Hi,

I have some questions about the Gog version of the Heroes Chronicles collection. Please forgive any mistakes in posting, as I don't post a lot.

I was reading the forum to check on a strange issue with these games (more on that later) and noticed several very disturbing posts about the Gog version of these games, most significantly that some of the later titles are inferior versions and implied that they may not work right (I think it said starting with the 4th game). So my most important question before I invest much time into playing these: Do they all work right, or are there problems? In other words, has anyone played all of them successfully without running into problems?

Specifically, it said they were cracked/pirated (!!!) versions in order to avoid the CD verifications, and that some of the later ones used an inferior version of the cracks. I don't know what makes one crack/pirated version better than another, but I don't want to get part way through any of them only to find out it won't run at all, or it crashes a lot, or game content is missing, or some other problem of that sort.

One reason I was looking on the forums is that even though the original versions of these games are from the US, it seems to be using a localized version with different spellings and so I thought perhaps I could configure it to use a different region or had somehow downloaded the wrong one or something ("artifact" spelled "artefect" and such). I don't care about the localized spellings themselves, but what I do care about is that if one thing is different, it could mean other things could also be different (such as something being censored or some such; I've read that some countries did just that with some other games such as Fallout 2). I'd vastly prefer to play the original versions (although since localized versions exist, one would think they should also be provided for the customers who would prefer to use them).

The other reason I was looking on the forums is that several manuals are missing. I already paid for the download of the collection a while back, but I am a collector and, although I can't get the physical versions I'd really prefer (except for the first one which I bought many years ago), the next best thing is scans of as much as possible, at the very least all of the manuals, but most of them are missing. I read in some posts that they aren't very different from each other (and some of the differing intros were presented in those posts), and I already have played all of the original Heroes 3 games (base game and the 2 expansions), so definitely already know how to play the game, plus I already have the physical copy of the first game's manual, but the manuals are still important to me for the collector and experience reasons; they add to the experience to at least be able to look through them, cover art and intro's and such. One of the posts had a link to some of the manuals, but I'm not sure which ones because the link is broken. As I've already paid for a download of this game and therefore have a legal right to ALL of the manuals, can someone please provide me with the scans of the missing manuals or make a suggestion as to how those of us who paid for the download of the game can obtain these missing manuals?

Lastly, not a question, but rather a comment that I feel compelled to make: While I have no problem with Gog over this issue (I assume this is not their fault), I am extremely disturbed by the circumstances that have caused them to end up using pirated versions and having missing manuals; specifically, I would have to suspect that whomever is the current license holder requiring Gog to pay them (3d0?) has not properly supplied Gog the materials for the games (what other reason would there be?). They are ethically (maybe not legally, but most certainly ethically) to provide ALL materials to Gog so they don't have to resort to using pirated versions and can provide scans of ALL of the manuals (as well as all localized versions, or certainly at the very least the original US versions). I don't know if Gog paid them a lump sum for the rights or pays royalties on each sold download, but any license holder who is unwilling to provide these materials (reducing Gog to using pirated, localized versions with an incomplete set of manuals) doesn't ethically deserve even one cent. Even so, maybe it would be a bit more reasonable if the original development staff employees got some royalties, but I highly doubt that (I've never received royalties for any of the software that I've worked on). I've heard some companies claim that they no longer have a copy of the products, but I have reason to suspect that is untrue (just an excuse), plus then it is their ethical responsibility to obtain copies on ebay or somewhere, or even arrange to borrow them from a collector who owns them (for purposes of copying/scanning the content). Otherwise, the game should be public domain, and if Gog even sold them, the price would reflect only any "value added" in terms of digging up the content themselves, testing, and so on. Anyway, I should clarify that this point is a comment, not a question, and I'm not interested in a debate about it (although discussions/clarifications are fine), just wanted to provide feedback (although I do not know if Gog employees read their forums).

I played the first game (from disk) and enjoyed it tremendously (and personally, I think the core H3 game and its 2 expansions are the best strategy games that I've ever played). While I'd vastly prefer physical copies, I was still delighted to find that I could get the other 7 games here. However, I do not want to play any badly broken/incomplete games, as that would ruin the experience for me, and, for ethical reasons, would regret having indirectly paid some license holder even one cent to do nothing more than sit around and collect royalties from Gog.

Anyway, as for my questions (particularly the main one about all the games being playable), any help would be appreciated - thanks

I never heard about the Chronicles being pirated versions. They may use a no-CD crack, though.

I've never had any problems with them, and I've played all but the last one. But you are right in them being inferior, but only compared to other HoMM 3 games. Each Chronicle use a limited selection of factions and units. Also, they are aimed at newbies and are no challenge for a HoMM veteran.

And they are not directly compatible with the HD mod either. Although with some fiddling you can play them as custom campaigns, and enjoy all the ease of use benefits of the HD mod.

Thanks for your reply, I really appreciate it. It is very good to know that most of them seem to work and I would think that it is likely that the last one will also work based on the others having worked.

