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General discussion (archive)Wind Waker being reborn on the Wii U(50 posts)(50 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted January 24, 2013
This is the last Zelda I played. It was okay but I'm not the fan most are. It had amazing art design though, looks great on an emulator in HD so I assume it will look great on WiiU.
Posted January 24, 2013
I've actually been trying to get a hold of this for a reasonable price for the GameCube, but copies of the game seem to be going for ridiculous prices under the pretense that it is 'rare' (ignoring, of course, the fact, that there are 30-40 copies going on eBay and another 30-40 on Amazon).

If I'm going to pay full price for a game, I'd rather buy it new, so this is great news.
Posted January 24, 2013
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gameon: It still feels like yesterday when it was first released. 2002 wasn't it? Not long enough to forget about, and i bet it still looks and plays great. (apart from the tedious sailing, because the wind changed every few seconds...grr)
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QC: The wind NEVER changed unless you changed it yourself, unless that's what you're referring to. Otherwise I have no idea what you're talking about.
I seem to remember there being wind changes even after changing the wind myself...
Posted January 24, 2013
Wind Waker was perfect as it was.
Why Nintendo make ONLY remake and remake?
They can simply put the GC version on WII U store and make a NEW Zelda game :|
Posted January 24, 2013
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Cambrey: Is this a sign that they are totally unable to make a decent Zelda anymore ?
Those signs came in like 10 years ago
Posted January 24, 2013
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Big_Boss: Wind Waker was perfect as it was.
Why Nintendo make ONLY remake and remake?
They can simply put the GC version on WII U store and make a NEW Zelda game :|
They *are* making a new Zelda game, but they said it will be a while before they're ready to even show anything about it. They have however stated they will try to rethink the conventions that usually apply to the series (which is not necessarily a good thing, but I'm optimistic).

Wind Waker HD is intended as an "intermediate" thing, and also a good starting point for newcomers to the series (at least that's what Eiji Aonuma said in yesterday's Nintendo Direct). Yes, in theory they could release it as a VC title, but they haven't even officially launched the Wii U Virtual Console yet, so that would require some waiting anyway.

Besides, Skyward Sword is only a little over a year old, and it had been two years since the last game before that (Spirit Tracks). This is pretty much the usual pace for new Zelda titles.
Posted January 24, 2013
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Pidgeot: they will try to rethink the conventions that usually apply to the series (which is not necessarily a good thing, but I'm optimistic).
If they do that right it'll be the salvation of the brand, because the games themselves have stagnated horribly since Ocarina of Time, Wind Waker was literally the only fresh idea they've really had and mostly came down to an aesthetic style choice.

It's good they're rethinking Zelda, when you can only think "I already fucking played this one in 1999" it's not a good thing.
Posted January 24, 2013
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Pidgeot: they will try to rethink the conventions that usually apply to the series (which is not necessarily a good thing, but I'm optimistic).
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orcishgamer: If they do that right it'll be the salvation of the brand, because the games themselves have stagnated horribly since Ocarina of Time, Wind Waker was literally the only fresh idea they've really had and mostly came down to an aesthetic style choice.

It's good they're rethinking Zelda, when you can only think "I already fucking played this one in 1999" it's not a good thing.
You know they are not gonna put anything new if anything they could going to turn Zelda into an Elder Scrolls clone.

Another Example is that Zelda would end up like Final Fantasy since despite being my favorit game, long time fans hated 12 for changing the gameplay.
Post edited January 24, 2013 by Elmofongo
Posted January 24, 2013
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Big_Boss: Wind Waker was perfect as it was.
Why Nintendo make ONLY remake and remake?
They can simply put the GC version on WII U store and make a NEW Zelda game :|
They are, but Skyward Sword did only come out in 2011 and the main series does seem to take a few years.
Posted January 24, 2013
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orcishgamer: If they do that right it'll be the salvation of the brand, because the games themselves have stagnated horribly since Ocarina of Time, Wind Waker was literally the only fresh idea they've really had and mostly came down to an aesthetic style choice.

It's good they're rethinking Zelda, when you can only think "I already fucking played this one in 1999" it's not a good thing.
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Elmofongo: You know they are not gonna put anything new if anything they could going to turn Zelda into an Elder Scrolls clone.

