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Pathfinder: KingmakerInEffect's Guide V2(1002 posts)(1002 posts)
(1002 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted April 09, 2020
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Cirnovant: anyway this whole experiment made me excited for wrath of the righteous since i know what char im making (and i never really used druids and i always played sorcs as mc). hopefully we get more shapeshifting focused druid archetype like skinshaper too.
Thing is feyspeaker is better at shifting than DotTW despite being 0.5BAB, Just by the virtue of having mirror. If the next game doesn't have a convenient way of adding mirror to classes like wand crafting it'd be all the same again.

And if they don't fix natural enhancement dice unlimited stacking all unarmed things will be garbage.
Post edited April 09, 2020 by InEffect
Posted April 09, 2020
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Cirnovant: anyway this whole experiment made me excited for wrath of the righteous since i know what char im making (and i never really used druids and i always played sorcs as mc). hopefully we get more shapeshifting focused druid archetype like skinshaper too.
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InEffect: Thing is feyspeaker is better at shifting than DotTW despite being 0.5BAB, Just by the virtue of having mirror. If the next game doesn't have a convenient way of adding mirror to classes like wand crafting it'd be all the same again.

And if they don't fix natural enhancement dice unlimited stacking all unarmed things will be garbage.
yeah and they haven't even bothered to fix crane style / wing yet.. hasnt this thing existed since launch?

have they said anything about wand&scroll crafting? im hoping it gets in but i doubt it..
Posted April 09, 2020
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Cirnovant: yeah and they haven't even bothered to fix crane style / wing yet.. hasnt this thing existed since launch?

have they said anything about wand&scroll crafting? im hoping it gets in but i doubt it..
I don't follow it one bit. I'm a downder like that when it comes to games. Even if I preorder something I do it last day before release and I literally don't care about anything surrounding the game till it's released. And then it's either yay or nay since I don't have any expectations going in. I'm pretty much the marketing guy's nightmare.

But yeah if there are no accessible mirror image somehow the builds will stay the same more or less. I have no idea why they haven't addressed it when fixing weapon distribution(which they also failed at).
Crane feats I can understand as those are crutches for armor users, actually. Monk builds don't really have to have those.
Post edited April 09, 2020 by InEffect
Posted April 10, 2020
if i want to play non-magic non-shield 2-h bastard sword tanker, which build should i pick?
Posted April 10, 2020
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dengandos: if i want to play non-magic non-shield 2-h bastard sword tanker, which build should i pick?
If you don't count alchemy as magic(which it technically isn't) - would be vivisectionist. If you do... I guess LG irori deliverer would be ok if only for the AC ramp. Or regular fighter 20. There isn't much one can do with such limitations and tanking wouldn't be the name I'd call it. Ok-ish for low difficulty, yes?
Post edited April 10, 2020 by InEffect
Posted April 11, 2020
May I ask what the core differences are between Abyssal Scion, Damaging Bard and Melee Sorc?

Seems like they all end up being in melee with a greataxe and somewhat similiar self buffing.

I'm getting midgame fatigue and it gets hard for me to push through everytime. I realized it's mostly due to me just self buffing and sending in characters with little to no skill pressing. Was wondering if there is something a bit more combat active skill wise that can also cast.
Post edited April 11, 2020 by -Rimiu-
Posted April 11, 2020
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-Rimiu-: May I ask what the core differences are between Abyssal Scion, Damaging Bard and Melee Sorc?

Seems like they all end up being in melee with a greataxe and somewhat similiar self buffing.

I'm getting midgame fatigue and it gets hard for me to push through everytime. I realized it's mostly due to me just self buffing and sending in characters with little to no skill pressing. Was wondering if there is something a bit more combat active skill wise that can also cast.
They are indeed similar. Abyssal is the most damage as he'd have bane and axiomatic on top of other goodies. Melee sorc stacks AC better and has more utility casting. Bard... Needs to be rebuilt into Bard12/DD4/SF1/Slayer3 or 2HF3, but as such is a great skill monkey.
Post edited April 11, 2020 by InEffect
Posted April 11, 2020
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InEffect: ...
Thank you. Do both Abyssal and Sorc work as Tank/off-tank? I assume yes but Abyssal takes a while longer to get started?

Also may I ask which build you personally enjoyed more? If you played them.


Thank you again for your help. I appreciate it a lot.
Posted April 11, 2020
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-Rimiu-: Thank you. Do both Abyssal and Sorc work as Tank/off-tank? I assume yes but Abyssal takes a while longer to get started?

Also may I ask which build you personally enjoyed more? If you played them.

Thank you again for your help. I appreciate it a lot.
Abyssal is bit fiddly to start on unfair, but will be fine before too long and can reach impressive damage numbers. Sorc can tank reasonably well from the outset, although there is no magic bullet to remove level1-5 unfair suffer. Bard is pretty much exactly like sorc, except earlygame might be real pita without the shield spell... So I'd probably just went solo for a while to ramp the levels faster and to mitigate the issue that way.
I'd say of the three sorc would be the easiest to get off the ground.
Post edited April 11, 2020 by InEffect
Posted April 11, 2020
Thank you! I have one last question regarding your strategy.

