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Icewind Dale serieslooking for the 6th member(22 posts)(22 posts)
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Posted May 31, 2014
Like I said, I made a point of not actually resting more. I rested when it got dark, not when I ran out of spells. Therefore I made sure not to run out of spells. It's a quirk, but I enjoy playing the game that way. Feels more immersive.

I'll have to try an all-melee party one of these days. Just to see how the gameplay will change. I suspect I would find it more boring, though, since melee guys don't get a lot of options in Icewind Dale. It'd definitely be boring in IWD1, though less so in IWD2. Fighter, barbarian, paladin, fighter/rogue, bard, monk maybe?
Posted June 01, 2014
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Jason_the_Iguana: Like I said, I made a point of not actually resting more. I rested when it got dark, not when I ran out of spells. Therefore I made sure not to run out of spells. It's a quirk, but I enjoy playing the game that way. Feels more immersive.

I'll have to try an all-melee party one of these days. Just to see how the gameplay will change. I suspect I would find it more boring, though, since melee guys don't get a lot of options in Icewind Dale. It'd definitely be boring in IWD1, though less so in IWD2. Fighter, barbarian, paladin, fighter/rogue, bard, monk maybe?
An all melee party without a healer will be a) dogmeat or b) resort to cheese like resting in the previous area for umpteen days at a time. You will need ranged weapons and halflings with 5 pips in missile weapon proficiency rock :)

My "We dun need no steenkin spellcaster" party playthrough was for 2 reasons. 1) To play with a severe party imbalance and 2) put more value on potions. A lot of potions in BG and IWD are useless, it was mostly healing potions and cure poison / disease that get used, mage and cleric spells could cover the rest. However, without access to spells, I was hording potions like oil of speed, fire damage potions (especially in troll heavy areas), potions of clarity (essential against umber hulks) and such so get me through the tough areas (and they were lifesavers too). On higher difficulties, I might actually keep the strength potions that grant 20+ str but they weren't needed on normal difficulty. That was my first playthrough where i ever considered potions to be a factor in my tactics and it was a fun playthough for that reason alone. However, some areas were really easy and other were insanely hard, I'm hoping bumping up the difficulty a notch will make some of the easy parts more challanging. It was an interesting playthough but as you said before, you like to have 3 mages in BG so this kind of playthrough might not be your thing.

An all mage playthrough with the limited scrolls and squishy characters might also make an interesting playthrough. Still, Imbalanced parties were a bit more fun than i expected :). Not sure if I could do this in BG2 though, without access to breach, I might end up spending more time looking at the loading screen than actually playing the game.
Posted June 01, 2014
You don't need breach. Really, it's overrated. People solo BG2 with berserker fighters and the like. I myself have played the first two chapters with a party that only had a bard in it for arcane casters. (Though I did have a cleric.)

There are three kinds of defences mages use. Stoneskin, which can be bashed through by just attacking a lot. Mantle/improved Mantle, which can be bypassed by using a more powerful magic weapon. And Protection from Magic Weapons which can be bypassed... by making sure your fighters have a non-magical weapon. Wizards still die to a normal sword. (Doesn't work against Liches, though)

Then there are area-effect spells (not an option for a fighter party, but potions of firebreath and such can work) and weapons like the Holy Avenger or Arrows of Dispelling that can break defences. Those green protection scrolls can work a charm for the toughest fights, and potions can give your guys enough magic resistance to laugh off anything mages do. (For a paladin, getting 100% resistance is a breeze with potions and the holy avenger.)

Edit: Oh, and you can easily make a trip to Watcher's Keep and buy/loot a bunch of wands that cast breach if you really need them. The first level isn't too tough as long as you do not activate the guardians.

Or you can just tough it out. Enemy mages generally won't kill your party in the four rounds it takes for these spells to wear off. Just spread your guys out so only one or two tough ones get hit by the area effect magics. Then hit them as soon as you hear the noise of their mantle dropping. Typically, all you have to deal with is the odd meteor shower and symbol of fear. Still, might be a good idea to spend the cash you save on scrolls on a nice rod of resurrection in the Adventurer's Mart.

