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General discussion (archive)Witcher 1 and 2 request(201 posts)(201 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted May 19, 2011
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BrianX: Yeesh, people throw out the word 'Troll' all the time now...

So, using your logic, I would be 'repressed' if I was offended at someone putting a baby in a microwave or 'repressed' if I was offended at someone raping a woman? Granted those are crazy scenarios, but guess what, they have actually happened. I understand reality, but when you talk about having 'reality' in a VIDEO-GAME, that is when you lose me!

Breaking news: Video-games are NOT real life, no matter how close they try to get. Just because you throw in some useless sex scenes and profanity does not make it more like 'reality.' In fact, it can RUIN the immersion factor if used poorly. Again, I AGREE with you that it comes down to taste, but surely there are STANDARDS for taste and for poor taste. You can't say that all food is good, because some foods will kill you. All uses of nudity and bad language are not good, because it all depends on context.

And I don't know about you, but I don't remember Sting having a sex encounter with a witch back in the 80s. Yeah, I agree that MTV and other media venues go too far, but I don't remember seeing videos in the 80s on MTV that had full nudity (unless they were 'special' videos that came on after midnight like that one Prodigy video).

Anyways, I am not sure you have good taste. How do you even KNOW you have good taste? How do you gauge it yourself? In my opinion I thought they could have designed those Adult elements much better and maybe in the future there will be options for the user to tone those things down without having to download a MOD. Toning it down doesn't mean that the rest of the higher-quality material is obliterated, not at all, I think W1 had a fantastic setting, characters, etc, etc.

But you are right, no matter how much I make an argument that W1 used its more adult themes poorly and in bad taste, it will come down to the individual to really decide if it matches their tastes or not. I'm just sad because, in my opinion, I see an awesome plate of baby back ribs with a small duck turd on top and I can't remove the turd :(
Killing children and raping women are a part of human nature, but they are a part of our nature that society has deemed unacceptable, even illegal. Swearing, sex and nudity are not. You may think them unacceptable, but you are not society as a whole.

No, video games are not real life, but just like movies, they try to represent the fantastical in a realistic way (well, not all video games, but the one we are discussing at the very least). Part of that reality includes things that might make you uncomfortable, just like real life does. Swearing and sex ruin the immersion? What happens in real life when someone swears at you or you have sex, does that ruin the immersion there too? Frankly, those things increased the immersion for me, but maybe that's just my taste.

That's because you were watching Sting videos, watch some 80's rap, glam metal and hard rock videos (the three most popular music forms of the 80's), then come back and tell what the Witcher contained was worse.

I never said I had good taste (you were the one to make that claim), but I do know what I like and don't like. That's all that really matters to me. I look at the Witcher and I see that nice plate of ribs, but with a side of brisket on Texas toast, corn on the cob and big glass of sweet tea.
Posted May 19, 2011
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BrianX: Hello GOG,

I was wondering if Witcher 1 and 2 might be available in the near future as PG or PG-13 censored titles. I like the 1st game, but its difficult for me to continue playing it because of the silly profanity and sexual stuff. I understand the need for there to be 'adult' games, but I honestly don't see the point of all the profanity and sexuality really adding anything to the combat, RPG elements, and overall story. Its as if they were tacked on to make it more 'adult.'

Again, the 1st game is great as an RPG with its combat, creatures, setting (oh wow, the setting!), and everything else, but it is hard for me to stomach the silly profanity and sexual overtones.

My main question is this: can you guys make a patch that takes out the profanity and sexual stuff? I live in the USA, so I'm not sure if there is a version that eliminates those elements.

Thanks!
Im not reading through 7 pages of stuff so sorry if it been said, import the Aussie retail version, they removed the sex scenes, "bad" language remains
Posted May 19, 2011
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bossonova: You still have not got to the point. i know your very angry because the context may have threw you off. Troll much? your only saying that the witcher should have been toned down to your standards for everyone to not enjoy. thats it. but what may be good for you is not good for everyone, but you obviously think to seem so. Its a shame really because who are you. nobody.
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BrianX: Oh come on Boss, everyone is someone including you; stop being mad. I'm actually not sure of what your point was. I think your point was that sex and profanity are not useless, etc.