By "inferior", I was actually referring to the particular copy of the games that Gog has on their site, not the quality of the games themselves. The post I mentioned said that something about the crack/hack/pirated-version/whatever was not as good as that used in the earlier games and that there were better ones they could have used instead. So what I meant was an "inferior" copy given whatever they used for the crack/whatever. I did notice in having played the first game from my disk exactly what you said and agree with you about it being too easy. But I've really enjoyed Heroes 3 tremendously (best strategy game I've ever played, in fact) so it was still great to play a new campaign and I'm looking forwards to the rest of them.

Experience: I have played about half of the chronicles games.

-3DO was defunct for years before GOG was even founded.

-As Petrus said, the chronicles games provide virtually no challenge, so be aware of that. The story of the Rampart campaign played up how threatening the final foe was, but my only challenge was uncovering enough of the map so I could see a path to her and then I promptly kicked her teeth in.

-Be advised that some of them are unstable (generating a crash to desktop), so saving every turn or two is a good idea. Thankfully, they boot quickly, and some have fewer stability problems than others.

Take them for what they are: very easy and linear H3 campaigns.

Thanks for your response, I really appreciate it

(Unfortunately, I had to leave my computer for a few minutes, came back and finished my reply here, and when I hit "post my message" it NEVER POSTED (I'm assuming something timed out). That would mean that I have lost all my work typing in the first version of my reply, which I unfortunately forgot to copy before I submitted it. Therefore, I'm going to try again, but should mention that if the first version eventually shows up , I apologize for any confusion in there being two responses.)

3d0: Thanks, I appreciate that clarification, and that is good to know. I knew NWC went out of business long ago, but I thought maybe there was a chance 3d0 was still in business which is why I used them as an example. However, I didn't know for sure, so that's all mentioning them was about: just an example. I guess what I was saying is that whomever owns the license now has an ethical responsibility to provide Gog with all materials related to the game, otherwise that license holder company don't really deserve one cent of royalties or other payment (ethically speaking). It is highly unethical of that license holder to not only make Gog go out and do the work to find the materials for the game, but to make them resort to using pirated/cracked/whatever versions. Further, if that license holder provided a real, legitimate copy, it would probably also be far more stable. Someone in another post suggested that Gog should provide ISO's (for their game in general). THAT would be a great way to resolve issues like this one because then the CD check would work properly, assuming it didn't look for something weird on the disk that couldn't be replicated by burning an ISO to disk. If that worked, no cracked/pirated version would be necessary.

Crashes: That is good to know, thanks. That is unfortunate. But it would explain what that other post meant when it said some of the pirated versions were inferior. That said, maybe it could be at least partially be due to the problem with music in some of the Heroes 3 - based games with music and multi-core CPU's. I first ran into this with AB (from the original AB disk), but the latest patch for that fixed it. Unfortunately, SoD had the problem even WITH the latest patch (and SoD is the newer expansion, so it was strange), so I ended up just turning the music in the game off and listening to something else, which prevented the crashing. The first Heroes Chronicles (also from disk) also had this problem and I solved it the same way (turning off the music). So it wouldn't surprise me if this was at least part of the crashing problem in some of the other Heroes Chronicles games. I actually do usually save every turn (I ended up with that habit after I played those really difficult AB maps :) ), but it is still unfortunate if some of these may not be stable.

The game itself: Thanks. Heroes 3 was the best strategy game I have ever played and so I'm just looking forwards to playing more content (that said, I agree with you about it being too easy, as I did notice that when I played the first one, which I own on disk). My concerns are about the versions of the games that are available on Gog (so I didn't get part-way through playing the rest of the series before I suddenly ran into any significant problems with the Gog versions). It sounds like despite some possible problems, I can still proceed in playing them without running into too many of them.

Interesting bit about music. I always turn off music, and I don't think Chronicles ever crashed on me.

If you want a really good HoMM 3 experience, the best user made maps are far superior to Chronicles or the RoE campaign.

HoMM 3 (and 2) definitely has great user made content. I've played most of the noteworthy ones released before Shadow of Death (the rest are on my to do list), and these are IMO the best one:

Titanic Pride, Angelic Pride and Devilish Pride. XL maps with great exploration and hero synergy. The earliest masterpieces.

Goldheart More story driven, but still very good.

The Lord of War Epic war map. Very good.

Bug Hunt Much content in medium map

Sleeper Lots to explore, tough enemies.

Corruption and Hail to the King Very good despite excessive story telling.

Reavers of the North Epic map set in viking age Europe where the Norse gods exist.

Sander's Folly Masterpiece despite extreme amounts of story telling.

Redbeak's Revenge Very nice. Quite hard and "busy" (be prepated to be attacked from many directions).

Shar's War. Very linear, extreme, even nauseating levels of bad fan fiction level story telling, but still enjoyable and quite challenging.


Noteworthy story driven RPG like maps (not really my cup of tea): Dead Forest and the sequel Arundel.

I can add to the list:

Ringing of Victory - two stories in one.
Fall and Rise of the Sharai - tough Fortress map.
Running with the Devil - old story, new perspective. >:)
Lord of Fend - again, two heroes, two fronts.