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Many people have compared this game to Skyrim, but in many ways I feel a better analogy is Baldur's Gate 2. Not in terms of gameplay mechanics (obviously), but in terms of scope, polish, and storytelling quality relative to their time. When I first played it, BG 2's main plot impressed me, but I was also floored by just how huge the game was while maintaining a high level of polish. Every sidequest felt important to the characters in one way or another, and many had different conclusions depending on players' choices. On top of that the game took you to a variety of different locations that went a long way towards making the game feel epic in scope. Every time I sat down to play it I felt as if I was experiencing an interactive novel or TV series. For the longest time it was my favorite game and I thought no modern game could possibly surpass its immensity due to how technically challenging and expensive 3D environments are to create...

That is until I played TW3. Like BG 2 before it, TW3 has set a benchmark for story driven RPGs that probably won't be surpassed, let alone equaled, for years to come.

Agree or disagree? Thoughts and comments welcome!
Post edited July 01, 2016 by mchartman
Absolutely disagree. Why? Because comparing TW3 to BG2 is like comparing your favourite wine to your favourite beer. Now be clear, I'm a huge fan of both games, so I'm not deriding either. I just think that such non-alike comparisons are utterly meaningless.
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Hickory: Absolutely disagree. Why? Because comparing TW3 to BG2 is like comparing your favourite wine to your favourite beer. Now be clear, I'm a huge fan of both games, so I'm not deriding either. I just think that such non-alike comparisons are utterly meaningless.
Maybe I wasn't clear. I didn't mean that one is better than the other, simply that TW3 is the best RPG I've played since BG 2.
Eh, I wouldn't say so. Baldur's Gate and Infinity Engine games in general were huge because they opened up this obscure, overly complicated RPG genre to wider audience by streamlined mechanics and simple interface combined with DnD ruleset which was still quite popular (yes, there were other DnD games before it, but not as user friendly). On one hand, you can blame them for being at the beginning of massive streamlining of RPG genre, heralded by Bioware. On the other hand, you can thank them for being at the beginning of direly needed streamlining of RPG genre.

Witcher 3 doesn't really share that level of importance, nor is it in any way comparative mechanically. It's good, but I don't think that alone is a sufficient basis for comparison. The reason why you see people comparing it to Skyrim is because it's open world, but I'd say the game from ye olden days which is closest to Witcher 3 would probably be Gothic.
Post edited July 01, 2016 by Fenixp
OK, "the old ones" had been in need of a perfectly done plot line. And although visuals in BG had been better then in "The Bards Tale" from 1985, the story had to be a lot more then what you get in some of the more recent titles.

W3 on the other hand: you can spend a lot of time in Velen (true for most any other region of W3), just looking around, being amazed at the visuals, you do not really need the story, just go sightseeing.
And, I really think that if CDPR would not have had some books to fall back on, their plot writing might have been a lot less interesting then what you find in BG, or even the older ones.

So the success of W3 would not have been possible without our actual machines and the basics of some already present stories. The tech behind the machines (and some talented 3D fuzzies) gave us a level of detail that simply could not be done in these older years - and if you look at the success that a game like "Grimrock" seems to get, makes me wonder what will happen next, both in visuals and plotwise.

To the question at hand - no, I do not think that W3 will be remembered in a way that BG is. I still can remember parts of "The Bards Tale", while some things seen/done in Novigrad or on Skellige already are slipping my mind.
Post edited July 01, 2016 by zerebrush
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Fenixp: Eh, I wouldn't say so. Baldur's Gate and Infinity Engine games in general were huge because they opened up this obscure, overly complicated RPG genre to wider audience by streamlined mechanics and simple interface combined with DnD ruleset which was still quite popular (yes, there were other DnD games before it, but not as user friendly). On one hand, you can blame them for being at the beginning of massive streamlining of RPG genre, heralded by Bioware. On the other hand, you can thank them for being at the beginning of direly needed streamlining of RPG genre.

Witcher 3 doesn't really share that level of importance, nor is it in any way comparative mechanically. It's good, but I don't think that alone is a sufficient basis for comparison. The reason why you see people comparing it to Skyrim is because it's open world, but I'd say the game from ye olden days which is closest to Witcher 3 would probably be Gothic.
Witcher 3's gameplay is absolutely inspired by Gothic (I believe some of the developers mentioned that). Whenever I enter a cave or building in the game, it instantly recalls Gothic's engine for me, which also streamed environments instead of putting a load screen in your face.

That being said, I wasn't talking about mechanics or historical importance (the only thing we can say about TW3 at this point is that it's the most successful European-and especially Polish-RPG ever (Gothic is sadly overlooked in the U.S.). I was simply talking about having a massive scope while retaining the intimacy and quality of writing that is typically reserved for much smaller, more linear games.
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zerebrush: OK, "the old ones" had been in need of a perfectly done plot line. And although visuals in BG had been better then in "The Bards Tale" from 1985, the story had to be a lot more then what you get in some of the more recent titles.

W3 on the other hand: you can spend a lot of time in Velen (true for most any other region of W3), just looking around, being amazed at the visuals, you do not really need the story, just go sightseeing.
And, I really think that if CDPR would not have had some books to fall back on, their plot writing might have been a lot less interesting then what you find in BG, or even the older ones.

So the success of W3 would not have been possible without our actual machines and the basics of some already present stories. The tech behind the machines (and some talented 3D fuzzies) gave us a level of detail that simply could not be done in these older years - and if you look at the success that a game like "Grimrock" seems to get, makes me wonder what will happen next, both in visuals and plotwise.

