Who argued about that in this thread?

What point did I make in the first post that is based on anything other than fact?

You fail to look at anything objectively. All you and your off topic friends have done, is reiterate the same recycled predictable insults and arguments because somebody said something you didn't like about a game you enjoy - so have a tantrum, get over it, and try to actually counter the claims I presented. You know why nobody is trying? Because it's true, you can't counter it.

Comparing it to TW1 again and again, even after it's been addressed multiple times, is hilarious. No matter how you try to spin it TW1 which almost everyone has pointed out as being an easy game - is still more complex. Nothing you say can change that.

Anyway, what am I using logic for? It's obvious an immature forum fight is all you're after. This is why children should be banned from using forums. If I end up buying the game on my PS3 yet I have the same problems, does it make me a whiny elitist console gamer, or are you ready to grow up and realise your broken arguments are flawed?

Again: How many times does this has to happen to other games before it sinks in? Playing the devils advocate is fine, but you're sending the message that you're happy with a dumbed down game, it will only get dumber from here. Then again, perhaps I misjudged who the fans of TW1 really were.

Just as one of the previous posters I've been playing crpgs since time immemorial it seems. Stuff on the Amiga, hard-core heavyweights like Wizardry and I was there when Bioware single-handedly resurrected it all with Baldur's Gate.

Good times, good times.

Since then development times seem to have shriveled, budgets have exploded and marketing has become an utter pile of horseshit.

I can understand that the amount of trouble and cost to develop a game that meets even passing standards nowadays has become staggering, especially if you want to develop the necessary tools yourself. Even more so if you're aiming for a triple-a title and yet there was a reasonable hope and outright pretense on behalf of cd projekt to do it properly. And by properly I mean properly for the PC.

I would love to keep this rant clean of the more common shout match regarding PC vs. consoles, but alas, this isn't possible anymore. Every major title is developed, budgeted and chained to a multi-plattform release. The last really big thing not to go down that road was Star Craft II and they didn't care because apparently it is enough to own South Korea body and soul (kidding).

From a business point of view that is quite understandable, but it doesn't change the fact that the driving force and focus of such a multi-platform development has to be the lowest common denominator, which generally speaking isn't especially prone to allow for excellence. Throw in the mix that the hardware catered to is now about 5 years old and has a fundamental different controller and you're in quite a pickle.

And here is my gripe: already, even now without an official announcement of a console port, it is quite apparent that The Witcher 2 has been developed with it in mind. I refuse to believe that the handling screw ups for mouse and keyboard (menus, inventory, qte, etc.) are not the result of compromises for future ports to consoles. I cannot speak for the way the story was handled, that is to say if it was cut short because it wouldn't fit on a single disc for a console, but it seems more likely that that was a question of money in general: a company has to publish a game to make money and development time is costly.

There is a lot to like in TW2. It has a well developed world, it has a truly European feel to it and it is quite refreshing to see adult content not only in the amount of gore per minute. It looks great, the quests are intriguing, but I can't help being annoyed by design decisions, which hamper my game experience for the sake of another medium.

Perhaps we should be content, nay, happy that we were served first at least. No shitty port, months after the fact. A few compromises here and there and just the regular slew of bugs now inherent to any PC release.

But somehow I was hoping for more.

Jaquar, I have nothing to say other than I completely agree.

It's about the MONEY, that's why. Not to sound like a troll or conspiracy theorist, but look at the numbers.
Console games outsell PC games by a large margin.
Console games have a much larger market.
Console games are much more difficult to pirate.
Creating two versions of the same game is expensive and time consuming.

Don't get me wrong, I do agree with you that lately games are created first for console, second for PC. I can add to your list too- no native DIrectX 11 (the Xbox is DX9), the pop-up screen to select weapons and magic, the weird keyboard and mouse mappings...

But if you were a developer, and you're going to write a new game engine, why limit yourself to a small market of PC gamers? Why not make it available to the hundreds of millions of console gamers as well?
Unfortunately for PC gamers, the PC has far passed the current generation consoles in performance, so we're stuck with whatever the console can support. This will change once the next generation of consoles comes out, but even then, those will last another 10+ years and the PC will quickly pass that generation of consoles as well.

The adage is "calling it as i see it". Think on that for a while, maybe. People disagreeing with you doesn't automatically make you the righteous underdog, it means your opinion is different than that of others. Simple as that.

Your argument about "dumbed down combat" has been countered numerous times. Maybe it's you who doesn't see things objective, because the new challenge in combat isn't for you.

Also your complaints about external graphics settings, achievements (hello steam?), controller support and hardware specific problems (lol at the keyboard thing, seriously that's sth important for you!?) are nitpicky at best...

Sure it's about money, they're a company. But let's take that out of the equation for a second and think of developers as already rich people who love making games. If you made a game solely for that reason, wouldn't your priority still be to reach as many people as possible? If, and I don't think TW2 in its current state is one, they made a console port that doesn't betray THEIR vision of the game, in what single fucking way is that a bad thing?


I just don't see how this became demonized so badly. How multiplatform is automatically associated with "selling out". If I made a product, my first priority would be to reach as many people as possible. Money is great, but if you want to amass lots of it you don't go into game development, there's far more profitable fields you can be in as a programmer / artist / animator / designer. No, people who are in the industry love games, do the best they can and want as many people as possible to see their game. And people who don't consider those intentions need to step into the real world... although I do believe that it's mostly the youngins screaming into their pillows and hammering away at forums. It's the vocal minority anyway, so, whatever.


