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General discussion (archive)Why we are not getting Syndicate (yet)(33 posts)(33 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted June 04, 2011
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SLP2000: This is common knowledge, I know what's the situation, I'm asking if there are any talks about it with Ubi, Atari and Hasbro, and if there's any view of success.
And you ought to know by now that GOG never answers such questions. You don't publically discuss a deal while you're negotiating it, that just isn't done. So there's no need to ask which specific deals they are or are not working on, because you won't get an answer either way.
Posted June 04, 2011
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Wishbone: And you ought to know by now that GOG never answers such questions. You don't publically discuss a deal while you're negotiating it, that just isn't done. So there's no need to ask which specific deals they are or are not working on, because you won't get an answer either way.
You're right, but for the first time they made the remark in the announcement, that some games are not the part of the deal - Syndicate and System Shock. (I'm not sure if they made an explicit remark about Infinity Games)

Also, someone asked about Little Big Adventure, and they relied that rights don't belong to EA, but they know who has them, and they are working on it.

So, if they are now a slightly more open about games they are working on / they can't give us right now, I thought I might be able to get some infor about SSI crpgs.
Post edited June 04, 2011 by SLP2000
Posted June 04, 2011
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BiggerJ: Apparently, SSI's games are now owned by Ubisoft, with which GOG has already signed (hence, for example, the Rayman rereleases). It'd just be a matter of getting them and Hasbro (owners of D&D) to come to an agreement.
Ubisoft might own the games, but Hasbro has an exclusive publication deal with Atari regarding all things D&D. So yes, everybody that's needed is signed up to GOG, but they're not signed up with each other.

About the only way around it is for Atari to buy the rights to those games.
Posted June 04, 2011
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Navagon: About the only way around it is for Atari to buy the rights to those games.
They could also share the cake. I can't see anyone buying old SSI catalogue.
Post edited June 04, 2011 by SLP2000
Posted June 04, 2011
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SLP2000: You're right, but for the first time they made the remark in the announcement, that some games are not the part of the deal - Syndicate and System Shock.
That's right... so if we can't get them to tell what's being worked on, we can try to get them to tell everything that's definitely NOT coming in the next few months?

:-P
Posted June 04, 2011
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SLP2000: They could also share the cake. I can't see anyone buying old SSI catalogue.
Highly unlikely as that would mean compromising the deal with Hasbro and there has already been a major legal spat between Atari and Hasbro. Atari aren't going to rock that boat for a few extra quid.
Posted June 04, 2011
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BiggerJ: Apparently, SSI's games are now owned by Ubisoft, with which GOG has already signed (hence, for example, the Rayman rereleases). It'd just be a matter of getting them and Hasbro (owners of D&D) to come to an agreement.
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Navagon: Ubisoft might own the games, but Hasbro has an exclusive publication deal with Atari regarding all things D&D. So yes, everybody that's needed is signed up to GOG, but they're not signed up with each other.

About the only way around it is for Atari to buy the rights to those games.
Indeed and Mr. Gog's habit of taking the high ground by refusing to sign contracts that only cover a portion of the world or for sums of money that prevent releasing games at the two chosen price points doesn't help either.

Granted, I love them for sticking to their guns on it, but it can make things a lot slower.
Posted June 04, 2011
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hedwards: Indeed and Mr. Gog's habit of taking the high ground by refusing to sign contracts that only cover a portion of the world or for sums of money that prevent releasing games at the two chosen price points doesn't help either.

Granted, I love them for sticking to their guns on it, but it can make things a lot slower.
The GOG plan is to get as many games at those two price points then
expand on that. Which I suppose means either dropping fixed price points or have a greater variety of them.

Given that they've just signed EA and still have those other four to sign, I don't think they're about to do that just yet, mind.
Posted June 04, 2011
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Navagon: Highly unlikely as that would mean compromising the deal with Hasbro and there has already been a major legal spat between Atari and Hasbro. Atari aren't going to rock that boat for a few extra quid.
I thought so too. But there is a legal spat between Atari and Hasbro, and it didn't stop GOG from getting D&D Infinity Games. Both Habro and Atari had to agree on this deal, so there's a possibility to make the same for SSI crpgs. It's only one party of the agreement more.

And I really think we have bigger chances on that, than on Atari buying SSI catalogue.
Posted June 04, 2011
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SLP2000: I thought so too. But there is a legal spat between Atari and Hasbro, and it didn't stop GOG from getting D&D Infinity Games. Both Habro and Atari had to agree on this deal, so there's a possibility to make the same for SSI crpgs. It's only one party of the agreement more.

And I really think we have bigger chances on that, than on Atari buying SSI catalogue.
The legal spat between Atari and Hasbro ended. Hasbro wanted to work with another publisher instead. But the courts held them to their agreement with Atari. So there's actually less chance of that happening now than before the legal spat between the two.