To the question at hand - no, I do not think that W3 will be remembered in a way that BG is. I still can remember parts of "The Bards Tale", while some things seen/done in Novigrad or on Skellige already are slipping my mind.
I'm not sure I follow. BG was set in the Forgotten Realms setting, designed mostly by Ed Greenwood. Like CDRP, Bioware's BG series borrowed heavily from stories by Greenwood and R.A. Salvatore, and of course introduced new characters, timelines, etc. The Witcher games are essentially sequels to the books from which they get their setting.

It's hard to say how TW3 will be looked at 20 years from now, but I for one will never forget the first time I entered Novigrad. It was the first time I was truly impressed (and overwhelmed) by a city in a game. The questlines utilized the city's setting very well imo.
Post edited July 02, 2016 by mchartman
To be honest, I haven't played BG1 or BG2, nor do I intend to. I tried the first couple of minutes of BG1 two years ago and got bored very quickly. However, I did finish Planescape: Torment one year ago and was amazed by its writing and plot, I was hooked the first few minutes I played it. BG1 in comparison seemed rather classic fantays, which might have been the reason I got bored. (I don't mean that classic fantasy is inherently bad, but I prefered PS:T odd setting and style). So, I might not be the best person to compare BG and W3, since I lack knowledge in the former, but I have more experience in the latter.

I believe it is possible that W3 will be remembered for a long time, because many people, including me, claim W3 ruined open world games for them. It was the only game where open world didn't get boring.
Granted, there are better written games - PS:T for instance - but imho W3 (and its expansions) were very well written.

That being said - and as included in the title - I believe every generation has its special games and movies. Replicating the feeling they have had when playing/watching them is almost impossible (which is why for many people the old Star Wars Trilogy will always be the best), because they had the right age and it was the perfect time for them.

I think W3 advanced the open world RPG genre, by showing exactly how to do open world (A task where DA3 fails).
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Azulath: To be honest, I haven't played BG1 or BG2, nor do I intend to. I tried the first couple of minutes of BG1 two years ago and got bored very quickly. However, I did finish Planescape: Torment one year ago and was amazed by its writing and plot, I was hooked the first few minutes I played it. BG1 in comparison seemed rather classic fantays, which might have been the reason I got bored. (I don't mean that classic fantasy is inherently bad, but I prefered PS:T odd setting and style). So, I might not be the best person to compare BG and W3, since I lack knowledge in the former, but I have more experience in the latter.

I believe it is possible that W3 will be remembered for a long time, because many people, including me, claim W3 ruined open world games for them. It was the only game where open world didn't get boring.
Granted, there are better written games - PS:T for instance - but imho W3 (and its expansions) were very well written.

That being said - and as included in the title - I believe every generation has its special games and movies. Replicating the feeling they have had when playing/watching them is almost impossible (which is why for many people the old Star Wars Trilogy will always be the best), because they had the right age and it was the perfect time for them.

I think W3 advanced the open world RPG genre, by showing exactly how to do open world (A task where DA3 fails).
BG1 hasn't aged nearly as well as 2 has. BG2 has a storyline that is mostly independent of the first game's, and it's not hard to figure out what happened. I HIGHLY recommend at least giving BG2 a go. It's traditional high fantasy, but it has much sharper writing than the 1st, and the characters are highly endearing.

PS:T is fantastic, and it's writing is hard to beat, but it also has the feel of an interactive novel, so it's difficult to compare its quality of writing to TW3.

Agreed. TW3 shows how to put a narrative heavy game in an open world setting properly. Fancy technology and graphics help, but ultimately it's up to the developers to put the effort and heart into a project to make it truly great.
Hey guys,

I played BG1 and all the Infinity Engine games - I got so inspired, I started playing Pen&Paper back in those days, too. Yeah, this games brought me some real life friends ;-)

Nevermind, I finished BG1 in six weeks and, besides BG2 added them to my personal "Ultimate Top5 Games", mainly based on the emotions I was feeling while playing, finishing and "remembering".

Yesterday I added TW3 to that list, too.

Two more places free ;-)

Kind regards
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mchartman: BG2 has a storyline that is mostly independent of the first game's, and it's not hard to figure out what happened. I HIGHLY recommend at least giving BG2 a go.
Noted - I'll do just that when I've some spare time (and BG2 is on some kind of sale)
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mchartman: PS:T is fantastic, and it's writing is hard to beat, but it also has the feel of an interactive novel, so it's difficult to compare its quality of writing to TW3.
Also true, in terms of pure gameplay PS:T sucked to some degree. You basically had to max willpower, no matter the class afaik.
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mchartman: BG2 has a storyline that is mostly independent of the first game's, and it's not hard to figure out what happened. I HIGHLY recommend at least giving BG2 a go.
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Azulath: Noted - I'll do just that when I've some spare time (and BG2 is on some kind of sale)
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mchartman: PS:T is fantastic, and it's writing is hard to beat, but it also has the feel of an interactive novel, so it's difficult to compare its quality of writing to TW3.
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Azulath: Also true, in terms of pure gameplay PS:T sucked to some degree. You basically had to max willpower, no matter the class afaik.
Being a mage in PS:T is the most fun you'll get out of combat due to the nifty spell effects, but it also lends itself to a more thoughtful, dialogue-heavy approach (which is of course the game's main strength). I'll never understand why the base combat mechanics were made clunkier in PS:T when it's built on the same engine as BG.
The Witcher 3 is this generations Starfox.

Think I nailed that perfectly...