Another Example is that Zelda would end up like Final Fantasy since despite being my favorit game, long time fans hated 12 for changing the gameplay.
Long time fans are killing Zelda, at least for anyone but the long time fans. I can't say truly who has more "right" to have their cake and eat it too, but I can say "teh hardcorez" of any fanbase will usually be in the vast minority.

Games evolve all the time without turning into a Elder Scrolls clone, but let's take one that could easily be accused of being an Elder Scrolls clone (for fairly obvious reasons): Fallout 3 and Fallout: NV. Despite the similarities the fundamental "taste" of the game and reasons for playing it remain fairly consistent with Fallout itself. I'm not saying I like every single thing that was done, New Vegas showed there's massive room for improvement even when you do a basically good job.

And you know what? Fallout 3 sold well enough that we got New Vegas, which was so successful we're likely to get more Fallout games down the road. The old formula of Fallout was effectively dead, despite the warm place in our hearts we all have for it, the market didn't want it and the publishers weren't gonna make it. This is why I like Kickstarter because it will enable fewer of us to make a niche game viable, but the vast majority of the market remains the same.

Even if Nintendo ends up catering to the long time Zelda fans, said group of people will most likely still be unhappy, Nintendo has mountains of goodwill among gamers, but it's not infinite, the seams are starting to show and even though conservative seems to be the smart play right now, it's probably not.

So, Elder Scrolls "clone" or something else, a fresh take on Zelda would probably help the series in the long run. Tomorrow's longtime/hard core fans will, ironically, see it as "normal" as the existing fans see the obligatory water dungeon and hook shot.
Posted January 24, 2013
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Elmofongo: You know they are not gonna put anything new if anything they could going to turn Zelda into an Elder Scrolls clone.

Another Example is that Zelda would end up like Final Fantasy since despite being my favorit game, long time fans hated 12 for changing the gameplay.
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orcishgamer: Long time fans are killing Zelda, at least for anyone but the long time fans. I can't say truly who has more "right" to have their cake and eat it too, but I can say "teh hardcorez" of any fanbase will usually be in the vast minority.

Games evolve all the time without turning into a Elder Scrolls clone, but let's take one that could easily be accused of being an Elder Scrolls clone (for fairly obvious reasons): Fallout 3 and Fallout: NV. Despite the similarities the fundamental "taste" of the game and reasons for playing it remain fairly consistent with Fallout itself. I'm not saying I like every single thing that was done, New Vegas showed there's massive room for improvement even when you do a basically good job.

And you know what? Fallout 3 sold well enough that we got New Vegas, which was so successful we're likely to get more Fallout games down the road. The old formula of Fallout was effectively dead, despite the warm place in our hearts we all have for it, the market didn't want it and the publishers weren't gonna make it. This is why I like Kickstarter because it will enable fewer of us to make a niche game viable, but the vast majority of the market remains the same.

Even if Nintendo ends up catering to the long time Zelda fans, said group of people will most likely still be unhappy, Nintendo has mountains of goodwill among gamers, but it's not infinite, the seams are starting to show and even though conservative seems to be the smart play right now, it's probably not.

So, Elder Scrolls "clone" or something else, a fresh take on Zelda would probably help the series in the long run. Tomorrow's longtime/hard core fans will, ironically, see it as "normal" as the existing fans see the obligatory water dungeon and hook shot.
Yeah but there is also competition in the market, Say if Skyward Sword was an Elder Scrolls clone Skyrim would have killed it even more since the game was exactly like Elder Scrolls.

Samething happened to Metroid, Metroid Prime 2 sales were not as high because of Halo 2 and Half-Life 2 and other Shooters of 2004. Metroid Prime 3 sales were low because of Halo 3 and Call of Duty 4.
Posted January 24, 2013
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Elmofongo: Yeah but there is also competition in the market, Say if Skyward Sword was an Elder Scrolls clone Skyrim would have killed it even more since the game was exactly like Elder Scrolls.