Finally, you can solve the problem pro-actively: have your rogue open up hostilities with a nice 5X damage backstab. You only need to breach defences if the enemy has time to put them up. I loves seeing the enemy's contingency spells firing -after- their body hits the floor.

As for potions, I try to use them quite heavily in both BG and Icewind Dale. Potions in these games are incredibly powerful. Sure, a mage can cast Haste on the whole party. But an oil of speed will last five times as long. A potion of Giant Strength will also last long enough for an entire dungeon level, and is -far- more effective than spells of the same type.
Post edited June 01, 2014 by Jason_the_Iguana
Posted June 01, 2014
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Jason_the_Iguana: You don't need breach. Really, it's overrated. People solo BG2 with berserker fighters and the like. I myself have played the first two chapters with a party that only had a bard in it for arcane casters. (Though I did have a cleric.)

There are three kinds of defences mages use. Stoneskin, which can be bashed through by just attacking a lot. Mantle/improved Mantle, which can be bypassed by using a more powerful magic weapon. And Protection from Magic Weapons which can be bypassed... by making sure your fighters have a non-magical weapon. Wizards still die to a normal sword. (Doesn't work against Liches, though)

Then there are area-effect spells (not an option for a fighter party, but potions of firebreath and such can work) and weapons like the Holy Avenger or Arrows of Dispelling that can break defences. Those green protection scrolls can work a charm for the toughest fights, and potions can give your guys enough magic resistance to laugh off anything mages do. (For a paladin, getting 100% resistance is a breeze with potions and the holy avenger.)

Edit: Oh, and you can easily make a trip to Watcher's Keep and buy/loot a bunch of wands that cast breach if you really need them. The first level isn't too tough as long as you do not activate the guardians.

Or you can just tough it out. Enemy mages generally won't kill your party in the four rounds it takes for these spells to wear off. Just spread your guys out so only one or two tough ones get hit by the area effect magics. Then hit them as soon as you hear the noise of their mantle dropping. Typically, all you have to deal with is the odd meteor shower and symbol of fear. Still, might be a good idea to spend the cash you save on scrolls on a nice rod of resurrection in the Adventurer's Mart.

Finally, you can solve the problem pro-actively: have your rogue open up hostilities with a nice 5X damage backstab. You only need to breach defences if the enemy has time to put them up. I loves seeing the enemy's contingency spells firing -after- their body hits the floor.

As for potions, I try to use them quite heavily in both BG and Icewind Dale. Potions in these games are incredibly powerful. Sure, a mage can cast Haste on the whole party. But an oil of speed will last five times as long. A potion of Giant Strength will also last long enough for an entire dungeon level, and is -far- more effective than spells of the same type.
Next time I play through BG2, I'll keep what you said in mind about the mage protections. Carrying a few normal weapons just to counter protection from magical weapons isn't something I considered because in BG2, inventory space is at a premium. It's also one of the reasons I didn't hang on to potions that can be duplicated by spells. When you also carry healing potions, those potion bags and inventory slots fill up quickly. In addition with regards to IWD, I usually needed the inventory space for arrows because in Dragon's Eye when you kill the high archer for Messenger of SSeth, I keep that bow until the end of the game but it just chews though ammo and there are no everlast arrows like in BG2 and IWD2. Compounding the arrow problem, there is usually at least one other bow user also firing away meaning making more space for more arrows a priority.