So yes, the only way is for Atari to buy the rights to those games.
Posted June 04, 2011
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Navagon: The legal spat between Atari and Hasbro ended. Hasbro wanted to work with another publisher instead. But the courts held them to their agreement with Atari. So there's actually less chance of that happening now than before the legal spat between the two.

So yes, the only way is for Atari to buy the rights to those games.
So in short words, Hasbro lost?

GOG made the deal with Atari and Hasbro when legal spat wasn't ended, and yet they were able to make both companies agree on this deal. I wouldn't be so pesimistic.
Posted June 04, 2011
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SLP2000: So in short words, Hasbro lost?

GOG made the deal with Atari and Hasbro when legal spat wasn't ended, and yet they were able to make both companies agree on this deal. I wouldn't be so pesimistic.
The legal battle was lost by the point that Hasbro agreed to D&D games on GOG. That's why they were released. That's why we didn't get them as soon as Atari joined. GOG even stated that the legal spat was the reason why there were no D&D games on GOG - that had to be resolved first.

In any case, it changes nothing. Without the deal between Atari and Hasbro changing or being nullified and without Atari buying the games there's no possibility of those games being released here. Given how things are between Atari and Hasbro, neither are about to try and alter the deal.

Whatever needs to happen to get those games on GOG, it has little to do with GOG.
Posted June 04, 2011
Ok, I never found any info about the end of the legal battle between Hasbro and Atari, so I thought it's still not settled.

But I'm still not sure if you are right.

I have two arguments:

1.
Check here

"(...) and the massive announcement of a deal with Hasbro to breathe new life into some of the most desired titles in PC gaming history (...)"

GOG made explicit remark they made deal with Hasbro. If you were right, they wouldn't have had to, they would get them from Atari.

2.
Last Christmas sale. When there was Atari/Hasbro promo, it was only for the first period of the Christmas sale. But then later, GOG added Atari games back, by the GOGers demand, but not D&D titles. For me it looked like they had the approval from Atari, but not from Hasbro, so they couldn't bring D&D games back on sale. Of course the reason might be that they got the approval from Atari, but not for D&D titles, but basing on the fact above, I made an assumption that it was Hasbro who didn't agree.

Of course I might be wrong.
Post edited June 04, 2011 by SLP2000
Posted June 04, 2011
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SLP2000: Of course I might be wrong, I just made some assumptions based on those fact I'm talking above.
GOG didn't release the D&D games as soon as they had Atari on board because they don't want to be in a situation where they have to pull more games from the site (like they had to do with TOCA 3). So it could be that they got these reassurances from Hasbro that, should their relationship with Atari hit the rock again, they retain distribution rights.

Then again it could just be that Hasbro has to approve all of Atari's methods of distribution. They couldn't get such approval while the lawsuit was ongoing. Or it could be both of those things.

Bethesda had a similar deal in place with Interplay over the old Fallout games. They claimed that was violated as a part of their ongoing lawsuit against Interplay.
Posted June 04, 2011
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Navagon: GOG didn't release the D&D games as soon as they had Atari on board because they don't want to be in a situation where they have to pull more games from the site (like they had to do with TOCA 3). So it could be that they got these reassurances from Hasbro that, should their relationship with Atari hit the rock again, they retain distribution rights.
This sounds reasonable, but still, they said about "deal with Hasbro".

Then again it could just be that Hasbro has to approve all of Atari's methods of distribution. They couldn't get such approval while the lawsuit was ongoing. Or it could be both of those things.
Wait a minute. What rights has Atari to Infinity D&D Games? They didn't develope them. They didn't publish them. They only thing that connects Atari with those games is the exclusive right to publish D&D games until 2017.

Probably Hasbro licenced D&D to Interplay with a resolution, that after the licence ends, all copyrights to the D&D games belongs to Hasbro. I can't see any other possibility, because then some rights would be still with Interplay or Black Isle or BioWare.

So it's rather Hasbro who has the rights to BG and other Infinity Games, and Atari had to agree to make an exception from their exclusive licence, probably for a part of the cake.

Bethesda had a similar deal in place with Interplay over the old Fallout games. They claimed that was violated as a part of their ongoing lawsuit against Interplay.
AFAIK it was about Interplay releasing all three fallout games as Fallout Trilogy, which was apparently confusing with Fallout 3 coming from Bethesda.

link

But there might be more, I don't know the case.


ps.

I tried to find some info about the final of Hasbro vs Atari case.

I can't.

I found the article from 27th February 2011, and the author says the rights are still locked in the court battle. It's nothing sure, but it's the only thing I found about current status of Atari vs Hasbro case.
Post edited June 04, 2011 by SLP2000
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General discussion (archive)Why we are not getting Syndicate (yet)(33 posts)(33 posts)
(33 posts)