Most games have 1 NK-stopper for Town if any. I rarely saw a game with 2, and I'm completely not buying it that this game has 3 (DOctor, Commuter RB) and a 4th one for the Neutral.

Most games have at most 1 NK-stopper. If no NK happened and youcan stop an NK, then you probably did.
Posted August 20, 2021
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dedoporno: Sorry, what? When did I say I thought Flub could be the Town Doctor so I'd go ahead and block him? My whole selection was deliberately trying to avoid people I'm not sure are not the Town Doctor. My choice was to block one of the three players I thought are the scum team. I skipped Wyrm as I thought he may pass the kill on someone else because he's afraid of another prevention or investigation that targets him as he was a good suspect from the Day. So it was between Catte and Flub. It was basically a coin flip and I went with Flub.
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dedoporno: Catte and Flub. I thought Flub is the less likely to be the Doctor so I went after him.
I mistook Flub and Catte names. I meant to say why did you think that Catte if he is your Mafia suspect could be a Town Doctor more likely than Flub?

It's 2:42 AM at my place and I've extremely sleepy.
Posted August 20, 2021
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Cadaver747: I mistook Flub and Catte names. I meant to say why did you think that Catte if he is your Mafia suspect could be a Town Doctor more likely than Flub?
No good reason. I had to choose one of the two and Catte has been DR Catte in the past so I chose Flub. That's it.
Posted August 20, 2021
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JoeSapphire: has it been explained why townzfr calls for blocker to claim when he knows he got blocked so blocker isn't going to have hit mafia?
Oh, and part of me hoped that it would dissuade the Blocker from blocking me again. "Would PR!ZFR ask for blocker to come out if he knew he was blocked? Probably not. Ergo, he's probably Vanilla, won't block again." Obviously that didn't work either (which made ascetic Neutral Lift a possibility too).
Posted August 20, 2021
D1 - NL

Possibilities: are limitless
Decision: let's block ZFR because why not, actually let's save him from any danger since I'm a Jailer not a Roleblocker

N1 - Dedo blocks ZFR
N1 - No NK

Possibilities:
1. Mafia didn't do the NK (technical reasons, out of good heart),
2. ZFR is Mafia who tried to implement the NK, my block saved the day
3. it was avoided by a random shot from a Town Doctor,
4. another Mafia player (not ZFR) failed the NK on Bulletproof,
5. on active Commuter or
6. on any other *evasive role*
Decision: ZFR is Mafia because of N1 results, let's block him again.

D2 - Micro claimed Cop and ZFR among Town
D2 - GH lynched

Possibilities:
1. ZFR is Town,
2. ZFR is Mafia Godfather,
3. Micro was Redirected by Mafia,
4. Micro is a lying Mafia (there is no Town Cop),
5. Micro is a lying Mafia (there is a Town Cop who keeps his/her mouth shut)
Decision: ZFR is Godfather, let's block him anyway.

N2 - Dedo blocks ZFR
N2 - Micro NKed

Possibilities:
1. ZFR is Town, I blocked the wrong guy
2. ZFR is Mafia Godfather, I blocked his NK attempt on N1 but another Mafia player performed NK on N2
Decision: ZFR is Town, let's try not block the Doctor (let's see that might be)

D3 - Lift lynched

Possibilities: are limitless minus dead players
Decision: ZFR is Town, let's try not block the Doctor (let's see that might be), hmm Catte and Flub are on my scum list, let's block Flub because Catte could be a Doctor more likely than Flub.

N3 - Dedo blocks Flub
N3 - Book NKed

Please correct me if I did some mistakes again.

Going to bed now.
Posted August 20, 2021
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ZFR: Yes, I read what I write, which is why I said a Roleblocker may or may not claim (I would).

Doctors/Jailers.. etc should never claim in such a situation.

Your original problem with my statement wasn't that I asked RB to claim, but that I haven't asked anyone else.

If you think RB shouldn't claim, then sure. But don't hold it against me that I didn't ask Doctor or anyone else to claim.
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dedoporno: Wait, I think we have a misunderstanding here. I don't have a problem that didn't call out the rest. I have a problem with you calling out the Roleblocker in particular and at all. Why would you do that if you believe there might be a Town Roleblocker in the game and you risk them getting outed for no good reason (also knowing you're likely going to get outed as well in the process as you know you got blocked)? If you don't believe they are in the game why are you playing under the assumption the game setup is what you think it is just because you saw some post for a previous version that Pooka told everyone is changing somehow? This is what I'm holding against you.
OK, I missed this post, hence the misunderstanding.

I take back the "you're being obtuse on purpose", but everything else I wrote stands.
Posted August 20, 2021
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Cadaver747: Decision: ZFR might be Mafia because of N1 results, let's block him again.
Bolded my fix. Other than that pretty much how it went down.


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ZFR: OK, I missed this post, hence the misunderstanding.