Samething happened to Metroid, Metroid Prime 2 sales were not as high because of Halo 2 and Half-Life 2 and other Shooters of 2004. Metroid Prime 3 sales were low because of Halo 3 and Call of Duty 4.
None of what you said makes any sense to me at all. Metroid Prime did fucking awesome and it, not Metroid Prime 2, was the new and innovative one. Metroid Prime 2 was effectively an expac and did poorly for that reason. Those other shooters didn't even exist on GameCube. By your reasoning either Halo 2 or Half Life 2 should have done shitty due to competition with each other, they didn't, because each series had a fanbase. Metroid Prime likewise had a fanbase. Zelda has a fanbase.

What's more similar mechanics don't make games similar, similar reasons for playing games makes games similar. Otherwise Mass Effect would have felt like "bleh, me too!", but it didn't, because it introduced a fresh and interesting reason (really set of reasons) for playing it.
Posted January 24, 2013
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orcishgamer: None of what you said makes any sense to me at all. Metroid Prime did fucking awesome and it, not Metroid Prime 2, was the new and innovative one.
He didn't say Metroid Prime did badly, in fact he didn't say anything about Metroid Prime at all...
Posted January 24, 2013
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Elmofongo: Yeah but there is also competition in the market, Say if Skyward Sword was an Elder Scrolls clone Skyrim would have killed it even more since the game was exactly like Elder Scrolls.

Samething happened to Metroid, Metroid Prime 2 sales were not as high because of Halo 2 and Half-Life 2 and other Shooters of 2004. Metroid Prime 3 sales were low because of Halo 3 and Call of Duty 4.
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orcishgamer: None of what you said makes any sense to me at all. Metroid Prime did fucking awesome and it, not Metroid Prime 2, was the new and innovative one. Metroid Prime 2 was effectively an expac and did poorly for that reason. Those other shooters didn't even exist on GameCube. By your reasoning either Halo 2 or Half Life 2 should have done shitty due to competition with each other, they didn't, because each series had a fanbase. Metroid Prime likewise had a fanbase. Zelda has a fanbase.

What's more similar mechanics don't make games similar, similar reasons for playing games makes games similar. Otherwise Mass Effect would have felt like "bleh, me too!", but it didn't, because it introduced a fresh and interesting reason (really set of reasons) for playing it.
Well thats what this History video showed me:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=p_RbU6C-tno#t=186s
Posted January 24, 2013
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orcishgamer: None of what you said makes any sense to me at all. Metroid Prime did fucking awesome and it, not Metroid Prime 2, was the new and innovative one.
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SirPrimalform: He didn't say Metroid Prime did badly, in fact he didn't say anything about Metroid Prime at all...
I know he didn't say anything about the original Prime, but he did mention Prime 2 which was a failure and an example of everything he seemed to be advocating rather than what he seemed to be making it out to be (some risky change that couldn't possibly have succeeded due to competition)...
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Elmofongo: Well thats what this History video showed me:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=p_RbU6C-tno#t=186s
I only skipped around a bit, but that video basically seemed to argue that Prime 2 failed because it did a shitty job with the gameplay it was offering, not because the gameplay was similar to Half Life 2 or Halo 2.

They tried to tack on a Golden Eye style multiplayer and ignored the fact that everyone had already said "we're fucking bored of that" when they tried to push the exact same thing for Perfect Dark years before.

Metroid Prime 2 wasn't a copy of Halo, it was a bloody copy of Golden Eye/Perfect Dark, once again Nintendo trying to stick stubbornly to crap because "someone used to like it". Well, back in 1998 Golden Eye was pretty fun. But that was then, the gameplay hadn't aged all that well, and MS, Valve, and several other American companies had shown over and over again that not only was there a vast market for shooters, but the market existed on consoles as well, and offered multiple, successful examples of how to make one.

Nintendo did their own thing with online multiplayer, offered pretty much nothing interesting in the single player, and there's any question at all why Prime 2 didn't do well?

Yeah, I'm gonna have to go with the most likely option here, Prime 2 did poorly because it wasn't very good or interesting, not because there's some saturation point for "shooters" or something.
Post edited January 24, 2013 by orcishgamer
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General discussion (archive)Wind Waker being reborn on the Wii U(50 posts)(50 posts)
(50 posts)