For act 1 how do you manage trickery? Some of your MC builds don't have it. Do you usually get 1 point on mc anyways and then do a reload cheese fiesta? Ratnook Hill traps are alone 1.5k-2k XP I think whicht helps out quite a bit to boost your lvl early. The Verdant Chamber Trap in act 2 is also a huge 8k XP drop(Which probably is impossible with 1 point).
Post edited April 11, 2020 by -Rimiu-
Posted April 11, 2020
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-Rimiu-: Thank you! I have one last question regarding your strategy.

For act 1 how do you manage trickery? Some of your MC builds don't have it. Do you usually get 1 point on mc anyways and then do a reload cheese fiesta? Ratnook Hill traps are alone 1.5k-2k XP I think whicht helps out quite a bit to boost your lvl early. The Verdant Chamber Trap in act 2 is also a huge 8k XP drop(Which probably is impossible with 1 point).
If I don't have it - I don't have it. Just means a tiny bit more random encounters in A1 to reach 5 before sycamore and that you will do trolls at lvl 8 instead of 9. but your party is of higher level. It evens out.and trickery exp is negligible enough that I share it after trolls anyway. Val can take the trap job in A1 and then there is jubi and sacred ekun to take the mantle
Post edited April 11, 2020 by InEffect
Posted April 11, 2020
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InEffect: ...
I usually waited when I didn't have it on mc until I got Octavia to revisit everything and then send her away. But that was because I didn't have Trickery on anyone at all. After act 1 Jubi joins relatively quick as you said.

That being said Octavias AT ranged legerdemain is quite good for less reload suffering as it counts as its own entity so you have unlimited retrys but that also means you have to take Octavia. It's also super annoying when it bugs out and the hands are running away for some reason...

Speaking of bugs. Valeries song casting bugs out for me when I try to cycle songs. I really wonder why this never got fixed.
Post edited April 11, 2020 by -Rimiu-
Posted April 11, 2020
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-Rimiu-: Speaking of bugs. Valeries song casting bugs out for me when I try to cycle songs. I really wonder why this never got fixed.
Happens when she starts full action and then tries to sing. Instead queue some standard action thing like a spell and click the song. You can then cancel it and do your action. It's less buggy once you get it to quick action with singing plate, but said lockups still might happen occasionally.
Post edited April 11, 2020 by InEffect
Posted April 11, 2020
Yo,

First of all, thank you for all the posts, I've been looking through them and slowly starting to understand the game systems better. That being said, I'm still torn on many things so I decided to ask directly, as it's been almost a week since I got the game and haven't started playing it.

I've been going back and forth, trying to make an MC modelled after the Blackguard of Naggarond from Warhammer Fantasy (heavily armored tanky halberd user).
Do you have any build you might recommend? I was thinking a STR based Lawful Evil Elven Glaive/Fauchard Two-Handed Fighter with a focus on Dazzling Display and the Frightened/Shaken/Intimidate line of feats. Weapon/Crit Focus and what not, but I'm not sure how to make him tanky (as much as someone using a Reach weapon might need, if only for flavour).

Wanted to post a picture of the Warh unit in question but it seems I'm not allowed to attach pictures or post links...

Also tyvm in advance.
Post edited April 11, 2020 by Vuiet
Posted April 11, 2020
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Vuiet: Yo,

First of all, thank you for all the posts, I've been looking through them and slowly starting to understand the game systems better. That being said, I'm still torn on many things so I decided to ask directly, as it's been almost a week since I got the game and haven't started playing it.

I've been going back and forth, trying to make an MC modelled after the Blackguard of Naggarond from Warhammer Fantasy (heavily armored tanky halberd user).
Do you have any build you might recommend? I was thinking a STR based Lawful Evil Elven Glaive/Fauchard Two-Handed Fighter with a focus on Dazzling Display and the Frightened/Shaken/Intimidate line of feats. Weapon/Crit Focus and what not, but I'm not sure how to make him tanky (as much as someone using a Reach weapon might need, if only for flavour).

Wanted to post a picture of the Warh unit in question but it seems I'm not allowed to attach pictures or post links...

Also tyvm in advance.
Fauchards are fine as those sport serpent prince. As for most armor users I'd advice going melee sorc. Something like fighter1/Sorc5/DD4/EK10 or Fighter1/Monk1/Sorc4/DD4/EK19 for better tempo. That thing can actually stack AC reasonably high reasonably fast. And will be a comfortable run.

Another thing you can do is go STR Vivi as that will work. Something simple like Fighter1/Vivi16/SLayer3 would work.

Shaken is best achieved from dirge from bard8 or as a SL8 sorc spell frightful aspect. Shatter is a staple for everyone.

After glance at wiki page I'd say Str armored vivi would be the closest pick. Don't think those dudes are above sneak attacks and combat-enhancing drugs.
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Pathfinder: KingmakerInEffect's Guide V2(1002 posts)(1002 posts)
(1002 posts)