However, I realize this all comes down to chosen tactics. I might have to do a no ranged weapon playthough sometime and see how potions can compliment magic and melee ;). It's gonna be strange though cos my wizards are always in the back slinging away. For that playthrough, maybe I'll take a fighter / mage or two as my main casters as straight single class mages will just be dogmeat (and I don't want to resort to "rest every second to replenish spells" kinda cheese either). Also, no ranged weapons at the end of TOTLM? That's gonna be hell. :(
Posted June 01, 2014
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IwubCheeze: In addition with regards to IWD, I usually needed the inventory space for arrows because in Dragon's Eye when you kill the high archer for Messenger of SSeth, I keep that bow until the end of the game but it just chews though ammo and there are no everlast arrows like in BG2 and IWD2. Compounding the arrow problem, there is usually at least one other bow user also firing away meaning making more space for more arrows a priority.
This is one of the reasons I mod the game for infinite item stacks.
Posted June 01, 2014
You can carry weapons in fighters' spare quickslots. Admittedly, that won't work for a class like a fighter-mage, but others do fine.

Another solution: pop by Watcher's Keep and buy a potion case/arrow belt. (I forget if the merchant sells it or if you can find it on the first floor, but either way you're golden if the infinite ammo stack feels like too much of an exploit to you.)

Doesn't work in Icewind Dale 1 or Baldur's Gate 1 unless you mod them, admittedly. (Though I think the IWD expansion adds some such items) I still remember playing Baldur's Gate 1 for the first time, entering Baldur's Gate and talking to a bard who sang a song about a foolish party of adventurers who dropped all their arrows to be able to carry more loot... moments after I'd done just that to carry all the loot from the Cloakwood Mines. Had a good laugh at my own expense there.
Posted June 02, 2014
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IwubCheeze: In addition with regards to IWD, I usually needed the inventory space for arrows because in Dragon's Eye when you kill the high archer for Messenger of SSeth, I keep that bow until the end of the game but it just chews though ammo and there are no everlast arrows like in BG2 and IWD2. Compounding the arrow problem, there is usually at least one other bow user also firing away meaning making more space for more arrows a priority.
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Coelocanth: This is one of the reasons I mod the game for infinite item stacks.
That's something I considered doing but I need to conquer the purist in me first. Some mods are great but other mods tend to add things that are either a hit or a miss which is another reason why I don't mess around with them too much. For example, I don't like the idea of adding banter to IWD characters because IWD is first and foremost a combat oriented game. Still, I'm sure after taking a course in guilt management, I'll be able to handle a mod like that but i'd rather the stacks just be larger, not infinate :). Still though, carrying 12 rings shouldn't take up the same amount of space as 12 suits of full plate mail so it happens the other way round too ;)

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Jason_the_Iguana: You can carry weapons in fighters' spare quickslots. Admittedly, that won't work for a class like a fighter-mage, but others do fine.

Another solution: pop by Watcher's Keep and buy a potion case/arrow belt. (I forget if the merchant sells it or if you can find it on the first floor, but either way you're golden if the infinite ammo stack feels like too much of an exploit to you.)

Doesn't work in Icewind Dale 1 or Baldur's Gate 1 unless you mod them, admittedly. (Though I think the IWD expansion adds some such items) I still remember playing Baldur's Gate 1 for the first time, entering Baldur's Gate and talking to a bard who sang a song about a foolish party of adventurers who dropped all their arrows to be able to carry more loot... moments after I'd done just that to carry all the loot from the Cloakwood Mines. Had a good laugh at my own expense there.
My characters tend to have an array of weapons for any given situation. Usually it's 2 melee weapons with different damage types (or different status effects) and a ranged weapon. There go all my quick weapon slots :(

I did pick up the ammo case in Watcher's Keep but by that time, only 2 characters were using missile weapons. In BG, missile weapons just weren't as good as two handed or duel wielded weapons. Still, my inventory was always full from all the loot pick ups. Next playthrough, I'm definately dropping all those weapon components in BG2:SoA

I found a mod for IWD that adds an ammo belt but I haven't tried it yet.
Post edited June 02, 2014 by IwubCheeze
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Icewind Dale serieslooking for the 6th member(22 posts)(22 posts)
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