I know I was exaggerating a bit much when I said useless, but, in my opinion, the sex scenes and profanity just didn't fit the fantasy setting to me. Maybe because I was raised on more Lord of the Rings, etc, but I used to read the Conan series and felt they were gritty and raw and I thought that the Witcher 1 would be in the same vein. It was jarring and pulled me out of the immersive quality of the game whenever someone cursed like a drunken sailor, especially when Geralt said "Abso-f*****-lutely," I nearly died with laughter when he said that. However I am not so sure the designers wanted people to laugh at that point.

But really, how was the sex and profanity useful? For some, like you I suppose, it enhanced the gritty feeling of the setting, but for me, it really did not add anything because, in my opinion, it was poorly placed. Just because you throw in an 'F' bomb here and there doesn't mean its great writing! Imagine Clint Eastwood at the end of High Plains Drifter yelling 'F*ck yeah," that would be ridiculous and, to me, out of character.

So maybe Geralt is a profanity spewing man-whore, yeah, I guess I chose the product wrong then according to my tastes. But I have no desire to stop other people from enjoying. GAME ON!

And I am no troll, I am a gnome halfling rogue with an eye-patch.
Finally getting to the point. very nice to hear. bottom line is that this game is not for you. Since it is not for you why are you expressing anything about it. why bother? end of the story. Are you here to educate people on f bombs and titties in games. no. so just let it go big bad brian of the pg universe. you will not be so angry anymore.
Posted May 19, 2011
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BrianX: What Lord do you pray to?

"I thank the Lord everyday that there are scenes of pr0n and profanity still left in 'Adult' games, amen."

o_O
Simple there is no "Lord" but that's another thread.. ;^)

OT: I get what you're saying about the gratuitous swearing, it's not that you are upset about the swearing as much as it's about the modern tone of the actual words themselves, that make them an out-of place immersion killer...But then again, I wouldn't know, as I refuse to play the game with American voices...Now that's more out of place to me instead of accurate time-period cursing.

Next time, you should be much more precise with the wording with your opening post in your thread or else you'll end-up with it getting out of control like this one where you end up spending your time defending and trying to explain yourself,rather than simply enjoy the discussion. In my experience, the longer these threads become, the more people will simply only read the first post and will react on that, instead of the explanation you gave 5-10 pgs ago.
Post edited May 19, 2011 by takezodunmer2005
Posted May 19, 2011
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BrianX: You are probably correct.

HOWEVER, do you think it would have been done tastefully or over the top?
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Aningan: That's rather subjective. And unfortunately, for you at least, the majority does not agree with you on what over the top means. You find The Witcher 1&2 as being over the top. I do not. Especially after reading the books. Don't get me wrong. I like "regular" fantasy writings. I loved the R.A. Salvatore books for example, but the genre cannot go just that way. You need something different, be it The Witcher or something else. It would be very sad if all fantasy would be done the same way. Lord or the Rings Clone 1, Clone 2, etc. And it goes for other genre also. You need diversity, you need something totally different even. Creativity is good. Even if it's not something you like.

And that's the problem. You don't like it. Ok. You need to find something else. The profanity, the roughness of how it's done, it's all part of the setting. Take it away, do it more "tastefully" and you get something else, no longer Sapkowski's Witcher. What you want is another game.
You make good points, but I think that I argued pretty well that in W1 at least, the nudity and profanity could have been utilized much better (tastefully?). My main gripe, really, is that I really wanted an options button to at least tone down some of those eliminates so I could enjoy all the other things the game had to offer. An options button wouldn't ruin it for other gamers either because they could keep all the hardcore settings, etc. There are 'Adult' games out there that kind of already do that with the 'gore' settings, etc.
Posted May 19, 2011
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takezodunmer2005: OT: I get what you're saying about the gratuitous swearing, it's not that you are upset about the swearing as much as it's about the modern tone of the actual words themselves that make them an out-of place immersion killer...
But "Ye sir, merily do but follow me to remain untrodden upon by beasts most foul" is just as unrealistic as modern speech. That's crap people at Renaissance Fairs speak trying to sound authentic. "Shit" and "fuck" as a derogatory and slang comes from the 16th century at least, after all.
Post edited May 19, 2011 by nondeplumage
Posted May 19, 2011
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bazilisek: I'd just like to point out that there is no such thing as Czechoslovakian, as Czech and Slovak are two separate, though fairly similar, languages. And that Czechoslovakia hasn't existed since 1993.