(This isn't necessarily directed at you specifically, but you provided a good point of entry.)

I'll throw in a small observation of mine on this topic.

I don't think it is necessarily "consolization" in regard to menus and the like. I, and many others I know, have their gaming PC hooked up to a nice big HDTV. Whether I am using KBM or gamepad, I want relatively large menus and text so I can read and navigate from my comfy seat. So I see it more as… HDTVization?

Also, I really like switching back and forth between gamepad and KBM several times in a session - keeps you on your toes!

It would have been cool to include the different stances once more. They could have done it like in Heavenly Sword.

Really bad video quality, but you'll get the idea: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AhEl-JNDBmU

Another example: http://www.gametrailers.com/video/e3-2007-heavenly-sword/21364

I fail to see how this is true, you're basing you complexity argument on the different fighting styles being removed, but they haven't, they've simple been changed to fit the new combat system. For example quick style is now LMB or light attacks, strong style is RMB or heavy attacks. Group style has been adapted into things like 360 parry and manoeuvring around your opponents so that you're only taking on one person at a time.

Besides which those styles really didn't add much complexity to TW1, even if you didn't know what styles responded to certain monster, all you need do is try a style see if you land hits properly and bingo you've found what that monster is weak against (plus you could usually guess by it's size).

I enjoyed TW1's combat system but if you look at them objectively TW2's combat system is more complex.

Not only from the game menu. Even more because

1 - Why I can not play with the arrows, as in all PC exclusive games and 99% of the games?


2 - Why can not reverse the mouse as in all games?


3 -Why do we need to fix this complicated tweaks us as if we were banned?


4 -Why there are black bars at 16:10, 4:3 and 5:4 if it's a PC exclusive game?


5 - Why I can not remove savegames from the menu of the game?

Please , try for example Gothic 2 to compare . Or a today game , Fable 3 , Two Worlds 2 or Fallout las Vegas , multiplataform games . The lacks of TW2 in the interface are a record in the world of PC gaming . Is the number one, I never see something like this . Please, compare "all in one" the interface / UI of TW2 with the rest of PC games, even multiplataform games .

I have tried playing Gothic 2 from the pack of GOG to pass the time XD . I want to play with the arrows but tweak the system is complicated and is reset. I use tweaks , mods and I even use mods in many games, but this can not be forced to do to play the game normally,

Could play with WASD, but it's not what I expect from a game PC exclusive or a decent PC game . I hope reset and probe the keys, as in 99% of video games. I play completely in dark, with a projector and the best way for me is with arrows. In a PC monitor with light I play with WASD game perfectly and usually , but I prefer play in the proyector . I have a gamepad from the 360 , but is the old model of the 360 and I need a new gamepad to connet with the PC . And is not my prefered choice , I prefer play with mouse and keyboard

There are many people who are left handed - Tomas Gop is left handed ;) - and use the arrows, or many other people who for one reason or another remapped the keys. Not only the arrows.

The number of people who play with inverted mouse is even more important - this is easy to fix in the ini files . Even the number of people with 4:3 and 5:4 . Many people with this problems are not playing , are waiting better solutions to the problems .They are not in the forums because are totally frustrated .

Either the game is the most crass console port of the story or is completely unfinished. The people are fooled very easily with the graphics. Or maybe things have changed so you do not need a keyboard and mouse to play a PC RPG and it is best to buy a gamepad and play it a few feet of a HDTV. Even so , the game looks unfinished.

It seems like the famous phrase of Martin Niemoller

First they came for those who played on the arrows. I said nothing because he played in WASD

Then they came for those who invested the mouse. I said nothing because I did not invest the mouse

Then they came for the monitors playing in 16:10, 4:3 and 5:4. I said nothing because I had a 16:9 monitor

Then they came for those who played with keyboard and mouse. I said nothing because I had a gamepad

Then they came for all PC gamers. I said nothing because I had a console.

Finally then they came for all gamers and they took me too. And there was nobody else he could do anything.

Really is a tipical history of central europe and the universe of Sapkowski XD . Sorry for me english

OMG .

DO YOU EVEN KNOW HOW COMPLEXED GAMES NOWADAY COMPARED TO GAMES A DECADE AGO?

DO YOU KNOW HOW HARD IT IS TO FIND AND FIX A SINGLE BUG ON A 500 LINES OF CODE???

DUDE!

I agree with this. I like sitting in my comfy chair playing on my 46" TV. I want to be able to read the text from that distance. Don't matter to me if it using a controller or kbm. I for one, appreciate the gamepad support since, it allows me to enjoy the game more.

As far as being all butthurt about them developing this game so that they "could" port it to consoles without having to redevelop it entirely is just smart business. And this is a business. How much pro bono work have you done for your employer recently?

Wait, I forgot, they LIED to you, when they said they were developing it for PC. And it doesn't meet YOUR expectations. Well then vote with your wallet. I for one, am very satisfied with my purchase and am enjoying the game quite a bit.

So, tl;dr get over youtself. And a big +1 to CD Projekt for this game.

Why do you have to bash this amazing game?

theres a difference between bashing and finding flaws that you can see being done better