If it helps any, Thief 2 does cut down on some of the frustrations (imo). Though I'm not crazy about that one kidnapping level.

There's your problem. Thief requires concentration, and is best played after dark with earphones,and with wife, kids and pets sleeping.

It probably is.

This part confused me as well... the first time I played it, I tried to avoid Marus. I mean, it's a stealth game after all! I didn't know he was friendly and that I had to talk to him.

If you're having trouble triggering the conversation with Marus, it might be worth re-loading a save from before you left the cathedral building. If memory serves, he's right outside and talking to him should be the first thing you do. I also thought that once you talk to him, the mission objectives updated, but I could be wrong. But if I'm right, that means that successfully triggering the conversation will actually update the objectives, so everything you need to do will be written down for you.

Also, what difficulty setting are you playing on? This affects what exactly you have to do for Marus. If you're on one of the higher settings I think it's possible to turn it down for just that mission if you're getting frustrated by the little tasks you have to perform. Unfortunately changing difficulty settings means you have to re-start the mission.

I'm just playing on normal. I guess I'm going to have to do the whole stupid thing over.

You will have to do alot of fetching around for various items and I will try to not spoil it as much as possible, and then carry 2 dead hammeriets to there graves which will tell you secrets, and all this leads to the spirit giving the 2 dead hammers a funeral, which the spirit leads you to the way out. And as you know getting "The Eye" is the easy part.

Do you have a saved game from before you left the Cathedral, but after you got the Eye? Then you could avoid redoing the whole thing. I'm not a very hard-core Thief player -- I compulsively save after just about every action I take. I think one day I will challenge myself to complete levels without saving and loading, but not right now. I'm also not hard-core enough to try to beat the game in one sitting/weekend/etc. I routinely step away for months at a time if I'm too frustrated.

I'm playing RTTC right now, so I understand some of your frustration. Once I started playing it and realized it was nothing but zombies and haunts, my enthusiasm really died. After I read this thread -- I had accidentally spoiled myself by leaving the Cathedral before getting the Eye, so I already had an idea that I would have to make things and visit a grave -- and Googling how to kill a haunt I started enjoying it. Don't forget that much of the story comes from what you read and conversations you overhear. Thief is best played alone without any distractions.

Also, speaking as someone who almost but not quite finished Thief 2 before playing Thief 1, I have found the first one more frustrating than the second. As far as I remember (this was several years ago), I only had to consult a walkthrough once for the second game and that was for the final level. There was some kind of crazy jumping sequence you have to go through that I could never master, so I decided that the end game really wasn't *that* important. But for the first game I have had to use a walkthrough at least twice to find the location of the final objective, gave up and skipped a level (Bonehoard) because I couldn't deal with it anymore, and use google to figure out how to deal with stuff.

After a while after sneaking around and getting bored with waiting for patrols that when I started to run around to do whatever the spirit wanted me to do. This section wasnt so bad and seems like a masterpiece compared to the Thieves Guild level when you think about it. the 2 bodies you are looking for are in the Cathedral itself. 1 In the Basement and one in the attic.

In Return to the Cathedral, I killed almost everything that could be killed just to make exploration easier. Hammer Haunts can be backstabbed for an instant death. Also, try to use some mines or fire arrows to kill two enemies at once. Try to knockout the zombies in corners or areas where you don't absolutely have to walk. I found the central area of the cathedral to be the most problematic. Kill everything there :)

Try to stick it out. You're so close to the end. If it's any consolation, the last two missions don't require as much careful sneaking. In fact, the final mission may be the easiest & shortest. I literally ran through those last two missions backstabbing almost everything in my path. Make sure you save often with hard saves & quicksaves.

Edit: Thieves' Guild took me 2 hours & 48 minutes :( The safe gave me a little problem but it was finding another piece of loot that killed. I had to finally give up and use a walkthrough. I hate that. It's like admitting defeat. I also have the problem of navigating the missions.

That's been part of my problem. I've never used walkthroughs this much. It's like I just can't play this game without them.

I just skipped the last levels and just watched the cut scenes. Do I feel bad about it? Not at all. I'll give The Metal Age a shot. Hopefully that won't just be an exercise in frustration like most of Gold has been. Gold has been uninstalled.

I'm sorry you didn't enjoy Thief Gold. I really do think you'll like Metal Age better, though. I know it probably sounds like we're just a bunch of fans that really want you to like the games so we keep pushing you to keep playing them, but Metal Age definitely has a different feel and I think it will be more like the parts of Thief Gold that you actually liked.

I actually played Metal Age first (a mistake, because it meant I was confused by the excellent story, since I lacked the background from the first game) and then later went back to play the original Thief (although not the Gold version). I really enjoyed both games but I can understand your distaste for certain missions in the first game... I didn't enjoy the "horror" missions as much as the more thieving-focused ones and if I hadn't already played the second game I probably would have had a lot more trouble with them.

Having said that, I did still like Thief Gold a lot, so it could be that the Thief games simply aren't for you. But I do urge you to try Metal Age before you give up on them completely.

I love the feel of the thieving missions in Thief Gold. Assassins is actually one of my favorite missions in any game I've played. The controls give you freedom to do a lot more than current games, as well. Having the ability to lean forward adds a lot to the gameplay, in my opinion. I just hated the horror levels. It's like suddenly I was just running from point A to point B with monsters that are impossible to kill without gear following behind. It's like it wasn't even the same game.

The Metal age seems better to me so far. The pure thieving it what I like. As far as I know, there are robots or something in this game. That, in my opinion, fits better with the atmosphere.

*Possible Spoiler*
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Aren't you supposed to have night vision or something in The Metal Age because or the events at the end of The Dark Project?

In answer to your question:
POTENTIAL SPOILER
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Garret has a new eye that can zoom but no night vision. You know...I played The Metal Age before but it's been a while. I'm playing it now with the hope of actually finishing it this time, and I also thought that he had a kind of night vision. Strange. I don't know where I got that from. It could be from when I read that increasing the brightness in the game could be considered Garret's night vision but you could do that in the1st game too.