Carry on.
Heh, ya got me there, I guess you would know. ;^) I still like how it sounds nonetheless!

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cogadh: And since when is "American" a language? Last I checked, our national language was English. You might go so far as to call it a dialect of the "original" English, but it's still English.
Yeah, I know. it's more of a "Statement" to illustrate a point that it's pretty much an immersion killer than anything else. English (UK) however, would be very immersive indeed!
Post edited May 19, 2011 by takezodunmer2005
Posted May 19, 2011
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BrianX: Yes, I am a repressed America because I like good taste. Sounds like you ate a delicious terd for you to get all bent out of shape over my comment, I guess I ruined your fun by pointing out in a very detailed way that W1's use of sex scenes and profanity was needlessly tacked on and jarring. I AM SO REPRESSED!
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cogadh: Taste is subjective. What is good taste to you is not necessarily good taste to anyone else. If it hasn't already been made clear to you by some of the responses you have received here, your taste is not what most of us would consider "good"; maybe "old-fashioned" or "restrictive", perhaps even "puritanical", but definitely not "good".

Frankly, you are repressed if you are offended by the content in the Witcher (sex scenes? please, I've seen worse stuff in music videos on MTV 20 years ago). Let me explain something to you that you seem to be unaware of: people swear in real life... all the time, people have sex in real life... all the time, people get naked in real life... all the time. Being offended by content that is simply a natural part of being human is the definition of repressed. You don't like what the Witcher has to offer, then why did you even buy it, knowing full well what its rating meant for the content in the game?

BTW - Nice job side-stepping my whole point and focusing on one minor factor of that point, very trollish of you.
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BrianX: That is true, I did make the wrong choice in hindsight, but learning from mistakes is a part of life.

Also, what I meant by 'forced' is that, when you are in the game, you have to listen to the profanity (unless you press escape and then miss all the story). With the sex scenes you have options, you don't HAVE to sleep with anyone, at least not in the parts that I played. Its not that I hate sex, its just that I felt it was tacky and pointless (in Fable it makes more sense to me). But at least I could chose, within the game, not to bed every girl (although those grannies looked pretty hot!!!).
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cogadh: So because of your shortsightedness, CPDRed should change a game that is already 4 years old, just to suit your particular sensibilities? No, I'm pretty sure the proper response is you should read the label before you buy next time.
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BrianX: That is actually a good question. I don't think it would actually hurt, but there would have to be limits in order for a game to be sold. In my opinion, MOST people would decrease rather than increase the levels of nudity and profanity, especially if the game already had high levels of it (which begs the question, what is a high level and what is not?!).

I think it would depend on the game. I could see a game where you could increase the amount of guns, monsters, etc, but would it really serve the game if you could increase the amount of nudity and profanity? Maybe if it were a GTA game.

I think most people download those MODs because of curiosity or for a good laugh, then they uninstall it and go back to either vanilla or useful MODs that enhance the game-play.

Then again, you MIGHT download the extra nudity MOD to say, Oblivion, if a certain beach or continent had people that wore little clothing. I think context is key here; you can see where it fits in the universe of Conan rather than GTA.
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cogadh: Wow, I've seen some clueless stuff posted here before, but this takes the cake. You seriously believe that if given the option to decrease or increase the amount of profanity, sex and nudity in a game from the default, that more people are going to choose to decrease? You don't know anything at all about human nature, do you?
Well, it depends, I think the more mature people wouldn't increase it, hence the word MATURE. Of course it begs the question 'would mature people buy this product.'