I take back the "you're being obtuse on purpose", but everything else I wrote stands.
Cool.
Posted August 20, 2021
EBWOP:

N2 - Dedo blocks ZFR
N2 - Micro NKed

Possibilities:
1. ZFR is Town, I blocked the wrong guy
2. ZFR is Mafia Godfather, I blocked his NK attempt on N1 but another Mafia player performed NK on N2
3. ZFR is Mafia Godfather, he had nothing to do with NK attempt on N1 and N2 <NEW>
Decision: ZFR is Town, let's try not to block the Doctor (let's see who that might be)

D3 - Lift lynched

Possibilities: are limitless minus dead players
Decision: ZFR is Town, let's try not to block the Doctor (let's see who that might be), hmm Catte and Flub are on my scum list, let's block Flub because Catte could be a Doctor more likely than Flub.

N3 - Dedo blocks Flub
N3 - Book NKed

Please correct me if I did some mistakes again.
Posted August 20, 2021
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Cadaver747: Decision: ZFR might be Mafia because of N1 results, let's block him again.
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dedoporno: Bolded my fix. Other than that pretty much how it went down.
Yes, *might be* of course, that's exactly what I meant. Semantics is very important, I agree.
Thank you, I think I get your way of perceiving things. The problem is it's still not enough for me to decided whether on you're Mafia (or even a Neutral) or Town. I will not bother you again, unless you provide some more interesting insights.

I want to hear more from Leoric and Dogmaus.

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Leoric_AKA_Leo: I think I shouldn't vote and start some wagon right now. I always voted for the wrong person and now I have no confidence. I'll wait for you people to wake up and see if I'm correct.
Sorry, you are going to wait for what exactly? For us to tell you that No Voting is correct in your case?
Posted August 20, 2021
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my name is supyreor catte: Your N1 block choice of course. Your argument was "I thought I was protecting him and blocking him!". It makes it a lot easier to justify that way.
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dedoporno: I don't lament my N1 block choice one bit. Yes, I thought I was getting more out of it than I actually did but I suspected ZFR on D1 for his abnormal behavior so he was still a legit target.
I'd just like to post this quote (emphasis mine):

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dedoporno: I blocked you on Nights 1 and 2. I chose you on N1 as I originally mistook my role as a Jailer and thought you were a good balance between a N1 victim and potential scum considering the different vibe you had about you during D2.
I have thoughts, but I'd like to see what, if anything you have to say first?
Posted August 20, 2021
@Dedoprono
I just noticed the difference between D2 and D3, the cop's dead confirmed his claim. But block ZFR could tell you what? Were you going to block ZFR until fish was cleared?
Don't you think the "ZFR is godfather" and "The cop and ZFR both scum" possibility was very low in D2?

@Cadaver @ZFR
I'm happy I didn't rush to vote according to my unreliable read. It turns out dedo did suspected ZFR and his action make some sense to me.
I just upset you people voted too fast last day, and I don't want to start some "wagon" to let scums easily jump on.What if we pushed Bookwyrm until he claimed? Could the scenario be different?
I'm not blaming you people, I know the scenario could be even worse. God only know.
I just want to say don't be so hurry. Just like you @Cadaver, haven't vote right now.

@Cadaver
You can get nothing but my sincerity. I'm sadly a vanilla town.

"We" means me and my personas :P
Posted August 20, 2021
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Cadaver747: I want to hear more from Leoric and Dogmaus.
Why you keep focusing on newbie? In my point of view, it's more likely to get a reasonable reaction to Dedo's claim from an experienced player.

Well if you think a newbie scum is more likely to make mistake in their posts...I think you're right! I'll post more so you people have more things to work with.

I'm still waiting and trying to read more. There's still 4 days to go. And I just read a dedo's post said if we make a mistake this round and there are 3 scums, we'll loose!
Posted August 20, 2021
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Cadaver747: Why can't you believe Book was a Doctor?
He said ZFR/Joe are scum. And I suspected Bookwyrm from D1 and I mentioned a lot in my posts. There are even absurd reasons that ZFR pointed out. I think bookwyrm made very little effort to clear himself (and if that was IRL stuff I completely understand) but somehow we just go with Lift yesterday.
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Cadaver747: Is it the only reason you can see here?
Yes...please tell me more? ;)
Posted August 20, 2021
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ZFR: ------------------------------

And I stand by what I wrote. A Town RB should claim after no NK. Most games have 1 NK-stopper for Town if any. I rarely saw a game with 2, and I'm completely not buying it that this game has 3 (DOctor, Commuter RB) and a 4th one for the Neutral.

Most games have at most 1 NK-stopper. If no NK happened and youcan stop an NK, then you probably did.
Agreed. A town RB should claim after no NK Day One.
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This is my favourite topic
Community
General discussionGOG Mafia #73 - Soleanna's Supreme Guardians(1243 posts)(1243 posts)
(1243 posts)