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This is going quite well, isn't it? Save for a few flares of temper, we managed to have a religion-thread which is pretty classy still.
Anyone here who now follows a different religion than the one he/she grew up with? I suppose there are quite a few people who 'lost' a faith, but it happens the other way around as well. Anyone who found a religion?
I'm what you call a strong agnostic... I'm not Atheist because they (are supposed to) believe that there is PROOF there is no God, which I think is silly.
I think we have no idea of the origins of the universe and life and will likely never know in our lifetime, or our grandkid's lifetime for that matter. I doubt there is a deity as it is commonly described, but you never know I suppose.
I definately do not believe in any kind of afterlife, I am very strongly against that idea. I definately do not believe any of the religous books are anything more than human words to express ideas and social control mechanisms.
Post edited February 18, 2010 by StingingVelvet
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StingingVelvet: I definately do not believe in any kind of afterlife, I am very strongly against that idea.

Personally I find the idea that everything just ends when you're dead to be so much more comforting than the idea of an afterlife. I also prefer the perspective it gives on life.
But many, many people have disagreed with me on this :p
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StingingVelvet: I'm not Atheist because they (are supposed to) believe that there is PROOF there is no God, which I think is silly.

At its simplest, it's the absence of belief in a deity. Anyone who doesn't believe in one god or another is an atheist.
I don't think that anyone thinks there's proof there is no god(s) out there somewhere. That would be silly.
Even strong atheism (outright declaring there is no god) does so without evidence. In fact, they reach that conclusion through the lack of evidence for god(s). As it's reasonable to expect there should be some.
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LordCinnamon: This is going quite well, isn't it?

Save for anjohl's standard trolling routine it's turned out much better than most religion threads tend to elsewhere.
Post edited February 18, 2010 by Navagon
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LordCinnamon: Personally I find the idea that everything just ends when you're dead to be so much more comforting than the idea of an afterlife. I also prefer the perspective it gives on life.
But many, many people have disagreed with me on this :p

I feel exactly the same way. :-)
I've never really been into any sort of religion. I guess I just have no need for it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MeSSwKffj9o
That sums it up for me.
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StingingVelvet: I'm not Atheist because they (are supposed to) believe that there is PROOF there is no God, which I think is silly.
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Navagon: At its simplest, it's the absence of belief in a deity. Anyone who doesn't believe in one god or another is an atheist.
I don't think that anyone thinks there's proof there is no god(s) out there somewhere. That would be silly.
Even strong atheism (outright declaring there is no god) does so without evidence. In fact, they reach that conclusion through the lack of evidence for god(s). As it's reasonable to expect there should be some.

If you read Atheist group websites and such they identify strongly with believing there is proof there is no God in my experience. I don't think it is part of the definition in a dictionary, but it is a large part of all the Atheist research I have done myself.
Of course defining these things in strict terms is almost impossible, even the wikipedia entry on Atheism bounces back and forth on just how strong the lack of belief has to be to qualify. I remember on one forum I used to belong to I identified myself as an Atheist in one thread and an agnostic in another and a few people thought that was such a sign of ignorance, but really there are a ton of levels there and it can be hard to precisely calculate between strong agnosticism and Atheism.
In any event, I do believe there is a microscopic chance there are deities, I mean there is no way to say for sure there are not, which is why I would say I am agnostic. The idea of saying there absolutely 100% cannot be any deities is just as silly to me as saying there 100% definately are, even if I think the chances of it are 1 in a million.
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StingingVelvet: If you read Atheist group websites and such they identify strongly with believing there is proof there is no God in my experience.

That's like using PETA to define the animal rights movement. The websites you describe aren't merely atheist, but rather anti-religion. They're often as fanatical as that which they oppose.
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StingingVelvet: I don't think it is part of the definition in a dictionary, but it is a large part of all the Atheist research I have done myself.

Well, if it's a choice between the dictionary definition and the rantings of some extremist website then I'll go with the dictionary. You don't use radical Islamic websites to gain an insight into Islam, do you?
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StingingVelvet: Of course defining these things in strict terms is almost impossible, even the wikipedia entry on Atheism bounces back and forth on just how strong the lack of belief has to be to qualify.