I am trying to learn more about human nature, there is a library down the road that I go to ;)
Posted May 19, 2011
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takezodunmer2005: Please, for the love of Crom don't mention Wii again please,it's the worse type of foul language around here! x^D
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nondeplumage: Batman: The Brave and the Bold and the new Donkey Kong game and the Wii Mario games are awesome.
That very well may be I've no doubt, yet I still hold my boycott of them during the RPG drought of 1994 in which Sega and Nintendo would bypass the localization of several excellent sequels in favor of rehashed crap! (So unfortunately, I'm a bit biased)

With all do respect my friend, I refuse to even consider purchasing any console from Nintendo...(Unless of course, they consider RPG's no longer such a niche genre)
Post edited May 19, 2011 by takezodunmer2005
Posted May 19, 2011
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BrianX: But I have to disagree with you Mental, I think that if they would have toned down the Witcher 1's profanity, and made less ado about the sex scenes, it wouldn't have ruined the experience.
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Mentalepsy: That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that going back after the fact and deleting certain content is not the same as retroactively doing a better job on that content.
Okay, sorry I misunderstood then.
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BrianX: Yeesh, people throw out the word 'Troll' all the time now...

So, using your logic, I would be 'repressed' if I was offended at someone putting a baby in a microwave or 'repressed' if I was offended at someone raping a woman? Granted those are crazy scenarios, but guess what, they have actually happened. I understand reality, but when you talk about having 'reality' in a VIDEO-GAME, that is when you lose me!

Breaking news: Video-games are NOT real life, no matter how close they try to get. Just because you throw in some useless sex scenes and profanity does not make it more like 'reality.' In fact, it can RUIN the immersion factor if used poorly. Again, I AGREE with you that it comes down to taste, but surely there are STANDARDS for taste and for poor taste. You can't say that all food is good, because some foods will kill you. All uses of nudity and bad language are not good, because it all depends on context.

And I don't know about you, but I don't remember Sting having a sex encounter with a witch back in the 80s. Yeah, I agree that MTV and other media venues go too far, but I don't remember seeing videos in the 80s on MTV that had full nudity (unless they were 'special' videos that came on after midnight like that one Prodigy video).

Anyways, I am not sure you have good taste. How do you even KNOW you have good taste? How do you gauge it yourself? In my opinion I thought they could have designed those Adult elements much better and maybe in the future there will be options for the user to tone those things down without having to download a MOD. Toning it down doesn't mean that the rest of the higher-quality material is obliterated, not at all, I think W1 had a fantastic setting, characters, etc, etc.

But you are right, no matter how much I make an argument that W1 used its more adult themes poorly and in bad taste, it will come down to the individual to really decide if it matches their tastes or not. I'm just sad because, in my opinion, I see an awesome plate of baby back ribs with a small duck turd on top and I can't remove the turd :(
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cogadh: Killing children and raping women are a part of human nature, but they are a part of our nature that society has deemed unacceptable, even illegal. Swearing, sex and nudity are not. You may think them unacceptable, but you are not society as a whole.

No, video games are not real life, but just like movies, they try to represent the fantastical in a realistic way (well, not all video games, but the one we are discussing at the very least). Part of that reality includes things that might make you uncomfortable, just like real life does. Swearing and sex ruin the immersion? What happens in real life when someone swears at you or you have sex, does that ruin the immersion there too? Frankly, those things increased the immersion for me, but maybe that's just my taste.

That's because you were watching Sting videos, watch some 80's rap, glam metal and hard rock videos (the three most popular music forms of the 80's), then come back and tell what the Witcher contained was worse.

I never said I had good taste (you were the one to make that claim), but I do know what I like and don't like. That's all that really matters to me. I look at the Witcher and I see that nice plate of ribs, but with a side of brisket on Texas toast, corn on the cob and big glass of sweet tea.
Thanks alot for making me hungry, you b*stard.
Post edited May 19, 2011 by BrianX
Posted May 19, 2011
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takezodunmer2005: With all do respect my friend, I refuse to even consider purchasing any console from Nintendo...(Unless of course, they consider RPG's no longer such a niche genre)
Do they? I mean, they did come out with one of my favorite RPGs, the Mario one. And they have quite a few on the DS. Is it Nintendo or the developers just not coming up with RPGs?

I don't know. I have my PC RPGs, but Nintendo is like George Lucas right now, they just keep putting out Zelda and Mario and re-releasing all their old titles.
Posted May 19, 2011
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BrianX: Yeesh, people throw out the word 'Troll' all the time now...

So, using your logic, I would be 'repressed' if I was offended at someone putting a baby in a microwave or 'repressed' if I was offended at someone raping a woman? Granted those are crazy scenarios, but guess what, they have actually happened. I understand reality, but when you talk about having 'reality' in a VIDEO-GAME, that is when you lose me!

