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The sword is always there, you can find it at your first visit of the Mainhall.
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DF1871: The sword is always there, you can find it at your first visit of the Mainhall.
Oh well, then I didn't pay attention for a longer time.
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SeduceMePlz: Stronghold = broken.
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ast486: Yeah I've gotta agree there.
I don't recall reading anything about it in the patch notes, but since installing patch 1.04, losses to bandits have decreased dramatically... Could be a coincidence, but perhaps it was a silent fix? I've collected taxes twice since patching, and both times lost only a very small amount despite having dismissed all of the hirelings (because they weren't preventing taxes from being stolen).

Anyone else notice similar improvement post-patch?
Not fixed after all: Collected taxes and lost 1/3 to bandits at 35 prestige, 35 security. Must be mostly luck-based. :|
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ast486: Yeah I've gotta agree there.
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SeduceMePlz: I don't recall reading anything about it in the patch notes, but since installing patch 1.04, losses to bandits have decreased dramatically... Could be a coincidence, but perhaps it was a silent fix? I've collected taxes twice since patching, and both times lost only a very small amount despite having dismissed all of the hirelings (because they weren't preventing taxes from being stolen).

Anyone else notice similar improvement post-patch?
I was losing less even after the first patch I got for this game... 1.03 I think.
I have security >40 and only lose small amounts now.
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M4xw0lf: I have security >40 and only lose small amounts now.
I've had security over 40 and still lost large amounts at times. Losses seem to be in large part random.

Another thing: Hirelings being paid on a set schedule while taxes are only collected when completing quests... wtf.
Post edited April 24, 2015 by SeduceMePlz
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SeduceMePlz: Another thing: Hirelings being paid on a set schedule while taxes are only collected when completing quests... wtf.
If you are a contractor, you get paid when you get paid. But your bills come every month. Sounds like normal to me.
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alcaray: If you are a contractor, you get paid when you get paid. But your bills come every month. Sounds like normal to me.
Sure, and taxes are collected on a schedule irl. But we're not talking irl here, we're talking game systems. And this is a poor one.

It results in a situation where it's actually most efficient to dismiss your hirelings when you're away exploring a map but not completing quests. If you're on a longer quest, your hirelings may be paid 2 or 3 times before you collect taxes, meaning you actually take a net loss. But if you complete a series of short quests, you might get 2 or 3 tax returns from a single hireling pay period. Essentially, you can game the system to produce a decent net gain, or you can leave it to chance and risk losses.

I'm not trying to slam you personally, but I'm tired of seeing fans of Obsidian blindly defending poor design. Legitimate criticism will make their games better. If you really want to support Obsidian, praise them for what they do well, and objectively criticize what they do poorly.
Asking the player - err, no I mean: demanding/permitting the player to manage a budget is an important part of a lot of games. If you did a survey, I'd bet that that over a third of the games that GOG sells, expect you to save funds for expected and unexpected expenses, and to choose between different things you might spend on. Certainly, almost all rpgs, and managerials, and rts do, many wargames, some adventures and actions and fps. I don't get why you think this is a failing on Obsidian's part.

If you remove aspects of planning for the future, then you are left with a game that is not fun.
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alcaray: manage a budget
That's the thing: You aren't managing a budget. Not really. You're paying hirelings on a set schedule to prevent banditry (which they don't seem to do very well) and to defend your stronghold (currently bugged, with hirelings becoming hostile after battles; also unnecessary since the player can return to defend the stronghold themselves), while tax income is produced essentially randomly. Budgeting would involve managing a mostly predictable stream of income efficiently and accounting for both predictable and random expenses.

I've found the single most effective strategy to be simply dismissing all hirelings and reloading a quicksave when a particularly big loss occurs after completing a quest. Because of that huge random element mentioned earlier, a simple redo often produces dramatically different results.

Trust me, I don't mind good budget management systems. I've played, enjoyed, and beaten games like Alpha Centauri, Galactic Civilizations II, etc. I'm hoping that we'll get a patch that significantly improves the stronghold after essential bugfixes are completed (broken/awful talents are a much higher priority imo).
Post edited April 25, 2015 by SeduceMePlz
You need to keep enough cash in your inventory to make your payroll, right? I just don't get your complaint.
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alcaray: manage a budget
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SeduceMePlz: That's the thing: You aren't managing a budget. Not really. You're paying hirelings on a set schedule to prevent banditry (which they don't seem to do very well) and to defend your stronghold (currently bugged, with hirelings becoming hostile after battles; also unnecessary since the player can return to defend the stronghold themselves), while tax income is produced essentially randomly. Budgeting would involve managing a mostly predictable stream of income efficiently and accounting for both predictable and random expenses.

I've found the single most effective strategy to be simply dismissing all hirelings and reloading a quicksave when a particularly big loss occurs after completing a quest. Because of that huge random element mentioned earlier, a simple redo often produces dramatically different results.

Trust me, I don't mind good budget management systems. I've played, enjoyed, and beaten games like Alpha Centauri, Galactic Civilizations II, etc. I'm hoping that we'll get a patch that significantly improves the stronghold after essential bugfixes are completed (broken/awful talents are a much higher priority imo).
I think you reload is exagerated. yes, as we previously noted, the amount earned seem to be essentially random as well the amount of the bandits steal, however always is near to the full cost of the hirelings.
Yet, the main benefit of the hirelings is when you are fighting the mini-battles or leaving them in automatic, you can ignore the hirelings if you do all the battles.

And, are you sure the payment day is based on game time? I was sure was based by turn.
Post edited April 25, 2015 by Belsirk
Yes but how long is a turn? And whose turn is it? Does time even really exist?
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kmh12177: Yes but how long is a turn? And whose turn is it? Does time even really exist?
The turn are measured in quests completions.