Wikipedia defines both weak and strong atheism. Which can be summarised as 'lacks belief in a god' and 'there is no god' respectively. That may seem like an over simplification. But in reality it's more that people like to over complicate it to make it seem like something it's not. Like the anti-religion websites you mentioned earlier.
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StingingVelvet: I remember on one forum I used to belong to I identified myself as an Atheist in one thread and an agnostic in another and a few people thought that was such a sign of ignorance, but really there are a ton of levels there and it can be hard to precisely calculate between strong agnosticism and Atheism.

Agnosticism is the admission of one's ignorance on the subject. Which is actually a lot less ignorant than thinking you know with certainty. Anyone who identifies with weak atheism or weak theism are essentially agnostic as they're admitting they don't know for sure.
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StingingVelvet: In any event, I do believe there is a microscopic chance there are deities, I mean there is no way to say for sure there are not, which is why I would say I am agnostic.

I see it the same way. Right down to just how microscopic the chances are of something godlike out there. Not interested in us, of course. But something that could meet the criteria for one of the lesser gods we've dreamt up. This is why I see myself as a weak atheist. I'm agnostic. But that's irrelevant as it's a philosophical standpoint. Not a religious one.
Pantheist reporting in!
This thread is pointless. Everyone on the intarwebz is an Atheist.
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Navagon: I see it the same way. Right down to just how microscopic the chances are of something godlike out there. Not interested in us, of course. But something that could meet the criteria for one of the lesser gods we've dreamt up. This is why I see myself as a weak atheist. I'm agnostic. But that's irrelevant as it's a philosophical standpoint. Not a religious one.

Good post, lots to think about there overall. I will read more about "weak" Atheism, see how it gels.
People on GoG calling each other assholes?
What's the world come to!?
Hearing the song again, I will abuse any opportunity to send this link.
There are two insanely great documentaries by Julia Sweeney based on her live shows:
"God Said HA!" and "Letting Go of God" - brilliant stuff if you're open minded.
Also, if you want some real hot discussions, here you go:
http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/
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StingingVelvet: I definately do not believe in any kind of afterlife, I am very strongly against that idea.
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LordCinnamon: Personally I find the idea that everything just ends when you're dead to be so much more comforting than the idea of an afterlife. I also prefer the perspective it gives on life.
But many, many people have disagreed with me on this :p

its weird to think about life just ending and makes me feel very strange. sometimes i wish there was a god.
Non religious here. No offense to all the religious, but in my opinion, religion is nothing more than a way to divide and fight. Some good examples are when religion was taken out of school, the pledge of allegience was removed, or at least the phrase "under God". While I feel everyone is entitled to their own beliefs, or religions, it's those that force their beliefs on you else you're wrong that get to me. In a past experience, I joined a friend at a Christian church on an outting of fun and games. I had nothing better to do so I figured why not. While talking to some of the people there, I became a bit irritated as I was told if I didn't let God into my life, I was living a life of sin and all that good stuff. Which was bull to me, because I've done nobody any wrong, I help others when I can, even those I don't particularly care for. I'm always donating money to causes, scouts, and so on. I'm sure not all churches, or whatever other "social gatherings" for religions would be called would treat someone the same, but, Live and let live, and help somebody if you can is what I live by. Religions just seem to clash and nothing good seems to come from it. Then again, I don't know much about a lot of religions since I have no use for them, this is just based on personal experience and observations. If however there is a religion for how I feel..... That's mine. I'm open minded to many things, but trying to force something onto someone is not the way to get them to join you. As I read on a shirt "come to the dark side, we have cookies" That's short, tells you what the dark side has to offer, and doesn't put you down if you decide not to. HaHaHa Anyways, good to see some other people's opinions on religion.
One quote I truly love is this, I have it on a shirt I bought
You tell me that I sin
You say I'm bound for hell
So once your judgement condemns you
I shall see you there
I cannot remember who wrote it, but I like that little quote.