Breaking news: Video-games are NOT real life, no matter how close they try to get. Just because you throw in some useless sex scenes and profanity does not make it more like 'reality.' In fact, it can RUIN the immersion factor if used poorly. Again, I AGREE with you that it comes down to taste, but surely there are STANDARDS for taste and for poor taste. You can't say that all food is good, because some foods will kill you. All uses of nudity and bad language are not good, because it all depends on context.

And I don't know about you, but I don't remember Sting having a sex encounter with a witch back in the 80s. Yeah, I agree that MTV and other media venues go too far, but I don't remember seeing videos in the 80s on MTV that had full nudity (unless they were 'special' videos that came on after midnight like that one Prodigy video).

Anyways, I am not sure you have good taste. How do you even KNOW you have good taste? How do you gauge it yourself? In my opinion I thought they could have designed those Adult elements much better and maybe in the future there will be options for the user to tone those things down without having to download a MOD. Toning it down doesn't mean that the rest of the higher-quality material is obliterated, not at all, I think W1 had a fantastic setting, characters, etc, etc.

But you are right, no matter how much I make an argument that W1 used its more adult themes poorly and in bad taste, it will come down to the individual to really decide if it matches their tastes or not. I'm just sad because, in my opinion, I see an awesome plate of baby back ribs with a small duck turd on top and I can't remove the turd :(
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cogadh: Killing children and raping women are a part of human nature, but they are a part of our nature that society has deemed unacceptable, even illegal. Swearing, sex and nudity are not. You may think them unacceptable, but you are not society as a whole.

No, video games are not real life, but just like movies, they try to represent the fantastical in a realistic way (well, not all video games, but the one we are discussing at the very least). Part of that reality includes things that might make you uncomfortable, just like real life does. Swearing and sex ruin the immersion? What happens in real life when someone swears at you or you have sex, does that ruin the immersion there too? Frankly, those things increased the immersion for me, but maybe that's just my taste.

That's because you were watching Sting videos, watch some 80's rap, glam metal and hard rock videos (the three most popular music forms of the 80's), then come back and tell what the Witcher contained was worse.

I never said I had good taste (you were the one to make that claim), but I do know what I like and don't like. That's all that really matters to me. I look at the Witcher and I see that nice plate of ribs, but with a side of brisket on Texas toast, corn on the cob and big glass of sweet tea.
Well, in real-life if someone swears out loud you really do have to put up with it to a certain extent. Then again, I have told people who swore in front of children to watch their language! Also, people who swear constantly on, say, a bus for example, deserve to be shut up by the others. But as far as swearing in general, I usually just grin and bear it. I am a sinner too and swear from time to time, so I don't want to be a hypocrite, but the way I used to curse you would think I was a sailor. So while I grin and bear cursing most of the time, in video-games I am participating in a closed reality where I have to listen to the profanity to get through the game. For me, its too much to stomach. So while I can walk away from people who swear in public, its harder to do so when you are locked in a game.

Part of that is my fault, it was rated correctly as Adult. But I really didn't think it would be THAT much cursing, maybe they can state how many bad words are used in the game on the back of the box j/k ;)

That is why I think it would be an AWESOME idea for game designers to have an options button/setting where it tones that stuff down but doesn't take out the other gritty eliminates (like the way Conan's world is portrayed which is very much like the Witcher's, ie, barbaric, bloody, etc).

Or maybe come up with a creative way to use certain words like 'Frak' in BSGalactica.

And really? 80s videos were worse than the Witcher's nudie cards and sex scenes? Youtube links or I don't believe you!!! ;)
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BrianX: Oh come on Boss, everyone is someone including you; stop being mad. I'm actually not sure of what your point was. I think your point was that sex and profanity are not useless, etc.

I know I was exaggerating a bit much when I said useless, but, in my opinion, the sex scenes and profanity just didn't fit the fantasy setting to me. Maybe because I was raised on more Lord of the Rings, etc, but I used to read the Conan series and felt they were gritty and raw and I thought that the Witcher 1 would be in the same vein. It was jarring and pulled me out of the immersive quality of the game whenever someone cursed like a drunken sailor, especially when Geralt said "Abso-f*****-lutely," I nearly died with laughter when he said that. However I am not so sure the designers wanted people to laugh at that point.

But really, how was the sex and profanity useful? For some, like you I suppose, it enhanced the gritty feeling of the setting, but for me, it really did not add anything because, in my opinion, it was poorly placed. Just because you throw in an 'F' bomb here and there doesn't mean its great writing! Imagine Clint Eastwood at the end of High Plains Drifter yelling 'F*ck yeah," that would be ridiculous and, to me, out of character.

So maybe Geralt is a profanity spewing man-whore, yeah, I guess I chose the product wrong then according to my tastes. But I have no desire to stop other people from enjoying. GAME ON!

And I am no troll, I am a gnome halfling rogue with an eye-patch.
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bossonova: Finally getting to the point. very nice to hear. bottom line is that this game is not for you. Since it is not for you why are you expressing anything about it. why bother? end of the story. Are you here to educate people on f bombs and titties in games. no. so just let it go big bad brian of the pg universe. you will not be so angry anymore.
Well, you are only getting HALF the point. Half the game is definitely for me: the setting, the action, the atmosphere, the RPG elements, the creatures, the characters, etc. Yet, in my opinion, the sex scenes and profanity ruin it for me for reasons I stated plenty of times.

The other HALF of the point that I made earlier is: Wouldn't it be cool if game designers had options for content that at least tones certain aspects down? At LEAST an option? I think that is a great point to be made because it won't ruin the game for others who want their nudity and bad language untouched.

My first post actually asked if they were making a PG version or if there were patches/MODS, etc. But I think there have been some quality discussions amongst the dross.
Post edited May 19, 2011 by BrianX
Posted May 19, 2011
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bazilisek: To rephrase it: is there a female character anywhere at all in the Witcher games whose tits aren't just about to burst through whatever flimsy excuse for a dress they are wearing? I'm somewhere in the third chapter of the first game and all the women I meet either are whores or look like whores. With the exception of a few grannies.
Yes - Shani.



edit: Didn't notice this thread was 7 pages long before I posted so I'm a little late to the party :).

edit2: I think the issue stems from the fact that the OP is far more sensitive to swearing than many of us might be. I understand you wanting there to be an option, but I think it's reasonable that if the writers had a vision of how the game was to be, they didn't what people messing with it. Of course that may be rubbish and they just didn't see it as an issue or didn't think it was worth the effort to remove.

Oh, and I've gotta say - the sex was fine, the sex cards - naff as hell. Still, meh, didn't bother me. As has been said, there is a censored version for the sex cards.
Post edited May 19, 2011 by Nafe
Posted May 19, 2011
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BrianX: What Lord do you pray to?

"I thank the Lord everyday that there are scenes of pr0n and profanity still left in 'Adult' games, amen."

o_O
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takezodunmer2005: Simple there is no "Lord" but that's another thread.. ;^)

OT: I get what you're saying about the gratuitous swearing, it's not that you are upset about the swearing as much as it's about the modern tone of the actual words themselves, that make them an out-of place immersion killer...But then again, I wouldn't know, as I refuse to play the game with American voices...Now that's more out of place to me instead of accurate time-period cursing.

Next time, you should be much more precise with the wording with your opening post in your thread or else you'll end-up with it getting out of control like this one where you end up spending your time defending and trying to explain yourself,rather than simply enjoy the discussion. In my experience, the longer these threads become, the more people will simply only read the first post and will react on that, instead of the explanation you gave 5-10 pgs ago.
Good points and noted!
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takezodunmer2005: OT: I get what you're saying about the gratuitous swearing, it's not that you are upset about the swearing as much as it's about the modern tone of the actual words themselves that make them an out-of place immersion killer...
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nondeplumage: But "Ye sir, merily do but follow me to remain untrodden upon by beasts most foul" is just as unrealistic as modern speech. That's crap people at Renaissance Fairs speak trying to sound authentic. "Shit" and "fuck" as a derogatory and slang comes from the 16th century at least, after all.
What year is the Witcher series set in?
Post edited May 19, 2011 by BrianX
Posted May 19, 2011
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Nafe: Yes - Shani.
Which is why I picked her over Triss. But the nightie she's wearing... Hilarious and/or sad.
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